At this moment, 150 years ago...

[Bubblehead1980]

A great tyrant fell.

[Torplexed]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

A great tyrant fell.

What? Did Lincoln whack a Confederate vampire lord again?

[Oberon]

Oh, a drive by trolling is it?

[Oberon]

[CCIP]

Oh good lord, you're not even trying now.

At the very least, you already look patently stupid when many members are contributing to "x years ago" threads in ways that are meaningful and insightful. Live and learn:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...214193&page=48
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=185283

[Oberon]

I think we should use this thread to celebrate old Abe.

[Torplexed]

Originally Posted by Oberon

I think we should use this thread to celebrate old Abe.

[Oberon]

You know, I do ponder, if the likes of Lee or Jackson could have seen what their names have been put through by those of 'The Lost Cause' brigade in the years since their defeat, perhaps they (well, Lee since Jackson was killed) would have surrendered earlier.

Then again, I could say the same about many historical figures whose names have been used as weapons by the ignorant and foolish. How little we learn.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Oberon

You know, I do ponder, if the likes of Lee or Jackson could have seen what their names have been put through by those of 'The Lost Cause' brigade in the years since their defeat, perhaps they (well, Lee since Jackson was killed) would have surrendered earlier.

Then again, I could say the same about many historical figures whose names have been used as weapons by the ignorant and foolish. How little we learn.

Ignorant and foolish describes people who celebrate a man who launched a war that left 800,000 people dead, millions more wounded physically, emotionally for life.A man who launched an unjust war(slavery was on it's way out anyways) that left millions impoverished and wrecked the culture of a beautiful part of our country, which still suffers today in many ways thanks to northern aggression.Even more ignorant is many believe it was to end the stain of slavery when in fact it was about northern industrialists and money using government tyranny to further their interests.How the brave people of the south who stood up, refused to allow their rights to be violated , did their best to stop such actions.

Ignorant and foolish are those who call Lincoln a great a man when he was nothing more than a tyrant who suspended habeas corpus jailed those who dared criticize him.Facts are stubborn things, it happened.

Sorry, this was not a great man, he was a tyrant and should be remembered as such.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Oberon

Oh, a drive by trolling is it?

No, it was short and to the point.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Torplexed

What? Did Lincoln whack a Confederate vampire lord again?

No, but Booth handled business that evening.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Ignorant and foolish describes people who celebrate a man who launched a war that left 800,000 people dead, millions more wounded physically, emotionally for life.

We've had this conversation before, and you conveniently forget. It was the South that fired the opening shots.

Even more ignorant is many believe it was to end the stain of slavery when in fact it was about northern industrialists and money using government tyranny to further their interests.How the brave people of the south who stood up, refused to allow their rights to be violated , did their best to stop such actions.

You might want to reread the reasons why the southern states seceded in the first place. Not the reasons they've come up with since, but the reasons they themselves gave at the time.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...9&postcount=44

Ignorant and foolish are those who call Lincoln a great a man when he was nothing more than a tyrant who suspended habeas corpus jailed those who dared criticize him.Facts are stubborn things, it happened.

You've said that before. Opinion is nice, but you have yet to prove your case. Or even really try.

I've pointed out before that Lincoln was the product of the generation who wrote the Constitution. The Founders were forced to compromise over the question of slave importation and Southern States' representation. They believed that the country could not survive unless all 13 states were united, and Lincoln firmly believed the same. If you don't look at it within that context then your beliefs about him and his reasons are heavily biased.

[Aktungbby]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I've pointed out before that Lincoln was the product of the generation who wrote the Constitution. The Founders were forced to compromise over the question of slave importation and Southern States' representation. They believed that the country could not survive unless all 13 states were united, and Lincoln firmly believed the same. If you don't look at it within that context then your beliefs about him and his reasons are heavily biased.

But your leaving out your argument's big gun! Lincoln, ever the consummate lawyer, acted on 'precedent' as stare dicicis is always best in weighty matters. Andrew Jackson: Southern slaveowner, victorious general, Indian fighter and duelist-married to a divorcee! established Lincoln's precedent with the South Carolina Nullification Crises which challenged Federal power. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nullification_Crisis Among his memorable quotes on the matter: " Yes I have(studied the matter); please give my compliments to my friends in your State and say to them, that if a single drop of blood shall be shed there in opposition to the laws of the United States, I will hang the first man I can lay my hand on engaged in such treasonable conduct, upon the first tree I can reach."..."The attempt will be made to surprise the Forts and garrisons by the militia, and must be guarded against with vestal vigilance and any attempt by force repelled with prompt and exemplary punishment."..."I consider, then, the power to annul a law of the United States, assumed by one State, incompatible with the existence of the Union, contradicted expressly by the letter of the Constitution, unauthorized by its spirit, inconsistent with every principle on which It was founded, and destructive of the great object for which it was formed....Should the exigency arise rendering the execution of the existing laws impracticable from any cause what ever, prompt notice of it will be given to Congress, with a suggestion of such views and measures as may be deemed necessary to meet it." One thing about Andrew Jackson was known given...he didn't bluff. Throw in the crushing of Shay's Rebellion in Massachusetts and the Whiskey Rebellion in Pennsylvania in support of Federal taxation by militia in which all were pardoned and Lincoln is seen following precedent to the letter with his post-war policy to "let 'em up easy" after four years of bloodshed which unfortunately was 'radicalized' by his assassination. His addition to precedent: the Emancipation Proclamation actually a partial war measure (Antietam-1862) to keep Britain or France out of the war on the Confederate side, does not hang in all Federal buildings for nothing...

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Ignorant and foolish describes people who celebrate a man who launched a war that left 800,000 people dead, millions more wounded physically, emotionally for life.

You could say that for any man who started any war, the people behind the American revolution for one. Besides, as Steve has already pointed out, the Confederate forces fired the first shots.
And war was inevitable, between two great forces of movement, if it had not taken place under Lincoln, it would have under someone else.

A man who launched an unjust war(slavery was on it's way out anyways) that left millions impoverished and wrecked the culture of a beautiful part of our country, which still suffers today in many ways thanks to northern aggression.

The south only suffers because it refuses to acknowledge its defeat. There are people so stuck to 'The Lost Cause' that they have kept open the wounds of a war that ended 150 years ago. For goodness sake, World War One ended a hundred years ago and we've long since forgiven each other, only the shells of war remain to blight the landscape. The English Civil War has long since faded into memory and although its after-effects still echo within the British governmental system, there are not bands of parliamentarians or monarchists arguing at each other on the internet, or if there are they are few and far between.
For the love of God, let it go already.

Ignorant and foolish are those who call Lincoln a great a man when he was nothing more than a tyrant who suspended habeas corpus jailed those who dared criticize him.Facts are stubborn things, it happened.

Sorry, this was not a great man, he was a tyrant and should be remembered as such.

It was a civil war, they are rarely civil.

In short, this comes across as little more than butthurt over a war that you, your parents or your parents parents never fought in, if I, a Brit, can forgive Germany for the Second World War, if I can make friends with people of a country who killed one of my great-grandfathers and severely wounded the other, then you can certainly pull your head out of your backside and let the events of a war that took place over a hundred years ago be consigned where they belong.
The past.

Oh, and I need to end this with a Lincoln pic:

[Betonov]

Originally Posted by Oberon

In short, this comes across as little more than butthurt over a war that you, your parents or your parents parents never fought in, if I, a Brit, can forgive Germany for the Second World War, if I can make friends with people of a country who killed one of my great-grandfathers and severely wounded the other, then you can certainly pull your head out of your backside and let the events of a war that took place over a hundred years ago be consigned where they belong.
The past.

True. Last year 4 Brits and an Aussie had an Austro-Hungarian among them on English soil
And the A-H descendant survived