Playing 100% Realism with the h.sie patch

[maillemaker]

So, last year I finally, after many years of playing, finished a campaign and survived the war at 100% realism including no map contacts. After that I vowed next time I tried I would use h.sie's executable patch.

Some of the things it does I already did most of the time, like only loading external torpedoes in good weather and at slow speed. (well, sometimes I just could not resist a high-speed convoy end-around chase while reloading. ).

But this h.sie patch sure makes you play by the book. Holy cow.

No external reloading except in good weather and slow speed. Can't even reload your internals in rough weather unless you dive to 16m or below.

Now your oxygen works in two parts - what you have in the air and your compressed reserve. Start using your compressed reserve and you have to go back to base to recharge that stuff.

And the darn periscope! Only good below 4 knots now. How will I ever pull off my famed down-the-throat shots on pursuing escorts anymore? I might be able to pull it off through the blur...

It's so nice for the lazy WO to go up on the bridge now like he is supposed to.

It's also very nice to get a message when you sail into or out of fog/rain.

I'm scared to use my engines at flank speed now.

The only thing I did not turn on was his dud torpedo stuff. The game has so much stormy weather you'd never get a shot off with that turned on.

So, this adds another new dimension to the old SH3 classic. Can't wait to see if the wolfpack stuff works.

Steve

[jakjack]

I finally bit the bullet and installed h.sie's patch as well. I don't know how I ever played without it.

[BigWalleye]

Originally Posted by maillemaker

The only thing I did not turn on was his dud torpedo stuff. The game has so much stormy weather you'd never get a shot off with that turned on.

Not at all! I play NYGM at 100% with h.sie's (and Stiebler's) patches. Recent patrol 2 December to 24 December, 1939. Usual lousy Atlantic winter weather (althought Stiebler does help with that). 9 hits out of 14 torpedoes fired, all on merchants of 5 to 7 m draft. The Torpedo Failure Fix just adds another factor for you to consider in making your setup. It does not make the game impossibly hard. If you like to have a sense of the constraints RL Kaleuns had to work under, it's well worth trying.

BTW, I also use a small mod suggested by LGN1 which uses SH3C to randomly cause the torpedoes to run deeper than set, by 0 to 3 m (average about 2 m). This reflects the historical depth error problem. Used with h.sie's Torpedo Failure Fix, it creates some very interesting tradeoffs.

[banryu79]

I can't use the patch (and I'm sad of that), because I bought my SH3 on Steam.
But...

Originally Posted by maillemaker

No external reloading except in good weather and slow speed. Can't even reload your internals in rough weather unless you dive to 16m or below.

I enforce this rule by myself. I add the rule that I cannot do external reloads at all by night or in very bad light conditions. You know, the men need to see what they are doing...

Originally Posted by maillemaker

Now your oxygen works in two parts - what you have in the air and your compressed reserve. Start using your compressed reserve and you have to go back to base to recharge that stuff.

That's one I really miss. I can't do anything about that, but I usually try to minimize time spent underwater unless I'm really forced to keep my head down.

Originally Posted by maillemaker

And the darn periscope! Only good below 4 knots now. How will I ever pull off my famed down-the-throat shots on pursuing escorts anymore? I might be able to pull it off through the blur...

Another rule I found really interesting and alway force on myself.
In my vision I can never ever raise the periscope if my speed is higher than 3 kts. I almost always use it running at 2 kt, for conveniance, sometimes at 1 kt in situations I think keeping the speed low will help produce less commotion in the water in order to avoid been detected (I do not know if this modeled in the game).

Originally Posted by maillemaker

I'm scared to use my engines at flank speed now.

Me too, but I use the "malfuction" option of SH3Commander.
IIRC this option model engine malfuction caused by agonizing the diesels, but I do not know how differently this aspect is model with the h.sie patch.

Originally Posted by maillemaker

The only thing I did not turn on was his dud torpedo stuff. The game has so much stormy weather you'd never get a shot off with that turned on.

This one, togheter with the oxygen reserve things, is what I really miss.

Originally Posted by maillemaker

So, this adds another new dimension to the old SH3 classic. Can't wait to see if the wolfpack stuff works.

And this is another totally negleted aspect in the game.

It would rocks if I could use h.sie patch with my Steam copy of the game, but I know I can't patch the .exe.

Happy Hunting!

[BigWalleye]

Originally Posted by banryu79

It would rocks if I could use h.sie patch with my Steam copy of the game, but I know I can't patch the .exe.

1) Desertstriker has a tutorial which explains how to use the patchers (both h.sie and Stiebler) with the Steam version. Apparently, it is possible, just not as easy.

2) AFAIK, a copy purchased from Amazon, Gamersgate, or any other reputable on-line vendor will patch and mod just fine, with no special handling. And it will cost about about as much as 2 vente Still Whites.

[Tupolev]

So, this adds another new dimension to the old SH3 classic. Can't wait to see if the wolfpack stuff works.

The wolfpack addition is definitely the crown jewel of the mod. Its amazingly cool to see the effects of a coordinated attack, and its rare enough to make it blow my mind every time. I've only had 3 successful wolfpacks in the last 3 years of playing.

The last was on my now deceased career. It was June 1940. One escort was damaged, and one sunk. The others were off chasing my comrades after they sunk 2 merchants and damaged 2 tankers. With the whole convoy zigzagging, I had to close to 500m just to ensure hits with my own torpedoes. I was sailing through the columns picking out the best targets. Amazingly fun. A year later, though, and all those merchants would probably be armed and taking shots at me. Still, sunk 2 freighters and damaged a large tanker before the corvettes showed back up and drove me off.

T

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by banryu79

IMe too, but I use the "malfuction" option of SH3Commander.
IIRC this option model engine malfuction caused by agonizing the diesels, but I do not know how differently this aspect is model with the h.sie patch.

Commander's 'Malfunction' function has breakdowns as a random event. it may happen or it may not. H.sie's breakdowns only occur if you overstress the engines. Full Speed will give you the maximum listed speed for that U-boat, and Flank is for emergencies only, giving you a little extra along with a risk of overdoing it.

[sublynx]

I'm happy to confirm the wolfpack thing. I waited a zillion years for the first one, and then I got two in a row

[maillemaker]

Do the wolfpack AI subs attack submerged or on the surface? With guns or torpedoes?

It would rocks if I could use h.sie patch with my Steam copy of the game, but I know I can't patch the .exe.

I'd just buy it again from a patchable source. I bought it again from DirectToDrive to get rid of the StarForce copy protection or whatever it was on my original CD. I think it cost like $10.

I also bought SH5 twice to get a non-steam version for modding.

Steve

[sublynx]

They attack at night, so I've only seen fires lit up at night, and the aftermath. Judging from hydrophone sounds and the way the merchants look shot up (front and rear masts gone, fires here and there), I'd say the wolfpack uses guns.

[BigWalleye]

Originally Posted by banryu79

Me too, but I use the "malfuction" option of SH3Commander.
IIRC this option model engine malfuction caused by agonizing the diesels, but I do not know how differently this aspect is model with the h.sie patch.

As Sailor Steve said, SH3C engine malfunctions and h.sie's Diesel Damage Fix are completely different. They are not "either-or" alternatives, and in fact could stack very well on top of each other.

SH3C engine malfunctions could represent a whole range of serious engine problems. The in-game consequences are decreased maximum speed and/or increased fuel consumption (=decreased range). These - and ALL SH3C malfunctions and sabotage - are NOT repairable at sea. They remain in effect for the duration of the patrol, until (AFAIK) the sub returns to its home port. They can not (again AFAIK) be repaired in a replenishment port. In the case of engine malfunction, they might represent some serious power-reducing problem, like cracked cylinders, a cracked main bearing block, or whatever you might think of.

h.sie's Diesel Damage Fix represents the risk of failure when an IC engine is operated above its maximum rated power. That BTW is exactly what you do when you operate the engines of any vessel above full speed. This does not result (necessarily, ) in immediate breakdown, but the longer the engines are overstressed, the more likely it becomes that a breakdown will occur. ("Captain, the old girl kenna take much more of this!") When a breakdown does occur, top speed is reduced, maybe drastically, and flank speed, even at the reduced top speed, is no longer an option. But the damage sustained is (AFAIK) always repairable at sea, provided you have enough time. (Of course, the escort chasing you may not give you enough time....)

So the 2 certainly can, and should be used together. You don't have to choose one or the other.

[banryu79]

Originally Posted by BigWalleye

As Sailor Steve said, SH3C engine malfunctions and h.sie's Diesel Damage Fix are completely different. They are not "either-or" alternatives, and in fact could stack very well on top of each other.

SH3C engine malfunctions could represent a whole range of serious engine problems. The in-game consequences are decreased maximum speed and/or increased fuel consumption (=decreased range). These - and ALL SH3C malfunctions and sabotage - are NOT repairable at sea. They remain in effect for the duration of the patrol, until (AFAIK) the sub returns to its home port. They can not (again AFAIK) be repaired in a replenishment port. In the case of engine malfunction, they might represent some serious power-reducing problem, like cracked cylinders, a cracked main bearing block, or whatever you might think of.

h.sie's Diesel Damage Fix represents the risk of failure when an IC engine is operated above its maximum rated power. That BTW is exactly what you do when you operate the engines of any vessel above full speed. This does not result (necessarily, ) in immediate breakdown, but the longer the engines are overstressed, the more likely it becomes that a breakdown will occur. ("Captain, the old girl kenna take much more of this!") When a breakdown does occur, top speed is reduced, maybe drastically, and flank speed, even at the reduced top speed, is no longer an option. But the damage sustained is (AFAIK) always repairable at sea, provided you have enough time. (Of course, the escort chasing you may not give you enough time....)

So the 2 certainly can, and should be used together. You don't have to choose one or the other.

Well, thank you all for the explanations. So, after all, that is another thing I count on my SH3 wishlist

I will take a look at that DirectToDrive thing

And I finally found the Desertstrike tutorials on YouTube, amazing!
I will defiantly measure my Kaleun-ness with the prized h.sie call-it-a-patch-but-it-is-truly-a-new-game thingy, arrr!!

EDIT: after a quick survey on Direct2Drive I found they only offer SH5, no SH3...

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by banryu79

Kaleun-ness

I like it!

Kaleunity? Kaleunabilty?

[maillemaker]

Did the Type XXI boats have the same periscope speed limitations? It would seem a shame to have a uboat that can go 17 knots underwater and a periscope that only works under 4.

Does the h.sie mod work the same for all boats?

Steve

[Tupolev]

Originally Posted by maillemaker

Did the Type XXI boats have the same periscope speed limitations? It would seem a shame to have a uboat that can go 17 knots underwater and a periscope that only works under 4.

Does the h.sie mod work the same for all boats?

Steve

The most incredible thing of H.sie's patch is that it allows customization of many of the options.

If you open & edit the hsie.ini file (in the /SilentHunterIII folder) you can change the periscope limitation speeds. While this will affect all boats (and the external camera if you're submerged and exceeding said speeds) you can easily change each parameter depending on what boat you have.

I do recall reading something about the XXI periscopes being reinforced to handle higher submerged speeds. If it was something official or just something I'm remembering from these forums, I can't remember.

T