TMO fuel consumption at 0 knots

kstanb · 01-17-12, 03:25 PM

With TMO, fuel is consumed while at 0 knots; this eliminated the exploit of extending patrols by simply parking the submarine at the designated patrol area and waiting 96 hours at no fuel cost.

So here my question: is staying at 0 knots in the patrol area preferable to patrolling at ahead 1/3 or 2/3? is it more fuel efficient?

Soviet Creeper · 01-17-12, 03:42 PM

I just dive too 160ft, and surface every now and then for some oxygen. that way I get around the fuel consuming

Sailor Steve · 01-17-12, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kstanb

With TMO, fuel is consumed while at 0 knots; this eliminated the exploit of extending patrols by simply parking the submarine at the designated patrol area and waiting 96 hours at no fuel cost.

So here my question: is staying at 0 knots in the patrol area preferable to patrolling at ahead 1/3 or 2/3? is it more fuel efficient?

I would assume the purpose is to keep you from just sitting and waiting, which as far as I know is something they never did.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soviet Creeper

I just dive too 160ft, and surface every now and then for some oxygen. that way I get around the fuel consuming

And when your batteries are recharging one of your engines is running at flank speed, using more fuel than you saved.

kstanb · 01-17-12, 04:34 PM

[QUOTE=Sailor Steve;1823028]I would assume the purpose is to keep you from just sitting and waiting, which as far as I know is something they never did.

But do you know if the rate of fuel consumption at 0 knots is still below consumption at 1/3 or 2/3?

Ducimus · 01-17-12, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kstanb

With TMO, fuel is consumed while at 0 knots; this eliminated the exploit of extending patrols by simply parking the submarine at the designated patrol area and waiting 96 hours at no fuel cost.

This is actually a base feature in SH4. It deals primarily with how the engine drive is being represented in the game files. The bottom line is, both indirect, and direct drive can be represented in the game.

Fleet boats have an indirect drive (engines as electrical generators which power the Motors which always rotate the props), so where as Sh4 is concerned.the engines are "always on". Even if your standing still at zero knots, your idling an engine. (This is why i chose the engine sounds i used for TMO. Because you'll always hear the engine idleing.l) When you recharge your battery, if you look at the external view, you'll notice both your props are turning.

What I think many don't realize is how fast your going on the surface, effects how long it takes to recharge your batteries. The faster your surface speed, the more electrical power is being put to your motors, and less to recharging the batteries, hence long recharge times. Idle, and you'll find the recharge goes much quicker because electricity is being sent to the battery instead of the motors.

Uboats, have an direct drive. (engines are clutched to either charge the battery or directly drive the prop). With a uboat, if you look at the external view, it should show one prop not turning, with the other turning if recharging your batteries while cruising around on the surface. Because one engine is charging batteries, the other is on propulsion. With Uboats, as far as SH4 is concerned, the engine isn't "always on", so you can sit at zero knots and fast forward time compression tell the cows come home, angels sing, trumpets sound, or an aircraft comes to bomb you to oblivion.

razark · 01-17-12, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kstanb

So here my question: is staying at 0 knots in the patrol area preferable to patrolling at ahead 1/3 or 2/3??

If you're moving, you can search more area. If you're sitting still, you just have to hope the enemy will be kind enough to sail by.

TorpX · 01-18-12, 02:02 AM

In RFB, you can sit still and not use any fuel. At least with the S class boats. I don't consider this a gamey tactic as long as you keep it within reason. Eventually, the groceries run out and you have to go home.

It may not have been done by most Skippers, but O'Kane did this. Contacts were obtained by having lookouts high on the periscope shears and using radar. It was important to see to the greatest possible distance. Radar allowed much better detection at night. The problem with continuous cruising is that it is just as likely a ship will pass behind you in the area you just vacated, as it will pass in front where you are entering. Unless you are moving very fast, you will not improve your contact chances very much.

Loudspeaker · 01-18-12, 11:36 AM

In real life a patrol typically lasted about 45 days, and from game experience I can tell that if you cruise to your patrol area at ahead standard and perhaps a little slower, once you are inside it, you have got just about enough fuel to make your patrols last 45 days. If it was good enough for the real skippers, it's good enough for me.

With all targets moving relatively to your boat, it's hard to tell what is best patrol speed. But if you are patrolling in a narrow strait, you can keep a low speed, stationary alternatively, because targets are forced to pass somewhere near you anyway.

CCIP · 01-18-12, 08:21 PM

Strikes me as a good idea anyway - I don't think any submarine patrols were ever conducted statically (simply because it reduces your probability of making a contact), while subs on the surface do need to consume electric power to run pumps, lights and equipment - and plenty of it. That electric power has to come from somewhere!

denny927 · 01-31-12, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCIP

Strikes me as a good idea anyway - I don't think any submarine patrols were ever conducted statically (simply because it reduces your probability of making a contact), while subs on the surface do need to consume electric power to run pumps, lights and equipment - and plenty of it. That electric power has to come from somewhere!

as far as i know the modern nuclear subs, can still in patrol almost forever, with no need of refuelling, only forced by human necessity(see foods and womans

).

So, in other words, if I understand well, electric power need fuel, and if I turn off my engines, always my fuel level tank will be less and less.
So, again, like the starter of this tread said...is better running at 1/3, 2/3 or is better just sitting and watch?????????????????????????

01-17-12, 03:25 PM	#1
kstanb Sparky Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 153 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	TMO fuel consumption at 0 knots With TMO, fuel is consumed while at 0 knots; this eliminated the exploit of extending patrols by simply parking the submarine at the designated patrol area and waiting 96 hours at no fuel cost. So here my question: is staying at 0 knots in the patrol area preferable to patrolling at ahead 1/3 or 2/3? is it more fuel efficient?

01-17-12, 03:42 PM	#2
Soviet Creeper Planesman Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: In the corner of shame Posts: 187 Downloads: 143 Uploads: 0	I just dive too 160ft, and surface every now and then for some oxygen. that way I get around the fuel consuming __________________ I used to be a huge submarine guy but now I'm a huge submarine girl ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

01-18-12, 02:02 AM	#7
TorpX Silent Hunter Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 3,975 Downloads: 153 Uploads: 11	In RFB, you can sit still and not use any fuel. At least with the S class boats. I don't consider this a gamey tactic as long as you keep it within reason. Eventually, the groceries run out and you have to go home. It may not have been done by most Skippers, but O'Kane did this. Contacts were obtained by having lookouts high on the periscope shears and using radar. It was important to see to the greatest possible distance. Radar allowed much better detection at night. The problem with continuous cruising is that it is just as likely a ship will pass behind you in the area you just vacated, as it will pass in front where you are entering. Unless you are moving very fast, you will not improve your contact chances very much.

01-18-12, 08:21 PM	#9
CCIP Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Waterloo, Canada Posts: 8,700 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 2	Strikes me as a good idea anyway - I don't think any submarine patrols were ever conducted statically (simply because it reduces your probability of making a contact), while subs on the surface do need to consume electric power to run pumps, lights and equipment - and plenty of it. That electric power has to come from somewhere! __________________ There are only forty people in the world and five of them are hamburgers. -Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart)

01-17-12, 04:34 PM	#4
kstanb Sparky Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 153 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	[QUOTE=Sailor Steve;1823028]I would assume the purpose is to keep you from just sitting and waiting, which as far as I know is something they never did. But do you know if the rate of fuel consumption at 0 knots is still below consumption at 1/3 or 2/3?

01-18-12, 11:36 AM	#8
Loudspeaker Bosun Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 69 Downloads: 56 Uploads: 0	In real life a patrol typically lasted about 45 days, and from game experience I can tell that if you cruise to your patrol area at ahead standard and perhaps a little slower, once you are inside it, you have got just about enough fuel to make your patrols last 45 days. If it was good enough for the real skippers, it's good enough for me. With all targets moving relatively to your boat, it's hard to tell what is best patrol speed. But if you are patrolling in a narrow strait, you can keep a low speed, stationary alternatively, because targets are forced to pass somewhere near you anyway.