[REL] FOTRS Ultimate Project

[max-peck]

Hey Guys

I have just been going through v0.6 doing some last minute tinkering and have found a few errors in my roster files that may lead you to seeing a ship with no texture at all!

I will be double checking things tonight, and uploading a fixed version to the Masters of the Universe secret drive

If anyone does see a ship with no texture (it will either be all black, or all white) please let me know the ship name and date

Cheers Fellas

[max-peck]

Originally Posted by CapnScurvy

In the Hydrophone/Sonar area, there's not much of a definitive performance specifications as there is with Radar. Sound traveling in water is rated more in decibels than in specific range figures. I offer this site "

The Pacific War Online Encyclopedia". It states: Range was also limited, rarely exceeding 3000 yards (2700m) even under the most favorable conditions. Sonar was generally ineffective at speeds over about 10 knots, requiring "sprint and drift" tactics

By far and away, the detection sensor that really has the edge is the visual! The "Enemy Contact" document reports having lookouts regularly detecting at ranges of 30,000 yards plus!!

This is what has been bothering me with the current build

I have been getting sound contacts long before visual contacts even in perfect weather with calm seas
I thought it felt wrong, but did not have any data to back up my hunch

Glad you are on it Capn

[max-peck]

Who is the mission master?
With 82 pages of development I kind of forget now
Is it Cdrsubron7?

Just spotted a folder structure error in FOTRSUC7AL_Aleutian Missions
You have a double folder thing going on here ie. FOTRSUC7AL_Aleutian Missions is inside 700FOTRSU_Aleutian Missions

Not a problem for me, I know how to deal with a folder structure that is not JSGME friendly

But it may confuse anyone not so familiar with the game, who will them come here to wonder why their Aleutian missions are not appearing in game

Just a friendly heads up

[cdrsubron7]

Originally Posted by max-peck

Who is the mission master?
With 82 pages of development I kind of forget now
Is it Cdrsubron7?

Just spotted a folder structure error in FOTRSUC7AL_Aleutian Missions
You have a double folder thing going on here ie. FOTRSUC7AL_Aleutian Missions is inside 700FOTRSU_Aleutian Missions

Not a problem for me, I know how to deal with a folder structure that is not JSGME friendly

But it may confuse anyone not so familiar with the game, who will them come here to wonder why their Aleutian missions are not appearing in game

Just a friendly heads up

Thanks, max. I will correct this tonight after I get home from work and then re-upload the missions to Area 51.

[max-peck]

And on a completely different note, but pertaining to discussions recently, I am going to go ahead and re-instate the map marker for when an aircraft is within visual range.

I have no idea why it was taken out - and it aggravates the hell out of me

It is not a big deal to do - just editing the air_shp files

We can either make it part of the core - or have it as a separate patch
Really not fussed either way

But I am doing it - because I really hate the way it is setup at the moment

[CapnScurvy]

Max, I've corrected the German ZClass DD that showed no texture in FOTRS. So, you don't need to fix it.

=====================

I'm wondering about the game and its visual aspects. By drilling down the Double R report "Enemy Contacts by U.S. Submarines, 1943 to End of War" its obvious that the overall winner in farthest distance of a detected target went to the visual side of things......at least it did in 1943-1944. Kind of a toss up between Periscope detection, and the ole' lookouts. What I've seen in-game is the fact that a player can't see beyond about 8300 yards (4.3nm). How in the world did the lookouts see 40,000 yards out? That's just under 20nm. I'm suspecting those sightings were a puff of smoke, or a glint in the sun that those guys saw.

I say this because, of a chart I've used to find "How Far is the Horizon"

It seems our distance to the horizon is hazed over, right at the horizon (if you figure that 4.8 nm is the horizon from a 20 ft height), I'd like to change that.

This is TMO's view of Ohau Island, just off Pearl Harbor. This is the first Campaign game mission, with an "at sea" start:



Much like the mission test I've been using (where I'm only able to see about 8000 yards with FOTRS's environment)......where's the island? You can see a reflection in the water, but the "above sea level" part is hazed in.

With a little tweaking of the environment parameters, this is what did:




TMO's Binocular view of the Island:




My view:



(by the way, don't pay attention to the green water of mine. I was just playing with the water color)

Not that I know for sure (I'm just speculating), but FOTRS is probably set up a lot like TMO with its environment.

I'm not entirely sure about this, but I've always heard that the game develops the environment out to 20km (10.8nm) from your sub. Ships are spawned at 35 km, but aren't drawn until they get to to that 20km distance. That's about 22,000 yards. So, I would think a compromise could be reached somewhere in the middle between the 4.3nm of fog we have now and the 10.8 nm that the game is limited to.

What do you guys think?

[s7rikeback]

Originally Posted by cdrsubron7

This one is an exact match. The Haruna Maru.

I have also been using that site to rename all my shipping rosters.
I have also found these resources:

http://archive.hnsa.org/doc/id/oni20.../index.htm#toc

http://www.combinedfleet.com/kaigun.htm (this one is very tempermental with its searching)

http://www.theshipslist.com/ships/lines/nyk.shtml

Great work Everyone - looking really good.

Regards,
s7rikeback.

[cdrsubron7]

Originally Posted by s7rikeback

I have also been using that site to rename all my shipping rosters.
I have also found these resources:

http://archive.hnsa.org/doc/id/oni20.../index.htm#toc

http://www.combinedfleet.com/kaigun.htm (this one is very tempermental with its searching)

http://www.theshipslist.com/ships/lines/nyk.shtml

Great work Everyone - looking really good.

Regards,
s7rikeback.

Thanks.

I've used combinedfleet.com for many years for all kinds of info about the IJN. Very useful tool.

[s7rikeback]

Originally Posted by cdrsubron7

Thanks.

I've used combinedfleet.com for many years for all kinds of info about the IJN. Very useful tool.

I have forgotten this site - http://www.wrecksite.eu/wrecksite.aspx

This helped me to re-align so many ships to their correct usage...

Liner to Troop Transport
Liner to Hospital ship etc...

It also helped me to track down the War Melody and several other IJN & Allied vessels to correct their usage and ownership.. with both stock & RSRD rosters...

Regards,
s7rikeback

[max-peck]

Originally Posted by CapnScurvy

Max, I've corrected the German ZClass DD that showed no texture in FOTRS. So, you don't need to fix it.

Thanks for letting me know Capn

Originally Posted by CapnScurvy

Not that I know for sure (I'm just speculating), but FOTRS is probably set up a lot like TMO with its environment.

I'm not entirely sure about this, but I've always heard that the game develops the environment out to 20km (10.8nm) from your sub. Ships are spawned at 35 km, but aren't drawn until they get to to that 20km distance. That's about 22,000 yards. So, I would think a compromise could be reached somewhere in the middle between the 4.3nm of fog we have now and the 10.8 nm that the game is limited to.

Well I know FOTRS 2.0 is built upon TMO 1.7
I played TMO since before it was overhauled (on and off for about 7 years), back then it was just called Trigger Maru
And I do remember several releases there were severe issues with the detection ranges, that Ducimus then fixed in his next build

Freaky stuff like being shelled by destroyers when your watch crew could not see them, and neither could you
Being able to see a ship clearly with the binocs, but your watch crew being blind
Or conversely your watch crew shouting out a visual contact and not even being able to see a puff of smoke of the top of a mast in that direction

Personally, I think Ducimus went through so many iterations of Trigger Maru just trying to get the sensors to work "just right" in the environment he chose to use

Now - we are building on FOTRS, which was built on TMO 1.7
We are basically using a version of TMO before Ducimus managed to get the right balance between the sensors and the environment
So these aberrations do not surprise me - but I do not have the knowhow to fix them

I looked at the sensors once - and I gotta admit - they are a total frikkin mystery to me

I agree with you that there are things that definitely need to be fixed regarding the sensors and environment

At the moment we just cannot see far enough visually, and it is FUBARING the gameplay (IMHO)

If you think you can fix these issues, I say please go ahead and do so

But please bear in mind two things before you go ahead

1 - RR is our unelected project leader. I think he probably gets the final say

2 - If you change this - then Cdrsubron7's AI Plugins might need to be redone.
Or then again they may not - I just don't know

As I said - the sensor files are totally indecipherable to me

Short version - I vote yes with a few caveats

EDIT - I mistakenly accredited Propbeanie with the AI plugins, seems they actually came from Cdrsubron7
Have changed my post to ficx this
Sorry Cdrsubron7

[propbeanie]

Originally Posted by CapnScurvy

... I'm wondering about the game and its visual aspects ...

... Not that I know for sure (I'm just speculating), but FOTRS is probably set up a lot like TMO with its environment.

I'm not entirely sure about this, but I've always heard that the game develops the environment out to 20km (10.8nm) from your sub. Ships are spawned at 35 km, but aren't drawn until they get to to that 20km distance. That's about 22,000 yards. So, I would think a compromise could be reached somewhere in the middle between the 4.3nm of fog we have now and the 10.8 nm that the game is limited to.

What do you guys think?

The closer to real visual contact distance, the better. If it's possible, I'd like that 20km or 10.8nm distance, but 10.7nm would do...

I'm pretty sure the player would take a performance hit with that, but the game tracks it all anyway, correct?

I remember he listed lots of changes in the Sensors, Environment and AI (along with just about everything else) in the ReadMe files from AOTD_MadMax, and it seems that there's additions from v1.3 to v2.0, so he may have mods on top of mods...
.

[cdrsubron7]

EDIT - I mistakenly accredited Propbeanie with the AI plugins, seems they actually came from Cdrsubron7
Have changed my post to ficx this
Sorry Cdrsubron7

No problemo, pb. Like I said when I posted the new AI levels, they are not written in stone and can be adjusted if necessary.

[max-peck]

Originally Posted by max-peck

Freaky stuff like being shelled by destroyers when your watch crew could not see them, and neither could you
Being able to see a ship clearly with the binocs, but your watch crew being blind
Or conversely your watch crew shouting out a visual contact and not even being able to see a puff of smoke of the top of a mast in that direction

And as a good example of this I just tried a single mission
I had a convoy heading straight toward me

Clear weather

Got the hydrophone contact first - so I could not plot it on the map with any certainty

Got a radar contract on the map about a minute later

Just started to plot it on the map when I get the 'Ship Spotted' warning

Immediately order a crash dive

Whilst I am on my way down the lead destroyers have already started to shell me - so they must have seen me about the same time I saw them

Something seems wrong here

I am hoping the Capn can fix it

[max-peck]

In the 'Some Assembly Required' section
is now 800 Razz Dazz FOTRSU v0.65

Very similar to v0.6
Just fixed a few roster entries, and added meatballs to a few civ skins


At RR - this is the one to roll into the release - I am finally happy with it

[cdrsubron7]

Just a quick head's up for everyone. Only download the FOTRSU700SingleMissions file. It has all of my current missions including the 5 Aleutian missions. Ignore the Aleutian Missions file.