Traitors or Patriots?

Jimbuna · 06-22-12, 08:35 AM

Half way through the book below and come across a couple of details I was previously unaware of:

The Argentinian VII Brigada Aerea, Helicopteros Marinos had a British engineer , Malcolm Jones, working for them during the Falklands conflict on a South African passport.

What suprised me more was the piece that told of the Escuadron Fenix (a unit flying learjets and similar aircraft tasked with diversion operations, saturating British radars and attracting the Sea Harriers so that the attack escadrilles could reach their targets. It also led the combat escadrilles to the islands, using the VLF Omega navigation system, as well as providing radio relay, reconnaissance, SAR, fast transport, medical evacuation and coastal patrol capabilities)....there were two British citizens living in Argentina, one of them was Jimmy D Harvey, born in England and an ex-RAF pilot veteran of the Second World War and the other was Alan Withington, who flew late in the conflict and had also flown many missions with the RAF during the Second World War, although he had been born in Cordoba to a British family.

The above is not an attempt to provoke any arguments but simply a post on a topic I found to be interesting.

Marcantilan · 06-22-12, 12:31 PM

Helicopteros Marinos is a private company, not related with VII Brigade AAF. Of course, lot of civilians (and civilian companies) offered their services, often free, to the armed forces (same happened in the UK), so sometines the line is not very clear.

In the other hand 554 argentines fought with the RAF in WW2. 122 were killed in action. Many others in the Army and RN (some rugby clubs were disbanded in the early `40s, because most players were fighting for the King! And Argentina goverment was neutrao - or pro-nazi- at the time!)

As you say, one of the survivors fought in the South Atlantic War, in the "Escuadron Fenix" (Withington was Argentine) and also other British veteran, Harvey (who, I think at the time was an Argentine citizen)

Along with other missions, Fenix Sqn did this:

(A Learjet is guiding a flight of Daggers to the islands)

Regards!

Oberon · 06-22-12, 01:42 PM

Indeed, it works both ways. I dare say that somewhere in GHQ was an Argentine born man deciphering messages for the SIS, there may have even been one on board the RN Task Force to help get an insight into the possible actions of the Argentine Armed Forces.

I guess at the time you do what you think you have to do, whether that's putting yourself or your country first, whatever country that may be.

Good find though Jim

Jimbuna · 06-22-12, 03:10 PM

Two great responses...worthy of note regarding the topic and the tone

06-22-12, 08:35 AM	#1
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,500 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	Traitors or Patriots? Half way through the book below and come across a couple of details I was previously unaware of: The Argentinian VII Brigada Aerea, Helicopteros Marinos had a British engineer , Malcolm Jones, working for them during the Falklands conflict on a South African passport. What suprised me more was the piece that told of the Escuadron Fenix (a unit flying learjets and similar aircraft tasked with diversion operations, saturating British radars and attracting the Sea Harriers so that the attack escadrilles could reach their targets. It also led the combat escadrilles to the islands, using the VLF Omega navigation system, as well as providing radio relay, reconnaissance, SAR, fast transport, medical evacuation and coastal patrol capabilities)....there were two British citizens living in Argentina, one of them was Jimmy D Harvey, born in England and an ex-RAF pilot veteran of the Second World War and the other was Alan Withington, who flew late in the conflict and had also flown many missions with the RAF during the Second World War, although he had been born in Cordoba to a British family. The above is not an attempt to provoke any arguments but simply a post on a topic I found to be interesting. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

06-22-12, 12:31 PM	#2
Marcantilan Weps Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina Posts: 374 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Helicopteros Marinos is a private company, not related with VII Brigade AAF. Of course, lot of civilians (and civilian companies) offered their services, often free, to the armed forces (same happened in the UK), so sometines the line is not very clear. In the other hand 554 argentines fought with the RAF in WW2. 122 were killed in action. Many others in the Army and RN (some rugby clubs were disbanded in the early `40s, because most players were fighting for the King! And Argentina goverment was neutrao - or pro-nazi- at the time!) As you say, one of the survivors fought in the South Atlantic War, in the "Escuadron Fenix" (Withington was Argentine) and also other British veteran, Harvey (who, I think at the time was an Argentine citizen) Along with other missions, Fenix Sqn did this: (A Learjet is guiding a flight of Daggers to the islands) Regards! __________________ Ultima Ratio Regis

06-22-12, 03:10 PM	#4
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,500 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	Two great responses...worthy of note regarding the topic and the tone __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

06-22-12, 01:42 PM	#3
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Indeed, it works both ways. I dare say that somewhere in GHQ was an Argentine born man deciphering messages for the SIS, there may have even been one on board the RN Task Force to help get an insight into the possible actions of the Argentine Armed Forces. I guess at the time you do what you think you have to do, whether that's putting yourself or your country first, whatever country that may be. Good find though Jim