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Old 11-08-2017, 05:59 PM   #1
CDRChance
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Default Pulling me back in... Where to start?

Hey all,

So I played a few patrols of SHIII back when it came out, and I gave SHIV a fling when it came out. I skipped SHV because of all the bad press and because I was deployed doing the "real thing" when it came out. But I'm heading back to a boat next year and I'm feeling like doing some Target Motion Analysis to put a few fish into some targets.

I've been reviewing the subsim boards today (), and I have to admit I'm conflicted and confused. Do I go with SH 3, 4 or 5? Do I go vanilla or download a megamod? Which megamod?

I'm looking for the answer that best meets these goals:
1) A mostly stable and smooth gameplay
2) A relatively simple and easy-to-follow, one-mod-max installation
3) The ability to do manual TMA with plotting ranges and bearings. the three minute rules, and maybe even digging out some mo boards and slide rule
4) top notch graphics so my kids will watch when I put on the big screen
5) Big convoys and merchant traffic that makes sense and is fun to engage

I was leaning towards 5 with Wolves of Steel because of the graphics, but it looks like the TMA is too easy from the few you tube videos I can find, and I'm hesitant to get involved in that whole campaign/tonnage bar bug stuff.

So now I'm leaning towards 4, but I can't figure out what (if any) mods to use. I see lots of recommendations for "TMO" but they're all several years old and I can't even figure what exactly that mod does.

It sounds like I could go back to 3, too, with either GMX or Living SH3, but then I have to make yet another decision! And I feel like I'm missing out on the great graphics, event though that's not the most important thing.

So, if someone has tried all or most of these options and has a pretty good feel for which one meets my goals, please let me know. I'll appreciate it!



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Old 11-08-2017, 10:30 PM   #2
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I've played all three, and I like SH4 the best, but I like the US Fleetboats, not that the German Uboats weren't fine machines, but it feels more "natural" for me to be in a US boat. As for mods, Fall of the Rising Sun Ultimate (FotRSU) is what a group of us are working on now. It's at beta version 0.63, about to progress to 0.something-or-other, with some neat changes coming. The mod is based upon TMO 1.7, but has many additional ships and planes (and subs) added mostly by the AOTD_MadMax team, the authors of the original version, but with contributions from others. I had always liked Fall of the Rising Sun (FotRS) from years ago, but the Ultimate edition has many improvements. Even though it is a beta version, gameplay is more stable than several other mods. Plans are to have a mod number scheme to help designate which mods are known-compatible and could work with FotRSU. No other mod has yet done that. The player will also be able to set their own difficulty level of several aspects of the game. This has not been implemented yet. I think you'd like it, and like most mods, you can choose how much you want to have to do in the Gameplay settings menu, even to the point of not seeing the target on the navigation map. I can't hit a barn like that yet... - course, I won't mention how inaccurate I am with all the bells and whistles turned on, either... FOTRS Ultimate Project - shameless plug from a very opinionated author, of course...

It sounds like you might not have a whole lot of time though to mess around with things, and want to get right into as-realistic-as-possible play with a "finished" product. With that in mind, you might find that you'd like Bleiente's mix of TMO, RSRDC and Optical Targeting Correction (which you wouldn't have to use), which is an add-in mod from CapnScurvy (on the FotRSU team), in which he included a difficulty tweak called "Tokko's Revenge". Bleiente put it all together in Ralles RealModPack for TMO_RSRDC_OTC. A slightly more complicated install, due to the options.

Of course, you can't go wrong with Trigger Maru Overhauled (TMO) v2.5. Of note, there is a Small Patch for TMO, not from the author Ducimus, but it does fix issues with the Tench class boat. Also, be aware that TMO activated with JSGME will delete two German flag files, which do not get restored when the mod is de-activate. Usually, not too much of a problem.

As to getting the kids to watch it on the screen as you play it? Well... my boys think it's "boring"... takes too long for things to develop and all. They do like the explosions though, even if it is ~my~ boat that's blowing up... Here's another thought, buy a 2nd copy for a 2nd computer, have both on a network, and put your boys on the one computer, you on the other. Just take it easy on them for a while though, and don't do what I did, to where I now have to twist their arms to get them to play...

Edit: I neglected to mention JonesSoft Generic Mod Enabler, which is the tool to use to enable the mods above... the user's manual is here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/down...o=file&id=3814
if it's not in the JSGME download...
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:32 PM   #3
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Alright, 4 it is. I also prefer to be on US boats. Now I'm torn between just going with vanilla or TMO 2.5. I think I'd clearly prefer to have an improved game, but the days of me spending a pleasant afternoon fiddling with properties, text files, and settings to get a game to run passed long ago. It's got to be worth it.

I found the manual for TMO 2.5 and I certainly agree with the general concepts, but I'm a bit shaky on what specific changes are essential to gameplay.

If you had to narrow it down to the top 3 things that need to be modded to make the vanilla game more fun, what would they be? And does TMO do those things?

Thanks!
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:01 PM   #4
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Well, since you do mention "Stock"... you cannot go wrong with Webster's Game Fixes Only mod, but done up the way THEBERBSTER envisioned. The first post of his "Beginner's Mod List For SH4 Including Download Link" is the place to go for http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2508558#post2508558. You play that with manual targeting, and I think you'll have the quickest, easiest set-up, and good gameplay also. AKA: GFO (Game Fixes Only), is a collection of little mods, mostly from Webster, that address a bunch of little niggly problems with the game. Read Webster's documentation, and you'll see what all he addressed. THEBERBSTER still kept the options that Webster has in the original package, but now they're set-up in the MODS folder for your use, if you so desire, just so long as you follow THEBERBSTER's instructions in that thread...
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Old 11-09-2017, 05:37 PM   #5
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I second propbeanie's suggestion for GFO. I have also played all three but GFO was the most painless setup following THEBERBSTER's outstanding instructions. For more clarity all my versions are Steam so they take a little more tweaking to run. I have only a handful of CTDs with GFO but most were probably self induced via high TC.
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Old 11-09-2017, 09:22 PM   #6
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TMO is a difficulty mod, not a realism mod. Many, including myself use it in conjunction with RSRDC. TMO by itself makes the enemy AI at the highest level. Try TMOwtw, it has all the changes of TMO without the difficulty way up.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/down...o=file&id=4801
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Old 11-10-2017, 07:49 AM   #7
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I also use GFO, it is very easy to setup and run.
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Old 11-10-2017, 10:48 AM   #8
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Old 11-10-2017, 11:29 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by propbeanie View Post
Of course, you can't go wrong with Trigger Maru Overhauled (TMO) v2.5. Of note, there is a Small Patch for TMO, not from the author Ducimus, but it does fix issues with the Tench class boat.
.............
Small Patch addresses problems with the game selecting a TAMBOR class (not a TENCH class). In TMO.2.5 Ducimus made a nice TAMBOR class boat to be used for the entire War. I wouldn't mind commanding USS Tuna for the entire War, nothing wrong with that, but if you don't, that's what Small Patch addresses.

People report that Small Patch isn't necessary with RSRD over TMO but then you'd be playing RSRD, not TMO. RSRD can be installed over TMO, RFB, or Stock.

Websters Game Fixes Only, GFO mentioned above is a great mod too and people don't suggest it as an option enough.

Lots to choose from.......

Happy Hunting!
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Old 11-10-2017, 03:17 PM   #10
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Sorry 'bout that... - I dunno whatz so difficult about keeping the Tench and Tambor classes in their proper places...
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Old 11-14-2017, 05:00 PM   #11
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RFB and RSRDC, along with a couple other mods for usability, was a good combination for me. Trying to get that to work on a new machine at the moment.

Regarding target motion analysis, when playing before I did the math in a spreadsheet to calculate the motion vector of the target given a few "pings" to determine relative direction and distance to target, treating the sub's position at first reading as the origin point.

On another tab I did more math to calculate the best intercept course given a speed (ahead full being the best choice), allowing you stay out of sight, arrive at a distance ahead of the target (typically around 5NM) and off to the side (depending on target speed, how long it takes the target to cover the 5NM while you creep in at 3kts), so you can submerge, line up, and if you've done it right you can even fire blind at a distance you choose that allows time for the torpedos to arm while minimizing the target's opportunity to evade.

It was fun. Sinking tankers and freighters was getting to be pretty routine. I was still trying to figure out a strategy for convoys.
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Old 11-14-2017, 06:16 PM   #12
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A Warm Welcome To The Subsim Community > CDRChance
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Old 11-14-2017, 07:00 PM   #13
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Default WELCOME TO SUBSIM itaylor57

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