UbiSoft should make a modern naval sim...

LoBlo · 06-17-06, 04:03 PM

Okiedokie...

...So what modern naval combat sims are out there for gamers to play. DW is obviously there and Harpoon 3 has been available for a while (are their any other I'm missing?) However has either of these two games really given the player what they really crave, a game with it all... one with the great graphics, the great platforms, physics and a brillant AI that can surprise the player? DW has made some groundbreaking gameplay and a great sonar model and Harpoon is a very deep game, but many would say that they have not achieved the quality possible in todays gaming capabilities.

That being the case, it seems like its going to take the initiatvie of one of the larger and more experienced game developers to produce the modern naval combat sim that we all crave. UbiSoft has already made a great WWII naval game in SHIII, perhaps it would be the best canidate for producing a game on SHIII caliber, but with modern weapons and platforms. I'ld love to see a modern navy sim with SHII graphics and physics. All it would need is to take the graphics and physics it has created for SHIII, employ a more sophificated sonar and radar model, and create modern platforms and weapons for us to play and it could quiet possibly make one a modern navy sim that everyone has dreamed about.

So... I've put a post on the UbiSoft forums petitioning for them to create a SHIII-ish game but with modern naval units, tatics, and weapons. If you feel the same stop by and post your support.

UbiSoft Forum Thread

lb

Skybird · 06-17-06, 06:55 PM

If you want a complex and high-realism naval sim-game that offers wet Unreal-action with chess-strategy-AI and DW-complexity, combined with Total War-presentation and the multitude of units from SCX and Harpoon - then Ubisoft and other large companies probably are the last ones you want to ask. And you probably ask for too much at the same time anyway.

LoBlo · 06-17-06, 07:02 PM

Nope, I'm asking for SHIII with modern units and weapons and a good physics model.

Actually it would probably be less complex and hard to produce than a good flight simulator.

Shoot for the stars and you could hit the moon.

Sea Demon · 06-17-06, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoBlo

Nope, I'm asking for SHIII with modern units and weapons and a good physics model.

Actually it would probably be less complex and hard to produce than a good flight simulator.

Shoot for the stars and you could hit the moon.

I agree. But if you're looking for a modern naval sim, DW is totally incredible and available. When you upgrade it with LWAMI, it gets even better.

Enigma · 06-17-06, 10:30 PM

DW is alot of things, and I enjoy it. but incredible aint one of them....

Sea Demon · 06-18-06, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enigma

DW is alot of things, and I enjoy it. but incredible aint one of them....

Well we can debate the adjectives describing DW all day long. But I don't know of any other sim that offers the ability to simulate naval platforms above, on, or below the surface in one sim. Other sims/games have great eye-candy, but don't pack in as much in one sim as DW does. Some of us believe that that earns it an "Incredible" label.

LoBlo · 06-18-06, 07:36 AM

Yes, I'm currently playing DW. Its a great game. SCS has really pushed the genre

. However, so much of the game seems a bit amateurish, as if they lack the game programming experience to achieve higher quality programming. Like the way they've stuggled with the physics model, and the lack of some basic AI behaviors. The graphics models range from outstanding models to substandard modeling in the same game. Its currently the best modern navy sim out there today, no doubt, and possibly the best navy sim ever made...but there are numerous things that could be done better. Maybe a more experienced game developer with a proven track record can push the genere to the next level.

UbiSoft is one of them with a proven track-record, other developers would probably be capable as well.

Enigma · 06-19-06, 09:43 PM

Yes, as I said, I do enjoy the game. I just think the room for improvement is vaaaast.

06-19-06, 09:59 PM

After a while...the graphics really started to make the game "old". I'm finding it harder and harder to play...to be honest. Maybe I'm just vain.

But are those graphics the best SCS could come up with? For heaven's sake!

kiwi_2005 · 06-19-06, 11:51 PM

Yeah the graphics are crap in DW, but the gameplay is one of the best for a modern subsim. Maybe they did for many reasons but having not to much eye candy ables ppl with low spec PC's to play the game

Sea Demon · 06-20-06, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoBlo

Maybe a more experienced game developer with a proven track record can push the genere to the next level.

UbiSoft is one of them with a proven track-record, other developers would probably be capable as well.

Sonalysts is not primarily a PC game maker. Go to their website and see all the stuff they do. They don't just do government work either. The game makers from UBIsoft don't do 10% of what Sonalysts accomplishes. And yet Sonalysts produces a game that is by far the best modern naval sim out there. They are darn good at what they do and do indeed have a proven track record with 4 excellent games and community support. I can't say I'm too impressed with UBIsoft's overall support for their games. Nor can I say they are as responsive as Sonalysts have been with their customers.

Yes, SH3 is incredible from many aspects. I really enjoyed playing it. But still, DW is the mainstay on my hard-drive. While SH3 gives you a sense of being a U-Boat captain in WW2 in a very immersive way, DW lets you play modern naval warfare from air units, a surface unit, and submarine units. From both Red and Blue sides. While SH3 is pretty and incredibly immersive, it doesn't pack in as much as DW IMHO. Both are very excellent games though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enigma

I just think the room for improvement is vaaaast.

OK. But I tend to look at it as potential.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

Yeah the graphics are crap in DW

I actually think the graphics are pretty good considering that most of the effort is in the sensor modelling and gameplay areas. Come on Kiwi. Aren't you being overly harsh by saying the graphics are crap?

Speaking of that, how come we didn't hear all this belly-aching over graphics while we were all eagerly anticipating DW's release? There were screenshots available you know. Don't remember any complaining over the graphics back then. :hmm:

Edited to add: Don't you SH3 people come after me or turn this thread into DW vs. SH3.

I'm not knocking your game. I still recommend everyone go out and buy SH3 too. And while DW is my choice, SH3 gave me alot of good times. Both are excellent in their own rights.

Smaragdadler · 06-20-06, 10:33 AM

DW Graphics are superb!!! If you REALY play DW, you know that you look for 98% of time at the STATION DISPLAYS. So, what is WRONG with that? Ever played HARPOON? No?
So better shut up, because you don't know - what #hardcore# is! :p

People who cry about DW-graphics - are just kids, who know only anime-cartoons. They go for the first time in a brothel and complain about the 'BAD VISION'!

Sincerely
LLort Troll

sonar732 · 06-20-06, 12:32 PM

I agree with the concensious that the graphics of DW aren't suppose to be that great. Think about it...Harpoon had little icons on a 2d screen...wait, forgot about the black and white photos. The bread and butter of DW are stations and gameplay people, not to make the graphics look good. Shoot, I was happy with how they gave better explosion graphics compaired to SC.

If you complain about graphics issues, go play Half-Life or somethin'.

joea · 06-20-06, 12:42 PM

Tried the Demo of DW, found it excellent but very involved...manual tdc is about enough for me when I'm not working or studying.

Really the graphics are not bad, the whole point I agree with some here is to model modern sensors and tactics which is rather complex and a whole lot different from WWII. Physics in terms of sea, waves, boat and ship movement (well the aircraft in DW are ummm rather simple, at least the chopper was...first time I flew with a mouse) I can't say except I doubt SHIII is perfect either.

Since SHIII deals with history, immersion and mood are important...DW is based on theory and current stuff so that's another difference. Look at Steel Beasts vs. some of the popular shooters....BF2 for example, you really need a small outfit as Skybird indicated to make a really hardcore sim since the commercial rewards are small. Sad to say but true. WWII has a bit more chance to be both popular and "somewhat" hardcore (SH3 and Il2) just because the tech aspects are simpler and well...no longer secret, (if not always available).

My 2 cents.

bradclark1 · 06-20-06, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

Yeah the graphics are crap in DW, but the gameplay is one of the best for a modern subsim. Maybe they did for many reasons but having not to much eye candy ables ppl with low spec PC's to play the game

Now really, how many people have that low of system specs nowadays?
The panel graphics are OK but the exterior graphics are utter trash. They should have been brought up to snuff.

06-17-06, 04:03 PM	#1
LoBlo Subsim Diehard Join Date: May 2006 Location: Texas! Posts: 971 Downloads: 78 Uploads: 3	UbiSoft should make a modern naval sim... Okiedokie... ...So what modern naval combat sims are out there for gamers to play. DW is obviously there and Harpoon 3 has been available for a while (are their any other I'm missing?) However has either of these two games really given the player what they really crave, a game with it all... one with the great graphics, the great platforms, physics and a brillant AI that can surprise the player? DW has made some groundbreaking gameplay and a great sonar model and Harpoon is a very deep game, but many would say that they have not achieved the quality possible in todays gaming capabilities. That being the case, it seems like its going to take the initiatvie of one of the larger and more experienced game developers to produce the modern naval combat sim that we all crave. UbiSoft has already made a great WWII naval game in SHIII, perhaps it would be the best canidate for producing a game on SHIII caliber, but with modern weapons and platforms. I'ld love to see a modern navy sim with SHII graphics and physics. All it would need is to take the graphics and physics it has created for SHIII, employ a more sophificated sonar and radar model, and create modern platforms and weapons for us to play and it could quiet possibly make one a modern navy sim that everyone has dreamed about. So... I've put a post on the UbiSoft forums petitioning for them to create a SHIII-ish game but with modern naval units, tatics, and weapons. If you feel the same stop by and post your support. UbiSoft Forum Thread lb __________________ "Seek not to offend or annoy... only to speak the truth"-a wise man Last edited by LoBlo; 06-17-06 at 04:07 PM.

06-17-06, 06:55 PM	#2
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,613 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	If you want a complex and high-realism naval sim-game that offers wet Unreal-action with chess-strategy-AI and DW-complexity, combined with Total War-presentation and the multitude of units from SCX and Harpoon - then Ubisoft and other large companies probably are the last ones you want to ask. And you probably ask for too much at the same time anyway. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

06-17-06, 07:02 PM	#3
LoBlo Subsim Diehard Join Date: May 2006 Location: Texas! Posts: 971 Downloads: 78 Uploads: 3	Nope, I'm asking for SHIII with modern units and weapons and a good physics model. Actually it would probably be less complex and hard to produce than a good flight simulator. Shoot for the stars and you could hit the moon. __________________ "Seek not to offend or annoy... only to speak the truth"-a wise man Last edited by LoBlo; 06-17-06 at 07:06 PM.

06-17-06, 10:30 PM	#5
Enigma The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: At comms depth, obviously. Posts: 1,476 Downloads: 7 Uploads: 0	DW is alot of things, and I enjoy it. but incredible aint one of them.... __________________ "Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it." -Mark Twain

06-18-06, 07:36 AM	#7
LoBlo Subsim Diehard Join Date: May 2006 Location: Texas! Posts: 971 Downloads: 78 Uploads: 3	Yes, I'm currently playing DW. Its a great game. SCS has really pushed the genre . However, so much of the game seems a bit amateurish, as if they lack the game programming experience to achieve higher quality programming. Like the way they've stuggled with the physics model, and the lack of some basic AI behaviors. The graphics models range from outstanding models to substandard modeling in the same game. Its currently the best modern navy sim out there today, no doubt, and possibly the best navy sim ever made...but there are numerous things that could be done better. Maybe a more experienced game developer with a proven track record can push the genere to the next level. UbiSoft is one of them with a proven track-record, other developers would probably be capable as well. __________________ "Seek not to offend or annoy... only to speak the truth"-a wise man Last edited by LoBlo; 06-18-06 at 07:59 AM.

06-19-06, 09:43 PM	#8
Enigma The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: At comms depth, obviously. Posts: 1,476 Downloads: 7 Uploads: 0	Yes, as I said, I do enjoy the game. I just think the room for improvement is vaaaast. __________________ "Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it." -Mark Twain

06-19-06, 09:59 PM	#9
Kurushio Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	After a while...the graphics really started to make the game "old". I'm finding it harder and harder to play...to be honest. Maybe I'm just vain. But are those graphics the best SCS could come up with? For heaven's sake!

06-19-06, 11:51 PM	#10
kiwi_2005 Eternal Patrol Join Date: May 2004 Location: Aeoteroa Posts: 7,382 Downloads: 223 Uploads: 1	Yeah the graphics are crap in DW, but the gameplay is one of the best for a modern subsim. Maybe they did for many reasons but having not to much eye candy ables ppl with low spec PC's to play the game __________________ RIP kiwi_2005 Those who can't laugh at themselves leave the job to others.

06-20-06, 10:33 AM	#12
Smaragdadler XO Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Thuringia Posts: 429 Downloads: 16 Uploads: 0	DW Graphics are superb!!! If you REALY play DW, you know that you look for 98% of time at the STATION DISPLAYS. So, what is WRONG with that? Ever played HARPOON? No? So better shut up, because you don't know - what #hardcore# is! :p People who cry about DW-graphics - are just kids, who know only anime-cartoons. They go for the first time in a brothel and complain about the 'BAD VISION'! Sincerely LLort Troll Last edited by Smaragdadler; 06-20-06 at 10:46 AM.

06-20-06, 12:32 PM	#13
sonar732 The Old Man Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Central MO Posts: 1,562 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	I agree with the concensious that the graphics of DW *aren't* suppose to be that great. Think about it...Harpoon had little icons on a 2d screen...wait, forgot about the black and white photos. The bread and butter of DW are stations and gameplay people, not to make the graphics look good. Shoot, I was happy with how they gave better explosion graphics compaired to SC. If you complain about graphics issues, go play Half-Life or somethin'.

06-20-06, 12:42 PM	#14
joea Silent Hunter Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: At periscope depth in Lake Geneva Posts: 3,512 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	Tried the Demo of DW, found it excellent but very involved...manual tdc is about enough for me when I'm not working or studying. Really the graphics are not bad, the whole point I agree with some here is to model modern sensors and tactics which is rather complex and a whole lot different from WWII. Physics in terms of sea, waves, boat and ship movement (well the aircraft in DW are ummm rather simple, at least the chopper was...first time I flew with a mouse) I can't say except I doubt SHIII is perfect either. Since SHIII deals with history, immersion and mood are important...DW is based on theory and current stuff so that's another difference. Look at Steel Beasts vs. some of the popular shooters....BF2 for example, you really need a small outfit as Skybird indicated to make a really hardcore sim since the commercial rewards are small. Sad to say but true. WWII has a bit more chance to be both popular and "somewhat" hardcore (SH3 and Il2) just because the tech aspects are simpler and well...no longer secret, (if not always available). My 2 cents. Last edited by joea; 06-20-06 at 03:40 PM.