The game model mostly needs...

Deathblow · 12-28-05, 08:09 PM

Which addition to the game would incur the most improvement to the game model.

Personally I like launch transients myself. Too many times I've had Kilos and Akulas 5km off my port launching waves and waves of missiles and my sonar is none the wisers.... a pretty gross misrepresentation in the game model IMHO... is pretty much a downer in the gameplay.

Pigfish · 12-28-05, 08:38 PM

Geez you need an "all of the above" catagory.

If I had to select it would be more helo control with the FFG.

Molon Labe · 12-29-05, 04:06 AM

The LW/Ami mod takes care of 90% of the launch transient issue, so I went with helo control.

Bellman · 12-29-05, 04:32 AM

As a bubblehead, I liked the improved torp control of SCX11, so that gets my vote.

Bellman · 12-29-05, 04:34 AM

ML and Pigfish - great sigs.

:|\

Any other new ones out there ? Got to beat that Penguin Slapper and the Killer Mog.

Sea Demon · 12-29-05, 04:47 AM

I would love to have better control of the helo's. Being able to order it to use dipping sonar would be nice.

BTW, a little off-topic, but I made one of those Sonar Visual Aid's there Bellman. Very useful.

Great idea.

Sea Demon

goldorak · 12-29-05, 05:44 AM

I'm amazed you didn't include the submarine cheat of not being detected by radar when the masts are out or when the sail is over the water.
This has to be fixed at all costs because the p-3 looses the ability to use its mad/sad sensor at low altitude (can't detect subs on surface because of sam danger) and can't use long range radar to detect surfaced masts.
At this rate over 50% of the effectiveness of the p-3 goes out the window.
Now I understand that most of you are bubbleheads and so don't give a damn about the p-3, but right now if there is one thing that has to be fixed is this problem.
The p-3 right now is the most penalized (because of these bugs/cheats) unit in DW.

Deathblow · 12-29-05, 07:42 AM

I'm not a multiplayer, so I've never really thought about that cheat too much. The AI seems to respond to surface subs appropriately, though MP is still a problem I gather.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pigfish

Geez you need an "all of the above" catagory

hehe, left that off on purpose, because it would be too easy a choice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molon Labe

The LW/Ami mod takes care of 90% of the launch transient issue

Still very broken IMHO.

Molon Labe · 12-29-05, 07:44 AM

Several bubbleheads have been wanting detectable masts.

And considering the detection ranges of buoys in stock DW, I don't think the P-3 got shorted much. They pretty much clean house in MP games.

XabbaRus · 12-29-05, 08:19 AM

Better Helo control on the FFG. At the moment you can't tell it to change altitude/speed, use dipping sonar.

Though I think SCS are looking at this for the future. Fingers crossed.

Then detectable masts and very importantly the ability for the AI aircraft and ships to detect masts too AND a semi submerged sub with just the sail poking throuigh the water.

Deathblow · 01-03-06, 10:14 PM

I have to throw another vote in for launch transits. This is a really frustrating piece of the game mechanic for me.

I had a Kilo not 5nm off my starboard that was launching Starfish, after Starfish, after Starfish at me and I was none the wiser where the torps were coming from. Everytime I evaded a torp another one would drop outta the air. I assumed that it was a Helo or P3, but after finally getting blown outta the water and replaying the mission it turned out to be a Kilo not 5nm from me

.

Come on..... this just isn't right, missile launches need a transient consquences.

Kazuaki Shimazaki II · 01-04-06, 01:23 AM

I selected launch transients as well - it'd be nice to get a "Target is flooding tubes" warning too.

But in the longer (perhaps very long) term...

Manevering
What I REALLY want is better depth controls, including the use of the depth planes and even a ballast control panel for all the subs you can access off the left side. Yes, I know that this is a tactics sim so we can't have everything, but we already have manual rudder control and I saw people complaining that the COW is conservative with his angles, which makes it difficult to crash dive. And the workarounds required to botom the boat. Let US decide how fast we wanna dive. We can always select Autocrew if we don't want to.

Next up is perhaps manual RPM and pitch control. You can implement that on the FFG right away simply by making those numbers clickable and a little shuffle on the other panels will make those numbers available too. It would also open up at least one possibility of deception tactics - there will be several solutions of RPM and pitch for a certain speed, and you can use that to screw the DEMON analyzer on an opposing sub. We may also be able to implement the "Do not cavitate" or "Cavitate" orders that way, which I suspect have to do with how the props pitch and RPM are handled for better acceleration or for best noncavitation.

Sonar
Maybe implement some of the new options available in the FFG-7. At the very least, give us a "Array Depth" readout so we don't have to guess, followed by the new Active Sonar modes.

P.S. Weapons
I understand the Americans have a MOSS and the Russians have MG-74 through MG-114 series of torpedo sized decoys. Could we implement something like that eventually to provide our own false targets?

bubblehd647 · 01-04-06, 08:55 AM

Transients and active showing up on the PBB. Also an "Emergency deep" order for subs. SH3 has a crash dive order and I was surprised when I found DW didn't have a similar setup.

Kazuaki Shimazaki II · 01-04-06, 09:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bubblehd647

Transients and active showing up on the PBB. Also an "Emergency deep" order for subs. SH3 has a crash dive order and I was surprised when I found DW didn't have a similar setup.

Transients I understand, but active sonar? What's wrong with using the dedicated receiver for that? If you believe the game, the sonars are out of the frequency sensitivity of the ordinary broadband sonar which only goes to 2000Hz...

Idea: Maybe you could try doing it yourself with
http://www.subguru.com/DW_missions/DWEdit-1-1-22-1.zip

Try changing the maximum frequency of your Passive Sphere array to 20000. I hadn't tried it, but it might work...

SaxMan · 01-04-06, 12:21 PM

Got DW right before Christmas, and oh what fun it is to drive the OHP....

I think there's been something missing all along, since Jane's 688i. When I fire a wire-guided torpedo, and it runs to its enable point.....it should send back information like "I'm homing on something" (when it finds a target) and "I've lost what I was homing on" (if it has been homing and has now lost the target). Otherwise it's nearly impossible to tell that the weapon has missed it's target.

I have no first hand information but I can't believe there isn't something like this in real life.

View Poll Results: What would improve the game model/gameplay most noticeably?
Addition of sonar launch transients (to be able to detect those missile slinging subs right off your bow)	25	35.21%
Better Torp wireguidance input (changing speed, depth, active/passive for torps in transit thru the wire)	10	14.08%
Better FFG Helo control (dipping sonar, active/passive, torp settings)	29	40.85%
None of the above	7	9.86%
Voters: 71. You may not vote on this poll

12-28-05, 08:09 PM	#1
Deathblow Captain Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 518 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	The game model mostly needs... Which addition to the game would incur the most improvement to the game model. Personally I like launch transients myself. Too many times I've had Kilos and Akulas 5km off my port launching waves and waves of missiles and my sonar is none the wisers.... a pretty gross misrepresentation in the game model IMHO... is pretty much a downer in the gameplay.

12-28-05, 08:38 PM	#2
Pigfish Engineer Join Date: May 2003 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 207 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Geez you need an "all of the above" catagory. If I had to select it would be more helo control with the FFG. __________________

12-29-05, 04:06 AM	#3
Molon Labe Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Along the Watchtower Posts: 3,810 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 5	The LW/Ami mod takes care of 90% of the launch transient issue, so I went with helo control. __________________

12-29-05, 04:32 AM	#4
Bellman Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,945 Downloads: 220 Uploads: 0	As a bubblehead, I liked the improved torp control of SCX11, so that gets my vote. __________________ Liberty, Equality, Fraternity

12-29-05, 04:34 AM	#5
Bellman Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 1,945 Downloads: 220 Uploads: 0	ML and Pigfish - great sigs. :\|\ Any other new ones out there ? Got to beat that Penguin Slapper and the Killer Mog. __________________ Liberty, Equality, Fraternity

12-29-05, 04:47 AM	#6
Sea Demon Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: USA Posts: 2,552 Downloads: 33 Uploads: 0	I would love to have better control of the helo's. Being able to order it to use dipping sonar would be nice. BTW, a little off-topic, but I made one of those Sonar Visual Aid's there Bellman. Very useful. Great idea. Sea Demon

12-29-05, 05:44 AM	#7
goldorak Admiral Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,320 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I'm amazed you didn't include the submarine cheat of not being detected by radar when the masts are out or when the sail is over the water. This has to be fixed at all costs because the p-3 looses the ability to use its mad/sad sensor at low altitude (can't detect subs on surface because of sam danger) and can't use long range radar to detect surfaced masts. At this rate over 50% of the effectiveness of the p-3 goes out the window. Now I understand that most of you are bubbleheads and so don't give a damn about the p-3, but right now if there is one thing that has to be fixed is this problem. The p-3 right now is the most penalized (because of these bugs/cheats) unit in DW.

12-29-05, 07:44 AM	#9
Molon Labe Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Along the Watchtower Posts: 3,810 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 5	Several bubbleheads have been wanting detectable masts. And considering the detection ranges of buoys in stock DW, I don't think the P-3 got shorted much. They pretty much clean house in MP games. __________________

12-29-05, 08:19 AM	#10
XabbaRus Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,330 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Better Helo control on the FFG. At the moment you can't tell it to change altitude/speed, use dipping sonar. Though I think SCS are looking at this for the future. Fingers crossed. Then detectable masts and very importantly the ability for the AI aircraft and ships to detect masts too AND a semi submerged sub with just the sail poking throuigh the water. __________________

01-03-06, 10:14 PM	#11
Deathblow Captain Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 518 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I have to throw another vote in for launch transits. This is a really frustrating piece of the game mechanic for me. I had a Kilo not 5nm off my starboard that was launching Starfish, after Starfish, after Starfish at me and I was none the wiser where the torps were coming from. Everytime I evaded a torp another one would drop outta the air. I assumed that it was a Helo or P3, but after finally getting blown outta the water and replaying the mission it turned out to be a Kilo not 5nm from me . Come on..... this just isn't right, missile launches need a transient consquences.

01-04-06, 01:23 AM	#12
Kazuaki Shimazaki II Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,140 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	I selected launch transients as well - it'd be nice to get a "Target is flooding tubes" warning too. But in the longer (perhaps very long) term... Manevering What I REALLY want is better depth controls, including the use of the depth planes and even a ballast control panel for all the subs you can access off the left side. Yes, I know that this is a tactics sim so we can't have everything, but we already have manual rudder control and I saw people complaining that the COW is conservative with his angles, which makes it difficult to crash dive. And the workarounds required to botom the boat. Let US decide how fast we wanna dive. We can always select Autocrew if we don't want to. Next up is perhaps manual RPM and pitch control. You can implement that on the FFG right away simply by making those numbers clickable and a little shuffle on the other panels will make those numbers available too. It would also open up at least one possibility of deception tactics - there will be several solutions of RPM and pitch for a certain speed, and you can use that to screw the DEMON analyzer on an opposing sub. We may also be able to implement the "Do not cavitate" or "Cavitate" orders that way, which I suspect have to do with how the props pitch and RPM are handled for better acceleration or for best noncavitation. Sonar Maybe implement some of the new options available in the FFG-7. At the very least, give us a "Array Depth" readout so we don't have to guess, followed by the new Active Sonar modes. P.S. Weapons I understand the Americans have a MOSS and the Russians have MG-74 through MG-114 series of torpedo sized decoys. Could we implement something like that eventually to provide our own false targets?

01-04-06, 08:55 AM	#13
bubblehd647 Watch Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Brandon, FL Posts: 18 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Transients and active showing up on the PBB. Also an "Emergency deep" order for subs. SH3 has a crash dive order and I was surprised when I found DW didn't have a similar setup. __________________ ET1/SS (SSN 647, SSN 676)

01-04-06, 12:21 PM	#15
SaxMan Swabbie Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 14 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Got DW right before Christmas, and oh what fun it is to drive the OHP.... I think there's been something missing all along, since Jane's 688i. When I fire a wire-guided torpedo, and it runs to its enable point.....it should send back information like "I'm homing on something" (when it finds a target) and "I've lost what I was homing on" (if it has been homing and has now lost the target). Otherwise it's nearly impossible to tell that the weapon has missed it's target. I have no first hand information but I can't believe there isn't something like this in real life.