OK, where to start on the USS Bremerton..

ET2SN · 02-09-20, 02:34 AM

From the front page article..

https://www.kitsapsun.com/story/news...nt/4667853002/

...and a loose discussion on submarine memorials in general.

My time on the Bremerton was mostly spent in the Pearl Harbor Naval Shipyard. She got the dubious record at one point of completing an 18 month over-haul in a mere 49 months.

There were several reasons why this over-haul took so long, most of them I understood, some I never figured out. Partially, this was due to timing. Boats like the Bremerton, San Francisco, and Indianapolis were placed into over-haul in the late 1980's when the cold war was already cooling off. In short, things had gotten pretty quiet in the north Pacific due to funding issues in the Soviet Navy and there were more than a few discussions about how wise it would be to poke the hibernating bear with a stick.

The Bremerton also had a history (as did many of the 688's) of being "rode hard and put to bed wet" when she was in service with the fleet. To be honest, I don't really know what this means but I can offer some clues to the Flight I and II 688 class boats:

At the time, the 637 Sturgeon class were considered the Cadillacs of the fast attack fleet. They had room for the crew that made extended patrols routine and a list of options that made life easy. The Los Angeles class were supposed to be better, well kind of. The 688's were built for speed which made them more like an AMG Mercedes on the Autobahn. Very big, fast, and sleek but also very expensive when it came time to maintain them ("If you have to ask, you probably can't afford it").

So, give the keys to a Navy Commander and, naturally, he's going to look at that "Ahead FLANK" slot on the engine order telegraph.

The entire crew would feel the power the engine room could produce at high bells, and we liked it.

The downside was that all that power had to be transmitted to the screw, and that kind pf power will wear stuff out.

If I had to guess, there was a "We'll deal with it later" attitude when it came to stomping on the accelerator pedal.

There were also a LOT of new doo-dads that were showing up on the newer Flight III boats and, hey, since the Bremerton was already stripped down to mostly the bare hull..

Some of the new goodies we got, most of them we didn't. The process of going from

to having the parts show up ran over a three to six month period, not including the time to install them and any mods to the hull they would require. For example, decisions were made while I was aboard to convert from a "slick" hull to VLS-equipped and back again several times.
In the end, the Bremerton never got her vertical launch tubes

and wound up as a "mostly Flight II" boat without VLS.

There was also the issue of our older parts, or what were supposed to be our older parts.

One fine day, ET Div got the word to stand by because our #1 scope was being parolled out of storage and would be once again re-united with the boat.
We all stood around on the pier while the rigging crew got set up and the flat bed truck arrived with "our" scope on the bed.
I look nervously at my other ET2 buddy and our Chief. Something just didn't look right. We check the paperwork several times but the rigging crew says "THAT's the scope on our paperwork, its going into THAT sail" and that was that.
At this point I should say that there are different types of Type18 periscopes, and they are made for different classes of subs.

Was it possible that the scope shop got a late night work order several years in the past and pulled a switch-a-roo with our barrel? "Oh no, no way." we were told, "those barrels have to stay linked to the hull".

Right....

Several hours later the rigging crew is looking nervous. "Our" barrel doesn't fit into the packing glad and, gosh darn it, the bottom of the scope is sitting on the bottom of the hull but there's about 5 to 6 feet of the barrel sitting above the top of the sail.

My Chief was a bit of a wise guy and says, "Well, at least we won't need to hook up the hydraulics".

Yep, they were trying to fit a barrel for an Ohio class boomer.

So, am I sorry to see the old girl getting decommissioned? No, not really. I had good friends and brothers aboard the Bremerton but we all had one thing in common- we absolutely HATED living in the shipyard for as long as we did.
I've mentioned in the past that I figured out how many hours per week we were expected to work and it came out over 90.

Those kinds of hours WILL burn you out, make no mistake.

To put it another way, I can finally look at packages of razor blades at my local store and feel good about it (salvaged HY80 is the preferred steel used to make razor blades).

So, I said I wanted to touch on the memorial stuff and please don't get me wrong on this, for the most part I'm against it.

This is military grade hardware and it was designed and built to serve a military purpose. That included doing military grade maintenance on a regular basis. Now, as if by magic, because this hardware is put on display for the public it it usually assumed that the maintenance can stop.

Over time, this will produce what I call a Liability Bomb. Even if the metal doesn't rust or corrode (which it will), someone will fall off it.

Or, someone will tag the snot out of it with spray paint and the volunteers will give up and walk away. Now, your memorial will start look a lot more like an abandoned car on your lawn BUT you won't be able to tow it away.

As for the city of Bremerton, I wish I had an opinion. When we finally got the old girl out of the shipyard and she looked like she was brand new, we were tasked to conduct some operations in the state of Washington. Hey, since we're going to be there and since the ship is named after the city, maybe we could tie up for weekend or what-ever?

What we heard wasn't "Well, gee, we'd like to but.." but was closer to "Oh, #### NO you won't!!" so we pulled into Bangor and got to check out Seattle.

ETR3(SS) · 02-09-20, 03:09 PM

49 months? Imagine spending your entire enlistment never going to sea.

We did 6 months of ERP in Bangor and that was a nightmare, couldn't imagine going 18 months for a normal overhaul let alone the 49. I see your point on the Bremerton's sail, and they already have the Parche there next to the ferry dock. Add to that the fact that we're not popular (at least not when I was there) with the left leaning residents of Western Washington, unless it was our money they were getting either from shopping or law enforcement.

ET2SN · 02-10-20, 03:05 AM

I can't imagine doing all 49 months, either.

Off the top of my head, I don't think any of us did the entire stretch in the shipyard except for maybe the CO?
My time in the shipyard was somewhere close to two years with another six months of shakedown trials, crew training, and a mini-refit at the end.

The other two boats I mentioned were in the same purgatory as we were. I'm pretty sure Indy did 48 months and San Fran did maybe 45? The problem was that the Navy had a lot invested in the class but had no where to send us. It was easier to punt and figure things out by keeping the hulls stripped in a dry dock.
The twist we had on the Bremerton was what made it so unique. A welder had started a small fire in berthing early in the over-haul which led to a formal hearing which wound up meaning that on every weekday, monday to friday, the crew would start a field day from 5 AM to 9 AM. Meanwhile, at some point the nukes had started griping about the constant three-section in-port duty so the skipper "fixed" it by putting EVERYONE in three section duty.

A typical in-port duty day in fast attacks meant that every four days you pull one or two watches, get all your PMS and quals completed, maybe get some sleep, and by 9 AM the next day you would get cut loose by your boss.
On the Bremerton it meant that every three days you would show up for for roll call at 4:45, field day until 8, muster for duty, stand your watch(es) for the rest of the day, then get ready ready to start another field day at 4:45 the next morning, then the real pisser.., liberty by dept. head at 17:00.

In the end, the duty days didn't matter. Every Monday to Friday was the same 4:45 to 17:00 grind of basically doing nothing.

I don't think the issue of not going to Bremerton was anything more than a typical military SNAFU/FUBAR. Bremerton, at the time, was the homeport to a bunch of gray-painted targets and the sailors who infested them.

To be honest, we got along with sailors like a cat gets along with a goldfish so its not like we missed out on much.

02-09-20, 03:09 PM	#2
ETR3(SS) Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Between test depth and periscope depth Posts: 3,021 Downloads: 175 Uploads: 16	49 months? Imagine spending your entire enlistment never going to sea. We did 6 months of ERP in Bangor and that was a nightmare, couldn't imagine going 18 months for a normal overhaul let alone the 49. I see your point on the Bremerton's sail, and they already have the Parche there next to the ferry dock. Add to that the fact that we're not popular (at least not when I was there) with the left leaning residents of Western Washington, unless it was our money they were getting either from shopping or law enforcement. __________________ USS Kentucky SSBN 737 (G) Comms Div 2003-2006 Qualified 19 November 03 Yes I was really on a submarine.

02-09-20, 02:34 AM	#1
ET2SN Ocean Warrior Join Date: Oct 2017 Posts: 2,652 Downloads: 60 Uploads: 0	OK, where to start on the USS Bremerton.. From the front page article.. https://www.kitsapsun.com/story/news...nt/4667853002/ ...and a loose discussion on submarine memorials in general. My time on the Bremerton was mostly spent in the Pearl Harbor Naval Shipyard. She got the dubious record at one point of completing an 18 month over-haul in a mere 49 months. There were several reasons why this over-haul took so long, most of them I understood, some I never figured out. Partially, this was due to timing. Boats like the Bremerton, San Francisco, and Indianapolis were placed into over-haul in the late 1980's when the cold war was already cooling off. In short, things had gotten pretty quiet in the north Pacific due to funding issues in the Soviet Navy and there were more than a few discussions about how wise it would be to poke the hibernating bear with a stick. The Bremerton also had a history (as did many of the 688's) of being "rode hard and put to bed wet" when she was in service with the fleet. To be honest, I don't really know what this means but I can offer some clues to the Flight I and II 688 class boats: At the time, the 637 Sturgeon class were considered the Cadillacs of the fast attack fleet. They had room for the crew that made extended patrols routine and a list of options that made life easy. The Los Angeles class were supposed to be better, well kind of. The 688's were built for speed which made them more like an AMG Mercedes on the Autobahn. Very big, fast, and sleek but also very expensive when it came time to maintain them ("If you have to ask, you probably can't afford it"). So, give the keys to a Navy Commander and, naturally, he's going to look at that "Ahead FLANK" slot on the engine order telegraph. The entire crew would feel the power the engine room could produce at high bells, and we liked it. The downside was that all that power had to be transmitted to the screw, and that kind pf power will wear stuff out. If I had to guess, there was a "We'll deal with it later" attitude when it came to stomping on the accelerator pedal. There were also a LOT of new doo-dads that were showing up on the newer Flight III boats and, hey, since the Bremerton was already stripped down to mostly the bare hull.. Some of the new goodies we got, most of them we didn't. The process of going from to having the parts show up ran over a three to six month period, not including the time to install them and any mods to the hull they would require. For example, decisions were made while I was aboard to convert from a "slick" hull to VLS-equipped and back again several times. In the end, the Bremerton never got her vertical launch tubes and wound up as a "mostly Flight II" boat without VLS. There was also the issue of our older parts, or what were supposed to be our older parts. One fine day, ET Div got the word to stand by because our #1 scope was being parolled out of storage and would be once again re-united with the boat. We all stood around on the pier while the rigging crew got set up and the flat bed truck arrived with "our" scope on the bed. I look nervously at my other ET2 buddy and our Chief. Something just didn't look right. We check the paperwork several times but the rigging crew says "THAT's the scope on our paperwork, its going into THAT sail" and that was that. At this point I should say that there are different types of Type18 periscopes, and they are made for different classes of subs. Was it possible that the scope shop got a late night work order several years in the past and pulled a switch-a-roo with our barrel? "Oh no, no way." we were told, "those barrels have to stay linked to the hull". Right.... Several hours later the rigging crew is looking nervous. "Our" barrel doesn't fit into the packing glad and, gosh darn it, the bottom of the scope is sitting on the bottom of the hull but there's about 5 to 6 feet of the barrel sitting above the top of the sail. My Chief was a bit of a wise guy and says, "Well, at least we won't need to hook up the hydraulics". Yep, they were trying to fit a barrel for an Ohio class boomer. So, am I sorry to see the old girl getting decommissioned? No, not really. I had good friends and brothers aboard the Bremerton but we all had one thing in common- we absolutely HATED living in the shipyard for as long as we did. I've mentioned in the past that I figured out how many hours per week we were expected to work and it came out over 90. Those kinds of hours WILL burn you out, make no mistake. To put it another way, I can finally look at packages of razor blades at my local store and feel good about it (salvaged HY80 is the preferred steel used to make razor blades). So, I said I wanted to touch on the memorial stuff and please don't get me wrong on this, for the most part I'm against it. This is military grade hardware and it was designed and built to serve a military purpose. That included doing military grade maintenance on a regular basis. Now, as if by magic, because this hardware is put on display for the public it it usually assumed that the maintenance can stop. Over time, this will produce what I call a Liability Bomb. Even if the metal doesn't rust or corrode (which it will), someone will fall off it. Or, someone will tag the snot out of it with spray paint and the volunteers will give up and walk away. Now, your memorial will start look a lot more like an abandoned car on your lawn BUT you won't be able to tow it away. As for the city of Bremerton, I wish I had an opinion. When we finally got the old girl out of the shipyard and she looked like she was brand new, we were tasked to conduct some operations in the state of Washington. Hey, since we're going to be there and since the ship is named after the city, maybe we could tie up for weekend or what-ever? What we heard wasn't "Well, gee, we'd like to but.." but was closer to "Oh, #### NO you won't!!" so we pulled into Bangor and got to check out Seattle.

02-10-20, 03:05 AM	#3
ET2SN Ocean Warrior Join Date: Oct 2017 Posts: 2,652 Downloads: 60 Uploads: 0	I can't imagine doing all 49 months, either. Off the top of my head, I don't think any of us did the entire stretch in the shipyard except for maybe the CO? My time in the shipyard was somewhere close to two years with another six months of shakedown trials, crew training, and a mini-refit at the end. The other two boats I mentioned were in the same purgatory as we were. I'm pretty sure Indy did 48 months and San Fran did maybe 45? The problem was that the Navy had a lot invested in the class but had no where to send us. It was easier to punt and figure things out by keeping the hulls stripped in a dry dock. The twist we had on the Bremerton was what made it so unique. A welder had started a small fire in berthing early in the over-haul which led to a formal hearing which wound up meaning that on every weekday, monday to friday, the crew would start a field day from 5 AM to 9 AM. Meanwhile, at some point the nukes had started griping about the constant three-section in-port duty so the skipper "fixed" it by putting EVERYONE in three section duty. A typical in-port duty day in fast attacks meant that every four days you pull one or two watches, get all your PMS and quals completed, maybe get some sleep, and by 9 AM the next day you would get cut loose by your boss. On the Bremerton it meant that every three days you would show up for for roll call at 4:45, field day until 8, muster for duty, stand your watch(es) for the rest of the day, then get ready ready to start another field day at 4:45 the next morning, then the real pisser.., liberty by dept. head at 17:00. In the end, the duty days didn't matter. Every Monday to Friday was the same 4:45 to 17:00 grind of basically doing nothing. I don't think the issue of not going to Bremerton was anything more than a typical military SNAFU/FUBAR. Bremerton, at the time, was the homeport to a bunch of gray-painted targets and the sailors who infested them. To be honest, we got along with sailors like a cat gets along with a goldfish so its not like we missed out on much.