New weapon(s) for SSN21 ?

[wong tat]

will there be new weapon(s) for Seawolf SSN21
e.g. tropedo fired via missile , just like the Akula owned
to have more choices other than Mk48 ?

[LuftWolf]

wong,

The US has been taking SUBROCS off of their submarines because they were designed for a time when submarines were much less quiet, and you needed to have standoff capability for convergence zone contacts. In fact, the US Navy had a nuclear version of the SUBROC in the 60's/70's that was stand equipment, I believe, for SSN's.

Now that SSN's typically detect eachother well under effective SUBROC range, the US Navy feels they are not worth the space they take up on the submarines.

The Russians have a fundamentally different submarine design and operations theory, so they retain their SUBROCS.

[SeaQueen]

Originally Posted by wong tat

will there be new weapon(s) for Seawolf SSN21
e.g. tropedo fired via missile , just like the Akula owned
to have more choices other than Mk48 ?

Probably not. The Russians have been more innovative than the US in the area of submarine weaponry. The Sealance never quite managed to deliver all that was promised so they canceled it. These days, it's not clear that it'd be useful for a submarine anyhow. Before that was the SUBROC, but that was nuclear armed. The idea was that you wouldn't really have to localize a target all that much. There was also a nuclear torpeado at one point called the ASTOR. There's actually a lot I wish I knew about the story. Apparently at one point, a group of people started voicing concern that the ADCAP wasn't all it was cracked up to be, so there was a movement to redeploy nuclear torpedos. The submariners didn't want them, though. I guess all that is gone now.

Right now the biggies for the US are upgrading the SLMM, UUVs, UAVs and the ASDS. They also are working on the ADCAP to make it better in shallow water.

[LuftWolf]

This is a really interesting expert position statement for those of you interested in discussions along this line.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...r/h970318n.htm

[Sea Demon]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

This is a really interesting expert position statement for those of you interested in discussions along this line.

Interesting read. But I take any of this with a grain of salt. Norman Polmar says there has been virtually no "front-end" innovations in American submarines. That's actually quite laughable. The U.S. has been improving Mk-48 ADCAP technology non-stop. It is one of the best, if not the best torpedo in the world. I wonder what Norman would have to say about the guidance and control Mods and torpedo propulsion mods that have been added through multiple block versions. What about the improved performance in Software Block 3? What about the Block 4 that added significant capabilities in software algorithms and enhanced other electronics. What about the technologies being incorporated into CBASS? I hear there are plans into Block 7 to begin developing a new generation torpedo? "No innovation" ?!?! That is just........ignorant.

Look at the Tomahawk Block 1's as compared to what Tomahawk is now with the Tactical Tomahawk. Tomahawks can now be used as loitering recon vehicles, can re-target, has capabilities to carry high-energy weapons to fry land or ship based electronics. And Tomahawk now has jamming and incredibly low RCS for survivability. And not just improvements in weapons. Everywhere you look, there are continual improvements in acoustic quieting and sensor upgrades in American subs as well.

All in all, this speech by Polmar looks to be old (1997?). The same kind of overblown 'fright' speeches were being made in regards to keeping funding alive for F-22/ F-35 programs as well. I think Polmar just wants to assure that the U.S. sub force doesn't lose the edge. For that he should be commended. But I'm not willing to believe that things are so dire, especially when the evidence points the other way.

Sea Demon

[LuftWolf]

That was my impression as well, but i put it up to see what people thought.

I definately don't worry that the Fourth Generation SSN is going to be quieter than the SW, if only because of the difference in engineering standards and alloy materials in Western yards as opposed to Russian yards, but then again, my blood is red white and blue so... :hmm:

[Molon Labe]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

That was my impression as well Molon, but i put it up to see what people thought.

I definately don't worry that the Fourth Generation SSN is going to be quieter than the SW, if only because of the difference in engineering standards and alloy materials in Western yards as opposed to Russian yards, but then again, my blood is red white and blue so... :hmm:

Um...I didn't say anything....

[LuftWolf]

Oops, I read the post above my last one too quickly.

I'll edit now.

That's what I get for only looking at the COLOR of the avatar when I decided who I thought that last post was by, not even the avatar itself, let alone the name.

And I'm sober. Painfully sober all the time.