TOR under attack, security now apparently compromised

Skybird · 12-22-14, 08:22 AM

More total state marching for total victory over free people.

https://blog.torproject.org/blog/pos...le-tor-network

http://article.gmane.org/gmane.network.tor.user/34619

Already earlier it was demoinstrated that the anonymization of TOR had been breached, many users were successfully identified:

https://mice.cs.columbia.edu/getTech...hreportID=1545

http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/f...a-1003330.html

Comply! Obey! Be transparent to the state! Only those who have to hide somethin, must fear...

Oberon · 12-22-14, 08:34 AM

Whenever you build a bigger mouse, there will come along a bigger mousetrap...

mapuc · 12-22-14, 05:23 PM

Made me remember an issue in the Swedish news program some years ago,

It was about this TOR

I seems to recall that the person in the program said that the idea behind this TOR was to give people in dictator controlled country like China a chance to get on the Internet without gettin caught. What the dev team behind this didn't thought off was that it became a tool in the hand of IT-criminals.

And if this new thing can get these criminal behind bars or whatever I clap my hand

But I also cry for those ordinary people how live in China a.s.o

Another news program A police officer said that this TOR was a(forgot the word) and it was impossible to get them

Markus

Catfish · 12-22-14, 05:37 PM

We have to accept secret services know what we write, read, say, and most of 'us' tell them voluntarily, e.g. via Facebook, the cloud, whatever.
Metadata are more treacherus than real mails, because anyone can be found by certain behaviour which he will conduct again and again, even under different names or behind a proxy.

I just cannot point at the event in time, when such things like eavesdropping by the state against all citizens were suddenly "accepted" and "legal", after they were not, for centuries. There was a creeping background-changing of laws, and made-up reasons.

With this scale of eavesdropping, any freedom (also the praised american one) is a joke, and compromised.
Maybe the people should become active, and fight back. There are means, it is the problem the make them popular, and known.

Stealhead · 12-22-14, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

We have to accept secret services know what we write, read, say, and most of 'us' tell them voluntarily, e.g. via Facebook, the cloud, whatever.
Metadata are more treacherus than real mails, because anyone can be found by certain behaviour which he will conduct again and again, even under different names or behind a proxy.

I just cannot point at the event in time, when such things like eavesdropping by the state against all citizens were suddenly "accepted" and "legal", after they were not, for centuries. There was a creeping background-changing of laws, and made-up reasons.

With this scale of eavesdropping, any freedom (also the praised american one) is a joke, and compromised.
Maybe the people should become active, and fight back. There are means, it is the problem the make them popular, and known.

That's true metadata is very traceable a computer can find patterns in seconds that a human might take months or years to connect as the same person. In effect a computer kind find "you" no matter how hard you try to hide.

vanjast · 12-23-14, 02:40 PM

I'm sure the spy agencies would suffer from 'information overload' if they tried to follow everyone. As they say, they are selective... probably brought about from key words and key sites.

Now a word like 'bomb' would now get them excited.. and they're now be monitoring Subsim.
The next trick is for everyone to use the word 'bomb' ... at least 10x a day... spreading the user word usage over time ... they'll just give up with the 'overload'.

Skybird · 12-23-14, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanjast

I'm sure the spy agencies would suffer from 'information overload' if they tried to follow everyone.

Automatized pattern recognition.

Hail to the techno king!

What I fear is when data collected by secret agencies get accessed regularly by the state and its various offices, for more and more "ordinary" tasks. And lets not have illusions - this will be done. First in the hidden, later legalised by laws.

Oberon · 12-23-14, 03:01 PM

Eh, it's like a thousand monkeys on typewriters, you're never going to get enough internet users to co-ordinate a resistance. How 4chan and Anon have managed to get off the ground and become such a heavyweight is still a mystery to many.
In regards to surveillence, they don't really need human input at the other end except for the final product. You just tell a computer to search for combinations of words, and flag them, then if a person uses these words together you get the computer to scan through their internet footprint, if it's found to be an isolated incident then the person is dropped, if it's not then they're flagged again and another stage of computer based investigation takes place. All this can be done in a couple of hours probably, and the Intel agencies have some pretty massive databanks to process data in real time.
It's not that difficult to imagine how it could be done with todays technology, actual human intelligence agents wouldn't be able to handle the workload but a computer can do it easily, and will just present the most flagged members to the intel agency for further investigation.

In regards to increased government surveillance, you can probably point at the deaths of 3000 people in 2001 for that one. It was easy enough for security services to justify increased powers in the aftermath of that, and in the continued fight against Islamic extremism it's easy enough for them to justify a continual growth and expansion.
The atmosphere is turning against them, especially in the wake of wikileaks and that, but honestly it's too little too late, the time that people should have questioned it was 2002/2003, but we were still living under the shadow of the Twin Towers then.
That's just how it goes, sadly, no single entity has the power to reverse it, those who try will just wind up being targetted by the entity they are seeking to destroy, and be painted as terrorists and wind up in a maximum security prison or waterboarded in Poland.

There may come a time when they overreach, push the people just a little too far and a backlash comes back at them, but I doubt it'll be in my lifetime.

ikalugin · 12-24-14, 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

Automatized pattern recognition.

Hail to the techno king!

What I fear is when data collected by secret agencies get accessed regularly by the state and its various offices, for more and more "ordinary" tasks. And lets not have illusions - this will be done. First in the hidden, later legalised by laws.

The issue is not the state accessing it for law enforcement practices (provided the law enforcement works properly), the issue is that the spy agencies are largely unacountable (or not openly acountable) for their actions and sell this data to third parties.

vanjast · 12-24-14, 01:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

Automatized pattern recognition.

Hail to the techno king!

Use the same technology against them...Automated emails or packets would cure that problem. doesn't have to be of the DOS nature, just a continous, erratic, stream of 'internet noise'... soon they won't be able to ID fact from fiction.

12-22-14, 08:22 AM	#1
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,612 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	TOR under attack, security now apparently compromised More total state marching for total victory over free people. https://blog.torproject.org/blog/pos...le-tor-network http://article.gmane.org/gmane.network.tor.user/34619 Already earlier it was demoinstrated that the anonymization of TOR had been breached, many users were successfully identified: https://mice.cs.columbia.edu/getTech...hreportID=1545 http://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/web/f...a-1003330.html Comply! Obey! Be transparent to the state! Only those who have to hide somethin, must fear... __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

12-22-14, 08:34 AM	#2
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Whenever you build a bigger mouse, there will come along a bigger mousetrap...

12-22-14, 05:23 PM	#3
mapuc CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Denmark Posts: 20,537 Downloads: 37 Uploads: 0	Made me remember an issue in the Swedish news program some years ago, It was about this TOR I seems to recall that the person in the program said that the idea behind this TOR was to give people in dictator controlled country like China a chance to get on the Internet without gettin caught. What the dev team behind this didn't thought off was that it became a tool in the hand of IT-criminals. And if this new thing can get these criminal behind bars or whatever I clap my hand But I also cry for those ordinary people how live in China a.s.o Another news program A police officer said that this TOR was a(forgot the word) and it was impossible to get them Markus

12-22-14, 05:37 PM	#4
Catfish Dipped Squirrel Operative Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: ..where the ocean meets the sky Posts: 17,766 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	We have to accept secret services know what we write, read, say, and most of 'us' tell them voluntarily, e.g. via Facebook, the cloud, whatever. Metadata are more treacherus than real mails, because anyone can be found by certain behaviour which he will conduct again and again, even under different names or behind a proxy. I just cannot point at the event in time, when such things like eavesdropping by the state against all citizens were suddenly "accepted" and "legal", after they were not, for centuries. There was a creeping background-changing of laws, and made-up reasons. With this scale of eavesdropping, any freedom (also the praised american one) is a joke, and compromised. Maybe the people should become active, and fight back. There are means, it is the problem the make them popular, and known.

12-23-14, 02:40 PM	#6
vanjast Sea Lord Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Somewhere else now Posts: 1,733 Downloads: 825 Uploads: 4	I'm sure the spy agencies would suffer from 'information overload' if they tried to follow everyone. As they say, they are selective... probably brought about from key words and key sites. Now a word like 'bomb' would now get them excited.. and they're now be monitoring Subsim. The next trick is for everyone to use the word 'bomb' ... at least 10x a day... spreading the user word usage over time ... they'll just give up with the 'overload'.

12-23-14, 03:01 PM	#8
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Eh, it's like a thousand monkeys on typewriters, you're never going to get enough internet users to co-ordinate a resistance. How 4chan and Anon have managed to get off the ground and become such a heavyweight is still a mystery to many. In regards to surveillence, they don't really need human input at the other end except for the final product. You just tell a computer to search for combinations of words, and flag them, then if a person uses these words together you get the computer to scan through their internet footprint, if it's found to be an isolated incident then the person is dropped, if it's not then they're flagged again and another stage of computer based investigation takes place. All this can be done in a couple of hours probably, and the Intel agencies have some pretty massive databanks to process data in real time. It's not that difficult to imagine how it could be done with todays technology, actual human intelligence agents wouldn't be able to handle the workload but a computer can do it easily, and will just present the most flagged members to the intel agency for further investigation. In regards to increased government surveillance, you can probably point at the deaths of 3000 people in 2001 for that one. It was easy enough for security services to justify increased powers in the aftermath of that, and in the continued fight against Islamic extremism it's easy enough for them to justify a continual growth and expansion. The atmosphere is turning against them, especially in the wake of wikileaks and that, but honestly it's too little too late, the time that people should have questioned it was 2002/2003, but we were still living under the shadow of the Twin Towers then. That's just how it goes, sadly, no single entity has the power to reverse it, those who try will just wind up being targetted by the entity they are seeking to destroy, and be painted as terrorists and wind up in a maximum security prison or waterboarded in Poland. There may come a time when they overreach, push the people just a little too far and a backlash comes back at them, but I doubt it'll be in my lifetime.