Torpedo Doctrine under LWAMI

Stretch · 02-02-06, 03:40 PM

I've been looking for info on launch depth vs. run depth/torpedo speed, etc.

I could not find this in the LWAMI read me and I know through various versions of Sub Command and DW these things have been adjusted. I don't know what is the doctrine for the below version of DW.

Under DW 1.03 Beta with LWAMI 3.0 Beta, can someone answer these questions

When launched, does a torpedo stay at Own Ship (OW) depth until activating then go to run depth, or go to set run depth immediately?

Torpedo speed. If set at 35 knots does the fish accelerate to 55 knots when active?

Thanks!

Molon Labe · 02-03-06, 12:10 AM

I'm pretty sure that LW/Ami does not make any changes regarding the depths torpedoes run at after launch and go to when enabled.

Stretch · 02-03-06, 09:42 AM

Thanks for the reply. There have been a few changes in the past, now I can't remember how it is set up now.

Nikita · 02-03-06, 03:34 PM

BTW, does AI use wire guidance? In LWAMI and original game.

Molon Labe · 02-04-06, 01:38 AM

I've never seen an AI torp resteered.

LuftWolf · 02-06-06, 03:02 PM

The only edits to the torpedo doctrine that relate to the way human launched torpedoes behave up to LWAMI 3.00b has been the removal of a bad variable left over from Sub Command that prevented the torpedo from beginning to search properly again after losing its track, ie "straight running torpedo syndrome".

Amizaur is working on extensive changes to the torpedo doctrines for LWAMI 3.xx, however, the work on this has been complicated by certain aspects of the physics engine that need to be stabilized in the version that hopefully will be/has been released today, DW 1.03.

Right now, all torpedoes fired will stay at their preset speeds for their whole run, and will run at their launch depth until activated at which time they will go to their set depth and search.

Bellman · 02-07-06, 12:50 AM

I sorely miss Toms torp mod from SCX and wonder whether we will ever see anything similar in DW ?

The ability to implement changes on the run between Search Depth and Preset Depth opened up tactical options.
Also the accelerate/decelerate option could now additionaly permit change of active/passive roles.

LuftWolf · 02-07-06, 12:55 AM

Amizaur is working on creating a complete set of doctrine mods for each individual torpedo that can be fired by a playable platform.

It's very complex work, so it will probably have to wait until 3.01 to be included, but it will completely rework each torpedo's behavior individually, with plenty of room for expansion in the future.

The long and the short of it is that actual torpedo physics will come into play, eg deeper equals slower and shorter.

And much much more...

Bellman · 02-07-06, 01:51 AM

Magic !

''And much much more... ''

:|\

Molon Labe · 02-07-06, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bellman

I sorely miss Toms torp mod from SCX and wonder whether we will ever see anything similar in DW ?

The ability to implement changes on the run between Search Depth and Preset Depth opened up tactical options.
Also the accelerate/decelerate option could now additionaly permit change of active/passive roles.

I probably miss this feature more than anything else. Seems like every time I play I want to be able to use this feature tactically, but we don't have it...

Amizaur · 02-07-06, 10:20 AM

Well... by the way sorry for being unavailable for a time, I was little buzy... New torpedo mods include speed-up after enable among many other features, but not depth changes. It's very easy to implement but I can't use Toms way of depth management without his permission. I have some ideas for even more detailed speed/depth/mode control, but it won't be easy to use... could even lead to completly lose control over torpedo for non advanced user that get lost in managing different torpedo modes... maybe I should make alternate version with advanced controls for anyone to use if he wants additional options.
Now I have to make some changes to basic torpedo mods and send them to Luftwolf. Of course I can relase them separatrely too, but they aren't stand-alone mods unfortunately, there is separate doctrine for every playable torpedo (with it's performance data) and have to be assigned to torpedo in DWEdit.

I wonder if bug with torpedo range is fixed in final patch, I can compensate this in database and doctrines but would have to know which ranges use (normal or correcting) with new patch... It was trivial bug so I hope it's fixed and it was probably sign of new feature being implemented in game engine by SCS, now range of every torpedo should depend somehow on torpedo speed even in stock game

. We'll know today I hope

Molon Labe · 02-07-06, 10:56 AM

Get permission! It's important to have a depth feature to fully take advantage of underwater terrain!

Amizaur · 02-07-06, 11:04 AM

Would you be so kind and ask him...?

Or maybe there are other ways of enabling "depth change" mode than enable - preenable sequence ? Any ideas ? Hmm maybe I could use multiple use of only one button (for example 3 times enable or 3 times preenable in one second intervals), have to check this.

Bellman · 02-07-06, 11:15 AM

Amizaur thanks for your update of WIP.

:|\

The depth control thing is so important - the current constraints are highly unrealistic. It would be a great selective option.
Multiple pushes of a single button would be no problem as it would be easy to keep tally of progress - possibly easier
than the previous SCX method.

Is there any chance that someone might contact Tom for his agreement ?

Amizaur · 02-07-06, 11:29 AM

FWIK there is no contact with Tom

but maybe other SCX/DWX members know something more ?
I'll try to find another way of ordering depth changes... Now where do I write about what exactly pressing Enable or Preenable does from doctrine point of view ?? I have noted it somwhere but where...? Some variable is set IIRC... Preenable ---> Runtoenable set to -1 ? Maybe I could store this information somwhere else and use this variable for detecting multiple "preenable" clicks. Will try.

edit: OK I know

RuntoEnable at start = set runtoenable value in meters
then
click on "Enable" button ----> RuntoEnable = 0
click on "Preenable" button -----> RuntoEnable = -1

now knowing this one can plan some evil way of torpedo control...

P.S. If only changing PreenableCourse from doctrine level updated Heading value displayed on fire control screen... life would be so easier... now it doesn't

02-02-06, 03:40 PM	#1
Stretch Nub Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 3 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Torpedo Doctrine under LWAMI I've been looking for info on launch depth vs. run depth/torpedo speed, etc. I could not find this in the LWAMI read me and I know through various versions of Sub Command and DW these things have been adjusted. I don't know what is the doctrine for the below version of DW. Under DW 1.03 Beta with LWAMI 3.0 Beta, can someone answer these questions When launched, does a torpedo stay at Own Ship (OW) depth until activating then go to run depth, or go to set run depth immediately? Torpedo speed. If set at 35 knots does the fish accelerate to 55 knots when active? Thanks!

02-03-06, 12:10 AM	#2
Molon Labe Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Along the Watchtower Posts: 3,810 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 5	I'm pretty sure that LW/Ami does not make any changes regarding the depths torpedoes run at after launch and go to when enabled. __________________

02-04-06, 01:38 AM	#5
Molon Labe Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Along the Watchtower Posts: 3,810 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 5	I've never seen an AI torp resteered. __________________

02-06-06, 03:02 PM	#6
LuftWolf Ocean Warrior Join Date: May 2005 Location: Free New York Posts: 3,167 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	The only edits to the torpedo doctrine that relate to the way human launched torpedoes behave up to LWAMI 3.00b has been the removal of a bad variable left over from Sub Command that prevented the torpedo from beginning to search properly again after losing its track, ie "straight running torpedo syndrome". Amizaur is working on extensive changes to the torpedo doctrines for LWAMI 3.xx, however, the work on this has been complicated by certain aspects of the physics engine that need to be stabilized in the version that hopefully will be/has been released today, DW 1.03. Right now, all torpedoes fired will stay at their preset speeds for their whole run, and will run at their launch depth until activated at which time they will go to their set depth and search. __________________ LW

02-07-06, 12:50 AM	#7
Bellman Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,945 Downloads: 220 Uploads: 0	I sorely miss Toms torp mod from SCX and wonder whether we will ever see anything similar in DW ? The ability to implement changes on the run between Search Depth and Preset Depth opened up tactical options. Also the accelerate/decelerate option could now additionaly permit change of active/passive roles. __________________ Liberty, Equality, Fraternity

02-03-06, 09:42 AM	#3
Stretch Nub Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 3 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Thanks for the reply. There have been a few changes in the past, now I can't remember how it is set up now.

02-03-06, 03:34 PM	#4
Nikita Electrician's Mate Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Under the sea Posts: 140 Downloads: 119 Uploads: 0	BTW, does AI use wire guidance? In LWAMI and original game.

02-07-06, 12:55 AM	#8
LuftWolf Ocean Warrior Join Date: May 2005 Location: Free New York Posts: 3,167 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Amizaur is working on creating a complete set of doctrine mods for each individual torpedo that can be fired by a playable platform. It's very complex work, so it will probably have to wait until 3.01 to be included, but it will completely rework each torpedo's behavior individually, with plenty of room for expansion in the future. The long and the short of it is that actual torpedo physics will come into play, eg deeper equals slower and shorter. And much much more... __________________ LW

02-07-06, 01:51 AM	#9
Bellman Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,945 Downloads: 220 Uploads: 0	Magic ! ''And much much more... '' :\|\ __________________ Liberty, Equality, Fraternity

02-07-06, 10:20 AM	#11
Amizaur Sonar Guy Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Poland Posts: 398 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Well... by the way sorry for being unavailable for a time, I was little buzy... New torpedo mods include speed-up after enable among many other features, but not depth changes. It's very easy to implement but I can't use Toms way of depth management without his permission. I have some ideas for even more detailed speed/depth/mode control, but it won't be easy to use... could even lead to completly lose control over torpedo for non advanced user that get lost in managing different torpedo modes... maybe I should make alternate version with advanced controls for anyone to use if he wants additional options. Now I have to make some changes to basic torpedo mods and send them to Luftwolf. Of course I can relase them separatrely too, but they aren't stand-alone mods unfortunately, there is separate doctrine for every playable torpedo (with it's performance data) and have to be assigned to torpedo in DWEdit. I wonder if bug with torpedo range is fixed in final patch, I can compensate this in database and doctrines but would have to know which ranges use (normal or correcting) with new patch... It was trivial bug so I hope it's fixed and it was probably sign of new feature being implemented in game engine by SCS, now range of every torpedo should depend somehow on torpedo speed even in stock game . We'll know today I hope

02-07-06, 10:56 AM	#12
Molon Labe Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Along the Watchtower Posts: 3,810 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 5	Get permission! It's important to have a depth feature to fully take advantage of underwater terrain! __________________

02-07-06, 11:04 AM	#13
Amizaur Sonar Guy Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Poland Posts: 398 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Would you be so kind and ask him...? Or maybe there are other ways of enabling "depth change" mode than enable - preenable sequence ? Any ideas ? Hmm maybe I could use multiple use of only one button (for example 3 times enable or 3 times preenable in one second intervals), have to check this.

02-07-06, 11:15 AM	#14
Bellman Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,945 Downloads: 220 Uploads: 0	Amizaur thanks for your update of WIP. :\|\ The depth control thing is so important - the current constraints are highly unrealistic. It would be a great selective option. Multiple pushes of a single button would be no problem as it would be easy to keep tally of progress - possibly easier than the previous SCX method. Is there any chance that someone might contact Tom for his agreement ? __________________ Liberty, Equality, Fraternity

02-07-06, 11:29 AM	#15
Amizaur Sonar Guy Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Poland Posts: 398 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	FWIK there is no contact with Tom but maybe other SCX/DWX members know something more ? I'll try to find another way of ordering depth changes... Now where do I write about what exactly pressing Enable or Preenable does from doctrine point of view ?? I have noted it somwhere but where...? Some variable is set IIRC... Preenable ---> Runtoenable set to -1 ? Maybe I could store this information somwhere else and use this variable for detecting multiple "preenable" clicks. Will try. edit: OK I know RuntoEnable at start = set runtoenable value in meters then click on "Enable" button ----> RuntoEnable = 0 click on "Preenable" button -----> RuntoEnable = -1 now knowing this one can plan some evil way of torpedo control... P.S. If only changing PreenableCourse from doctrine level updated Heading value displayed on fire control screen... life would be so easier... now it doesn't