Multiple targets. How do you handle with them?

Rosencrantz · 08-17-05, 04:21 PM

Sorry to ask this - I could try myself.

I'm now on my second career patrol with no sinkings yet. But preparing to clash with a convoy...

Every time I change the target I have to re-enter new range. If I use the notepad for this, I assume new Ab is ignored and the original one (which is still on the notepad) will be send to the TDC, right? If I'm right, this is a little problem if you would like to fire your torpedos with very short intervals between them. But maybe I'm not right? :hmm:

Stymnus · 08-17-05, 07:59 PM

To make a new solution, you must get all the data for the target...type, range, AOB, speed. Otherwise so far as I know the (computed) firing solution never happens...

akula_krieg · 08-17-05, 08:36 PM

I normally don't use the notepad; I like the plot the convoy's course, then surface outside of visual range and race ahead. Once I'm about 8-10 km away from the convoy, I'll turn in and set up for a good 90 degree AOB shot, manually inputting data to the TDC.

If using the notepad, I'd set up a solution on the lead ship and use that as a base. I think all you have to do is reset range for each target (as this greatly affects the gyroangle). Unless the convoy is in a panic or zigging, AOB and speed should be the same. Still, it's best to get into a position that presents a 90 degree AOB regardless of what method you're using...the notepad only becomes harder to use if you're not in good position.

-akula-

DreamWizard · 08-17-05, 08:55 PM

Take a look here at Wazoo's tutorial page.

http://www.paulwasserman.net/SHIII/

Section III - "Fast 90 Basic" Manual Targeting.

Should help alot. And yes the TDC is a far better tool to use than the Notepad for "quick" adjustments when in the thick of it. Good Hunting!

jasonb885 · 08-17-05, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DreamWizard

Take a look here at Wazoo's tutorial page.

http://www.paulwasserman.net/SHIII/

Section III - "Fast 90 Basic" Manual Targeting.

Should help alot. And yes the TDC is a far better tool to use than the Notepad for "quick" adjustments when in the thick of it. Good Hunting!

Fast 90 is all I use. I get great results. My best shot was around 7km, TI, slow speed. Pretty amazing to watch the ship go up. Normally I fire between 1,000 and 4,000m though.

Heibges · 08-17-05, 11:15 PM

I use the TDC instead of the notepad also. I turn and manuever my boat to match the firing solution, rather than messing with it too much. Usually I only have to tinker with the range by a couple of hundred meters when switching targets.

My Basic Firing Solution is

AoB: 85Â° stb/pt Speed:7kts Range:600m

Lining up shots would be much tougher if the AI didn't always travel on courses divisible by 5.

nattydread · 08-18-05, 12:54 AM

Once you get a solutuion for one ship, all you have to do is re-do range and and AOB. Actually I believe AOB is engough because I dont think range matters much except for timer accuracy for impact. The thing is, once a target is hit, you have enough time for maybe one more shot before they start taking evasive manuvers, once that happen, scrap the whole solution and start fresh.

I've found for zig-zagging targets you can often times use the same solution for a little while, just aim at the last 1/3 of the ship and you'll often get a center hit. That last 1/3 tactic also works for solutions gathered while a target is already zig-zagging(I normally do this within 1000m of the target, im not sure how good it is farther than that).

Adam Bailey · 08-18-05, 01:20 AM

Definitely got to do TDC, specifically the "Fast 90" or similar tactic...

I can say with confidence that before I used Fast 90 I never made a single manual shot... just couldnt get it... but once I discovered that miracle, I dont think I've missed... maybe once or twice... I've begun varying on that tactic and doing wider and shorter angles, but the same principles apply... so far I've got about a 75% success rate at much more acute angles.

In any event, when dealing with convoys I take the nearest target, track it to get the speed (using the 3'15" rule) and course (just plotting obviously). Then I figure out the targets I need... Set up at 90 degrees to the course of the convoy, at a set distance from the nearest target you tracked, then all you need to do is figure out the range to the other ships and the periscope angle you are going to fire at... usually pick farthest to closest. Speed and course is the same for every other target. Figure the range and angle for each ship ahead of time, put the first in, wait for the ship to cross your sights, fire, change range and heading angle values that you predetermined earlier to the next target, wait til it crosses, and fire, repeat up to 4 times (or 6 if in XXI).

This tactic is very easy and very successful... in my best moments I've fired 4 torpedoes and hit 4 targets.
Adam

btaft · 08-18-05, 09:57 AM

Once you have the solution for one you have the solution for all merchants in the convoy assuming you have all of your torpedos set at the same speed. All you have to do is position your scope at your target and point + shoot (the AOB/gyro is automatically updated based on the scope position). The remainder of the solution is just a triangle using based on the ratio of the torpedos speed and the targets speed. Note: inaccuraces in your solution will lead to misses for targets that are futher away (i.e. a 1kt error in speed will still get you a hit from 700m but will likely lead to a miss from 3000m)

Rosencrantz · 08-20-05, 04:09 PM

Thanks for information, everyone!

I did some trials before and then I used the notepad (didn't like to travel between the scope and the TDC). I know Ab is corrected every time I turn the scope, I'm just thinking if I then (after I have turned the scope to pick up the other target) re-enter range to second target WITHOUT changing the original Ab in the notepad (which is for the target no 1) TDC WILL take the original Ab because I re-entered the new range. Well, got a lot of information from You, thanks a lot once again.

One thing more:

You have noticed, when firing salvos, computer allways suggest spread angle to be 5. I think, if firing more than 750 m away (at normal course, I mean 90 degrees angle), 5 degrees spread is too much for most of the targets (targets length), at least if you have a good data availible. Sure, if you are making a snap shot, you maybe like to use quite wide spread to cover possible mistakes with speed and Ab. Do you agree? :hmm:

08-17-05, 04:21 PM	#1
Rosencrantz Grey Wolf Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Finland Posts: 758 Downloads: 78 Uploads: 0	Multiple targets. How do you handle with them? Sorry to ask this - I could try myself. I'm now on my second career patrol with no sinkings yet. But preparing to clash with a convoy... Every time I change the target I have to re-enter new range. If I use the notepad for this, I assume new Ab is ignored and the original one (which is still on the notepad) will be send to the TDC, right? If I'm right, this is a little problem if you would like to fire your torpedos with very short intervals between them. But maybe I'm not right? :hmm:

08-17-05, 07:59 PM	#2
Stymnus A-ganger Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Wilton, NH Posts: 72 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Well To make a new solution, you must get all the data for the target...type, range, AOB, speed. Otherwise so far as I know the (computed) firing solution never happens...

08-17-05, 08:55 PM	#4
DreamWizard Watch Join Date: May 2005 Location: Washington DC Posts: 17 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	Take a look here at Wazoo's tutorial page. http://www.paulwasserman.net/SHIII/ Section III - "Fast 90 Basic" Manual Targeting. Should help alot. And yes the TDC is a far better tool to use than the Notepad for "quick" adjustments when in the thick of it. Good Hunting! __________________ DreamWizard

08-17-05, 11:15 PM	#6
Heibges Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 1,633 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	I use the TDC instead of the notepad also. I turn and manuever my boat to match the firing solution, rather than messing with it too much. Usually I only have to tinker with the range by a couple of hundred meters when switching targets. My Basic Firing Solution is AoB: 85Â° stb/pt Speed:7kts Range:600m Lining up shots would be much tougher if the AI didn't always travel on courses divisible by 5. __________________ U.Kdt.Hdb B. I. 28) This possibility of using the hydrophone to help in detecting surface ships should, however, be restricted to those cases where the submarine is unavoidably compelled to stay below the surface. http://www.hackworth.com/

08-17-05, 08:36 PM	#3
akula_krieg Mate Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 60 Downloads: 53 Uploads: 0	I normally don't use the notepad; I like the plot the convoy's course, then surface outside of visual range and race ahead. Once I'm about 8-10 km away from the convoy, I'll turn in and set up for a good 90 degree AOB shot, manually inputting data to the TDC. If using the notepad, I'd set up a solution on the lead ship and use that as a base. I think all you have to do is reset range for each target (as this greatly affects the gyroangle). Unless the convoy is in a panic or zigging, AOB and speed should be the same. Still, it's best to get into a position that presents a 90 degree AOB regardless of what method you're using...the notepad only becomes harder to use if you're not in good position. -akula-

08-18-05, 12:54 AM	#7
nattydread Captain Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 498 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Once you get a solutuion for one ship, all you have to do is re-do range and and AOB. Actually I believe AOB is engough because I dont think range matters much except for timer accuracy for impact. The thing is, once a target is hit, you have enough time for maybe one more shot before they start taking evasive manuvers, once that happen, scrap the whole solution and start fresh. I've found for zig-zagging targets you can often times use the same solution for a little while, just aim at the last 1/3 of the ship and you'll often get a center hit. That last 1/3 tactic also works for solutions gathered while a target is already zig-zagging(I normally do this within 1000m of the target, im not sure how good it is farther than that).

08-18-05, 01:20 AM	#8
Adam Bailey Swabbie Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 13 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Definitely got to do TDC, specifically the "Fast 90" or similar tactic... I can say with confidence that before I used Fast 90 I never made a single manual shot... just couldnt get it... but once I discovered that miracle, I dont think I've missed... maybe once or twice... I've begun varying on that tactic and doing wider and shorter angles, but the same principles apply... so far I've got about a 75% success rate at much more acute angles. In any event, when dealing with convoys I take the nearest target, track it to get the speed (using the 3'15" rule) and course (just plotting obviously). Then I figure out the targets I need... Set up at 90 degrees to the course of the convoy, at a set distance from the nearest target you tracked, then all you need to do is figure out the range to the other ships and the periscope angle you are going to fire at... usually pick farthest to closest. Speed and course is the same for every other target. Figure the range and angle for each ship ahead of time, put the first in, wait for the ship to cross your sights, fire, change range and heading angle values that you predetermined earlier to the next target, wait til it crosses, and fire, repeat up to 4 times (or 6 if in XXI). This tactic is very easy and very successful... in my best moments I've fired 4 torpedoes and hit 4 targets. Adam

08-18-05, 09:57 AM	#9
btaft Soundman Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 147 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	Once you have the solution for one you have the solution for all merchants in the convoy assuming you have all of your torpedos set at the same speed. All you have to do is position your scope at your target and point + shoot (the AOB/gyro is automatically updated based on the scope position). The remainder of the solution is just a triangle using based on the ratio of the torpedos speed and the targets speed. Note: inaccuraces in your solution will lead to misses for targets that are futher away (i.e. a 1kt error in speed will still get you a hit from 700m but will likely lead to a miss from 3000m)

08-20-05, 04:09 PM	#10
Rosencrantz Grey Wolf Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Finland Posts: 758 Downloads: 78 Uploads: 0	Thanks for information, everyone! I did some trials before and then I used the notepad (didn't like to travel between the scope and the TDC). I know Ab is corrected every time I turn the scope, I'm just thinking if I then (after I have turned the scope to pick up the other target) re-enter range to second target WITHOUT changing the original Ab in the notepad (which is for the target no 1) TDC WILL take the original Ab because I re-entered the new range. Well, got a lot of information from You, thanks a lot once again. One thing more: You have noticed, when firing salvos, computer allways suggest spread angle to be 5. I think, if firing more than 750 m away (at normal course, I mean 90 degrees angle), 5 degrees spread is too much for most of the targets (targets length), at least if you have a good data availible. Sure, if you are making a snap shot, you maybe like to use quite wide spread to cover possible mistakes with speed and Ab. Do you agree? :hmm: