[REL] FOTRS Ultimate Project

[KaleunMarco]

what is a neutral warship in the context of FOTRSU 8.0, mid-1942 buzzing in/out of the Bonin Islands?
who could possibly be neutral, in the pacific theatre of operations, mid-1942?

[CapnScurvy]

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

what is a neutral warship in the context of FOTRSU 8.0, mid-1942 buzzing in/out of the Bonin Islands?
who could possibly be neutral, in the pacific theatre of operations, mid-1942?

A hospital ship. But it shouldn't be considered a "warship".

[torpedobait]

I understand the team has a preference for a max TC of 2048 as a way to reduce CTD's, etc. However, you have also allowed users to edit the cfg/main file to use a higher TC maximum.

I changed the value in both the base SH4 v1.5 and in the latest FOTARSU in the MOD folder. However, after loading the game this morning and starting a new patrol I was unhappy to find that the max TC is still 2048, even though I verified my changes were still reflected in the main.cfg files. What gives? If you coded it somewhere else I can't find it. It is your project - I get that, but some user preferences should be allowed at the users own risk, no?

Of course, this could also be an operator error on my part. I just can't find it!

UPDATE: Never Mind! I found it in the SH4 file in My Documents. Sorry if I bothered you.

[merc4ulfate]

Originally Posted by CapnScurvy

A hospital ship. But it shouldn't be considered a "warship".

Yes and do not sink them ... you get a Court Martial for it.

[merc4ulfate]

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

seriously, nice comments on the action. i agree with some of what you said in that the enemy's first reaction seems to be to slow down...especially large convoys...of which we don't see too many playing the US side but see a lot of playing "the dark side". sometimes, the merchies slow down to 1 knot or less. that type of behaviour makes it easy to pick them off, if we can evade the escorts...which is a big if when they start shooting torpedos at us (me).

I am seeing plenty of convoys hugging the coast SW of Hokkaido and they are mostly large merchant ships or a mix of Capital Ships and Merchants like last night when I saw the Chitose, Escort carrier, 2 Cruiser and assorted merchants ... no DD.

I am not seeing many DD at all so far. I have seen them slow down to avoid fish but never slow down and stay slow most times a carrier will slow to avoid fish then ramp it up to 11!!! LOL

[J0313]

Originally Posted by merc4ulfate

What is the problem with Type 93 61 cm (24") Torpedoes on surface ships they started using them in 1935? Almost all of the DD and Cruisers of the IJN ships who carried fish had them. They accounted for losses on the United States side of 11 cruisers, 11 destroyers, and one fleet aircraft carrier.


Nothing like dumbing down the mod huh? I really like those ships firing fish at me. It is fun.

Now The Type 95 53.3 cm (21") Torpedoes were assigned for IJN submarines boats.


Many times you only needed one Type 93 to sink a ship where as the Americans had lower yield warheads (357 lbs less) and needed more for each ship ... after they corrected their depth and detonation errors.

It was also very quick to reload for it's size and during the campaign for Guadalcanal Canal they became invaluable against of the American ships. It wasn't until 1943 that the Americans got to see a Type93 and exam it. The Americans had no equal to the Type 93 until 1945.

Stop trying to give me history lessons bro. I have probably forgotten more about ww2 then you know right now. I am only pointing out that some of the older ww1 era torpedo boats and DD's where NEVER fitted with the long lance launchers.

[J0313]

Originally Posted by merc4ulfate

What is the problem with Type 93 61 cm (24") Torpedoes on surface ships they started using them in 1935? Almost all of the DD and Cruisers of the IJN ships who carried fish had them. They accounted for losses on the United States side of 11 cruisers, 11 destroyers, and one fleet aircraft carrier.


Nothing like dumbing down the mod huh? I really like those ships firing fish at me. It is fun.

Now The Type 95 53.3 cm (21") Torpedoes were assigned for IJN submarines boats.


Many times you only needed one Type 93 to sink a ship where as the Americans had lower yield warheads (357 lbs less) and needed more for each ship ... after they corrected their depth and detonation errors.

It was also very quick to reload for it's size and during the campaign for Guadalcanal Canal they became invaluable against of the American ships. It wasn't until 1943 that the Americans got to see a Type93 and exam it. The Americans had no equal to the Type 93 until 1945.

Oh and you forgot to mention that several Jap ships were sunk due to the oxygen igniting after the reloads had been hit by shell fire. I know all about the long lance, twice the warhead size of any fish in any other navy. 40,000 yard range.

[CapnScurvy]

Originally Posted by merc4ulfate

I am seeing plenty of convoys hugging the coast SW of Hokkaido and they are mostly large merchant ships or a mix of Capital Ships and Merchants like last night when I saw the Chitose, Escort carrier, 2 Cruiser and assorted merchants ... no DD.

I am not seeing many DD at all so far. I have seen them slow down to avoid fish but never slow down and stay slow most times a carrier will slow to avoid fish then ramp it up to 11!!! LOL

Japanese escorts for convoys are unrealistic in the Stock SH4 game. Players who think the Japanese followed German or Allied tactics from the Atlantic Theater just don't know their history.....You've been spoiled in thinking Japanese escorts should be with all convoys. They weren't, and neither are they in Fotrs Ultimate.

The "short" history lesson is the Japanese didn't give two hoots for the merchant marine service! Most ships did not travel in convoys as they did in the Atlantic.....one or two maybe, not dozens. The fact that there may have been a couple of ships that were ready to depart together, and their Captain's simply got together before doing so, just to keep each other company. But, nothing formal from the "Emperor" defining required procedures.

Regarding escorts, a merchant might ask for permission to get one from the local Army General (yes Army.....they had power over the Navy) in charge of the particular sector the merchant was traveling through. But, more times than not, he gave no consideration to wasting recourses on the lowly merchants.....you're on your own brother!

Don't expect to find the Japanese warships as capable as the Allies either (or their fellow Germans). They were slow to see the advantage in radar/sonar advances.....they were slow in adopting modern technology all together. Where they did, it was on their Capital ships, not the lower class warships like the Destroyers. those guys were thought of being only a half step above the merchants!!

Don't expect to have the same game as SHIII.....it just wasn't the same enemy.

[propbeanie]

As an addition to what CapnScurvy mentions, we used several sources for our "historical" use of torpedoes and other equipment, including but not limited to

http://www.combinedfleet.com/kaigun.htm

and of note:

http://www.combinedfleet.com/Kuchikukan.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/TokuJunyokan.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/kusentei.htm

in addition to other sites. Now, granted, our "balance" needs adjusting in a few areas. ie: We apparently need more airplanes...

In addition, work is being done on several other aspects as found in "Silent Victory" and others of that ilk, for add-in mods for later... Remember, this is still "beta".

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

As an addition to what CapnScurvy mentions, we used several sources for our "historical" use of torpedoes and other equipment, including but not limited to

http://www.combinedfleet.com/kaigun.htm

and of note:

http://www.combinedfleet.com/Kuchikukan.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/TokuJunyokan.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/kusentei.htm

in addition to other sites. Now, granted, our "balance" needs adjusting in a few areas. ie: We apparently need more airplanes...

In addition, work is being done on several other aspects as found in "Silent Victory" and others of that ilk, for add-in mods for later... Remember, this is still "beta".

every Subsim captain should have this on his bookshelf.

[Front Runner]

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

every Subsim captain should have this on his bookshelf.


"Silent Victory" by Clay Blair, Jr.

......and read it!

[merc4ulfate]

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

every Subsim captain should have this on his bookshelf.

I shall look for this. While I appreciate the New York Times sentiment about the book I find the actually War Reports to be more detailed and "Authoritative" when it comes to submarine action by the americans in the Pacific during World War II.

I recall discussion in years past on the forums concerning things people would like to see in the game especially when they found in life some american Captains had done those thing.

If you would enjoy reading what the american submarines did by way of their captains speaking to you then read these.

U.S. WW II SUBMARINE WAR PATROL REPORTS

[CapnScurvy]

Speaking of reading, here's two studies made after the war by the United States government that brought out the truth about the enemy and their capabilities. Doing a bit of web searching and reading, you should find the same conclusions as I regarding Japan's short sidedness, and the over rated capabilities of their military endeavors.

"Reports of the U.S. Naval Technical Mission To Japan (1945 – 1946)"

and the "US Strategic Bombing Survey – Pacific War"

Both of these studies were from separate viewpoints (one U.S. Navy; the other U.S. Air Force), but both conducted the same kind of investigations into learning what the true capabilities/mindset the Japanese had during the war.

In my opinion, these documents are far more reliable towards being impartial than books written by authors that are doing it for fame, or fortune.

[propbeanie]

This is the one I got: Silent Victory at Amazon paperback, vol 1 & vol 2 in one big mess. If you use it much, it will fall apart on you because it is too big, heavy and bulky... but it is a copy, and definitely readable. Search for it through the SubSim shopping link.

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by CapnScurvy

Speaking of reading, here's two studies made after the war by the United States government that brought out the truth about the enemy and their capabilities. Doing a bit of web searching and reading, you should find the same conclusions as I regarding Japan's short sidedness, and the over rated capabilities of their military endeavors.

"Reports of the U.S. Naval Technical Mission To Japan (1945 – 1946)"

and the "US Strategic Bombing Survey – Pacific War"

Both of these studies were from separate viewpoints (one U.S. Navy; the other U.S. Air Force), but both conducted the same kind of investigations into learning what the true capabilities/mindset the Japanese had during the war.

In my opinion, these documents are far more reliable towards being impartial than books written by authors that are doing it for fame, or fortune.

I've got a different link to that Pacific War Archive, "Technical Mission" and it's not as nice as that one, CapnScurvy. Thanks.