Red Needles on depth guages

[Boffingham]

Could someone explain what the red needles on the depth gauges are for and can they be changed?

Thanks

[Pisces]

That is the target depth , as in what you command the sub to go to. You can set it by clicking on the (2d) dial.

[Boffingham]

Thanks for the quick reply. It seems that I can click anywhere in the dial to change the dive depth but the red needles never move. I am on the base in install of SH4 gold version.

[james_nix]

I thought the red needles never move?

They are the test depth of the sub from the building engineers, a warning not to go under that, hence the redness.

Of course in actuality sub's could go a great deal deeper than the test depth.

Unless we are talking about different things.

[Pisces]

In this screenshot the player recently set depth to 92 feet (see message window) while he is currently at 113 feet:

http://www.subsim.com/sh4/sh4_mp4.jpg

Being able to click in dials to set speed course or depth is pretty basic (was in SH3). Afaik you don't need mods for that. Mods may change color of the needle but I think it's default. Unless it was one of the bugs still left in the game that I forgot about.

[Boffingham]

On the shallow gauge it is set to 55 feet on the deep gauge it is set to 330 feet. I don't believe these are limits. How do I take a screen shot while in the game?

[TorpX]

Press 'Ctrl' + 'F11' for a screen shot.

I always figured the red lines were for periscope depth and test depth, but never got changed/fixed/updated for different classes. If someone knows how to remove them, do tell, they are annoying.

[aanker]

Yes, the red line at 60' is periscope depth, and the red line at 300' for some classes is the rated 'Test depth'. Some mods change the 'crush depth' from the Stock values.

Go below the rated test depth for your boat at your own risk....... you go deep enough and you'll find 'crush depth'.

I removed the red lines in my install, so my HUD depth gauges only display the shallow and deep depth gauges with the current depth only........ TorpX, I'm looking, I'm looking, I'll find it..

TorpX wrote:
If someone knows how to remove them, do tell, they are annoying.

Webster came up with the 'fix' - make the color value for the red needles transparent. Here is the topic:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=148677

In menu_1024_768:

[G3F I24]
Name=Test depth val
Type=1031;Stat bmp array
ItemID=0x3F1F0005
ParentID=0x3F1F0000
Pos=39,-6,12,78
Zone= 907 114 12 78 0 1 0x3F1F0000 0.5 -0.5 0x3F1F0005 -0.5 0.5 0 0
Color=0xFFFFFF00;Color=0xC80A0AFE
Materials=1
Display=5;Linear&rotation
Mat 0=data/menu/gui/layout/indicators.tga
Crop 0=0,0,0.5,0.46875
MatFlags=0x29
TexFmt=0x0
Drag=false
BmpState=1
NeedFocus=true
SelOne=false
IdGroup=0
StatesColors=0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF

<skip>

[G3F I31]
Name=Periscope depth val
Type=1031;Stat bmp array
ItemID=0x3F1E0005
ParentID=0x3F1E0000
Pos=40,-6,10,78
Zone= 908 114 10 78 0 1 0x3F1E0000 0.5 -0.5 0x3F1E0005 -0.5 0.5 0 0
Color=0xFFFFFF00;Color=0xC80A0AFE
Materials=1
Display=5;Linear&rotation
Mat 0=data/menu/gui/layout/indicators.tga
Crop 0=0.5,0,0.5,0.5
MatFlags=0x29
TexFmt=0x0
Drag=false
BmpState=1
NeedFocus=true
SelOne=false
IdGroup=0
StatesColors=0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF

Happy Hunting!

[Boffingham]

That's great information, thanks very much.

Cheers!

[Rockin Robbins]

Yes, those are not needles at all. They're red lines painted on the gauge scale itself which the crew would never unseal and change. Might as well complain of double vision when using the stadimeter!

[Sniper297]

Always gotta clarify the translation from Romanian whenever I talk about this.

CRASH depth = depth at which the crew will level off when you order a crash dive.
CRUSH depth is the theoretical depth at which the pressure hull will collapse. In game it's the depth at which an undamaged hull will begin to suffer damage, erroneously labeled "crash depth" in the sub's .zon file.

Using Silent 3ditor you can edit the \Data\Submarine\NSS_SubType\NSS_SubType.zon file (replace "SubType" with the actual name of the type you want to mod) to change the "crash" (crush) depth.

The needles and the actual crash depth are in \Data\Submarine\NSS_SubType\NSS_SubType.cfg and can be edited in notepad. For NSS_Gato.cfg as an example;

[Properties]
PeriscopeDepth=18.3;meters
SnorkelDepth=15;meters
CrashDepth=40;meters
MaxDepth=100;meters
SurfaceDepth=4.5;meters
TorpLaunchMaxDepth=30;meters
StormConditions=9,0.1;max wind speed [m/s], max rain intensity [0,1]


The red needle on the shallow depth gauge is the periscope depth setting, the red needle on the deep depth gauge is the MaxDepth setting. Changing PeriscopeDepth from 18.3 meters (60 feet) to 14 meters (46 feet) will change the shallow depth gauge red needle from 60 feet to 46 feet, but will also change the depth at which the crew AI will automatically level off when you order periscope depth to 46 feet.

MaxDepth is a different story, change that from 100 meters (330 feet) to 76 meters (250 feet) it will move the red needle in the deep depth gauge to 250 feet, but will not affect the actual crush depth, which can only be adjusted in the .zon file.

So for example you can change the "crash depth" in the .zon file (not the same as the crash depth in the .cfg file, totally unrelated and mislabeled) to 136 meters (450 feet) then change the MaxDepth in the .cfg file to 121 meters (400 feet) you'll have the red needle on the deep depth gauge at 400 feet, 50 feet above the actual crush depth. Or you can set the needle and the crush depth to the same depth, whatever floats your boat.

[CapnScurvy]

That's a great explanation Sniper! You nailed it!!

One point I want to make is if you want to go deeper than setting the gauges will allow (depending on the type of boat, the guage will either limit a depth of 450 ft or 600 ft), or what the game limits you to......change the particular subs .cfg file "MaxDepth=" figure to 1000.

Using the Dive (D) key will start the decent. You can take the sub to its crush depth, or anywhere your nerve will let you go (much like the real sub). Just don't descend at too great a speed.......the further down you go, the less control you'll have in leveling off. There's a point of no return (as you would expect) at the greater depths.

[Rockin Robbins]

The important thing is that these are not needles. They are painted on the face of the gauge. They also have nothing to do with the actual capabilities of the boat, as they tended to be different on different boats, even boats of the same class. Sometimes it is difficult to see what the function of a particular mark is.

Here's a photo of a real gauge


and another. Note that there is no red line painted on the deep water gauge at all for this boat.

[james_nix]

Originally Posted by CapnScurvy

That's a great explanation Sniper! You nailed it!!

One point I want to make is if you want to go deeper than setting the gauges will allow (depending on the type of boat, the guage will either limit a depth of 450 ft or 600 ft), or what the game limits you to......change the particular subs .cfg file "MaxDepth=" figure to 1000.

Using the Dive (D) key will start the decent. You can take the sub to its crush depth, or anywhere your nerve will let you go (much like the real sub). Just don't descend at too great a speed.......the further down you go, the less control you'll have in leveling off. There's a point of no return (as you would expect) at the greater depths.

I tried to test the like Dick O'Kane, go down slowly until something pops, then that is the crush depth. Come back up and repair the minor damage.

But the damage model in TMO and RFB happens so fast, there is no time to get back! Once you are under crush depth you are through!