You just cannot get away from them!!! (Lenghty little tale here ;))

ddiplock · 05-30-11, 06:36 PM

Middle of 1942, took USS Triton (Tambor class) out of Fremantle for her first patrol, one of the first boats to be equipped with the new SJ Surface Radar.

Commander Mack Larkin is surely pleased with this, as with it being his first command should make things alot easier for him and crew. On entering the Sulu Sea, Triton's radar detects a large Japanese TF bearing down on them, detected out at a range of some 8 to 9 miles. Conditions are absolutely perfect, seas calm, no wind and a blazing sun high in the sky!!! Couldn't be better for torpedo actions.

Larkin orderes Triton down to Periscope depth and rigs for SR while they creep along at 2 knots, waiting....waiting as the Japanese TF bears down on them.

Larkin identifies a Japanese Mogami class Heavy Cruiser near the front centre, by far the largest warship in the group. Larkin decides this will be Triton's first kill of the war.

The Task Force moves onwards, as Larkin gently and quietly manuevers Triton into position. Larkin raises the Periscope and is calculating angles and ranges when all hell breaks loose with the high pitched pings of one of the destroyers. Triton has been detected!!! I guess perfect conditions can work against a submarine too.

Larkin lowers the scope and takes Triton and crew deep. Triton is only rated to 250FT test depth, yet the boat makes it down to a staggering 480ft and holds together.

Unfortunatley at this depth, a depth charge lands close by, destroying all the aft tubes and bursting open the bulkheads and damaging the rear dive planes. The crew then races for the next couple of hours, fighting the flooding as Triton sits badly lopsided down deep, her enginss running at flank speed just to maintain depth and stop her from sinking as she slips past the 500 mark.

It may of been luck, or it may of been the TF moved far enough away, but either way, the destroyers broke off their pursuit of Triton. After several repeated ballast blows, Triton breaks the surface.

Larkin no longer comfortable taking his boat into Manila Harbour to snap pictures of Japanese carriers, and, putting his crew ahead of the war effort, and without sinking a SINGLE enemy ship, he orders the boat round and heads back to Austraila!!!

His superiors were disappointed at his lack of aggression shown for so new a submarine commander, but the men didn't begrudge him for bringing them back safe and sound.

Triton's crew have had their first encounter with the Japanese, and all being said went badly wrong for them. They're shaken, but they are determined. Triton will be repaired, and will sail forth again to challenge the Japanese with Mack Larkin leading the way!!!!

Nice little story there, no sinkings, no medals....but I view the fact I brought my boat and crew home to be more important in this regard. I had just better improve my performance next time!!! What a friggin mess. No matter how deep I went, I just could NOT get away from those Japs. Its as if they had stolen ASDIC from the British and could detect me no matter how deep I went, so much for the thermal layer!!!

magic452 · 05-30-11, 07:12 PM

"Conditions are absolutely perfect, seas calm, no wind and a blazing sun high in the sky!!! Couldn't be better for torpedo actions."

These are the worst possible conditions to attack a TF.

Overcast skys, medium or more swells, a good wind. Those are sub conditions. Especially with radar.

But I guess you already learned that.

Good story by the way.

Magic

Stealhead · 05-30-11, 10:19 PM

I always try to have my sub pointed dead at or away from enemy DDs if I think I am going to be near them as they pass(a key for me is to try and observe the patterns of the AS escorts and then try to go to their weak spots) I do this to expose a smaller profile to enemy active sonar and ideally try to have my screws as far away from a TF or convoy to try and minimize the sound of my props.It seems to be part science and part art sneaking in for the kill skilled players can post the science part the art just takes time to learn and you never get it perfect every time.

Another thing you can try against a TF is getting into a good spot and then going deep at all stop and just wait then go back up to PD when you hear that the enemy is near it is tricky but it will work if you get a good basic track before hand. I prefer the top paragraph method though.At least you survived a very bad situation.

Armistead · 05-30-11, 11:01 PM

Sometimes you can't wait for perfect conditions, so you press home the attack.

I probably would've tried to shoot a spread, even at long range after I was pinged.

Could you not do another end around or did you deem it too dangerous

Stealhead · 05-30-11, 11:35 PM

True sometimes your best option is to take what you got and fire a spread even though not simulated in the game in a real war it is going to cost the enemy just for the delay that your harassment has caused them harming the enemy in some way is better than not harming him at all.Hell some of my greatest kills where situations where I did have the best position and had to fire a "hope for the best spread" and I got a CA in the process I was going for a BB.

Anthony W. · 05-31-11, 12:27 AM

I had that happen. I went to 200ft and a depth charge plopped right on my aft deck. I sank to 500ft and went to flanking speed, at a horrible angle in the water. Was charged for 2 days straight. Finally I managed to inch along and surface.

Love fishtales

NorthBeach · 05-31-11, 02:04 AM

"seas calm, no wind and a blazing sun high in the sky"

Yikes!

Depending on how far they were from their destination patience might have been the best tactic. Shadow them from over the horizon until nightfall. Then wreck havoc under the cover of darkness while on the surface.

ddiplock · 05-31-11, 03:29 AM

With conditions as they were, perhaps I was TOO close for comfort. Had I not been detected, I would've easily been under 1000yds distance for a shot. And with FOUR destroyers up front zigging around, its perhaps no wonder I was found perhaps. In future I might position myself farther out, see how I do.

I somewhat disagree with a comment above, with winds and swells being ideal submarine weather. Sure they help hide your submarine, but it makes target calculations really tricky through the scope as the water is always washing over the lense. I can't tell the number of times I abandon an attack on a target because you just can't see them through the scope unless you are REALLY close. Quite often I detect targets in rough seas and just ignore them, superiors would not be pleased ahaha.

Hell of an experience though. Though it IS annoying that you can't seem to escape the Japs if they detect you. And with the depth dial in the conning tower only rated to 600 feet, that's pretty much as far down as you'll be able to go.

commandosolo2009 · 05-31-11, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddiplock

With conditions as they were, perhaps I was TOO close for comfort. Had I not been detected, I would've easily been under 1000yds distance for a shot. And with FOUR destroyers up front zigging around, its perhaps no wonder I was found perhaps. In future I might position myself farther out, see how I do.

I somewhat disagree with a comment above, with winds and swells being ideal submarine weather. Sure they help hide your submarine, but it makes target calculations really tricky through the scope as the water is always washing over the lense. I can't tell the number of times I abandon an attack on a target because you just can't see them through the scope unless you are REALLY close. Quite often I detect targets in rough seas and just ignore them, superiors would not be pleased ahaha.

Hell of an experience though. Though it IS annoying that you can't seem to escape the Japs if they detect you. And with the depth dial in the conning tower only rated to 600 feet, that's pretty much as far down as you'll be able to go.

"seas calm, no wind and a blazing sun high in the sky"

BAD

"rough seas, wind, no moon" the orgasm of a sub skipper.

I gotta tell ya, if water washes your lens, take her up a few meters, and be sure to have the periscope draft fix by ancient or webster and spare having a stick-out.

I dont think AI will be that aware upto 15 meters, and this should get you on the way.

Anyways, next time, do include some photos from the hunt. Nice telling up there

Regards,
CS2k9

Daniel Prates · 05-31-11, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddiplock

With conditions as they were, perhaps I was TOO close for comfort. Had I not been detected, I would've easily been under 1000yds distance for a shot. And with FOUR destroyers up front zigging around, its perhaps no wonder I was found perhaps. In future I might position myself farther out, see how I do.

Jeeez. Getting as close as one klick and not being seen by 4 DDs?

ddiplock · 05-31-11, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Prates

Jeeez. Getting as close as one klick and not being seen by 4 DDs?

Yeah, I came right in pretty much from the front with them clipping towards me. I was in far enough that one of the destroyers passed me by without detecting me. The other one, further behind, meant I was in alot closer by the time he was going past.

And thus behold, I was detected.

magic452 · 05-31-11, 07:30 PM

I've taken my boat up to about 50 feet and remained underacted at 1,500 to 2000 yards in heavy seas. 50 to 55 feet will usually clear the scope.

There are times you must attack in clear conditions, when that happens I'll use a constant bearing attack form longer range if I can set one up.

Magic

NorthBeach · 06-01-11, 01:37 AM

"but it makes target calculations really tricky through the scope as the water is always washing over the lens."

You have radar and sonar, why do you need to make any calculations with the scope? You have the tools to get course and speed. You only have to get close enough to the track for the torpedoes to reach it. After you've used the scope to id friend or foe and have an idea of the class of target (in order to set best depth of the fish) you don't really need the scope. It's just one more pokey uppy thing that creates sea foam for your targets to see.

ddiplock · 06-01-11, 05:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NorthBeach

"but it makes target calculations really tricky through the scope as the water is always washing over the lens."

You have radar and sonar, why do you need to make any calculations with the scope? You have the tools to get course and speed. You only have to get close enough to the track for the torpedoes to reach it. After you've used the scope to id friend or foe and have an idea of the class of target (in order to set best depth of the fish) you don't really need the scope. It's just one more pokey uppy thing that creates sea foam for your targets to see.

Yes, but in order to get close enough for the torps to impact their targets, you will need to be submerged to avoid detection. Try getting in close enough on the surface for a torp shot and you get spotted

NorthBeach · 06-02-11, 11:52 PM

If you made them on radar, and they are making less than 20+ kts, you should have time and distance to plot course and speed while getting ahead of them at an angle that will put you in torp distance before pulling the plug. In rough seas and high wind you can bugger off at flank from a surprisingly close proximity without being detected. Weather puts you at the advantage!

05-30-11, 06:36 PM	#1
ddiplock Samurai Navy Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Scotland, UK Posts: 552 Downloads: 31 Uploads: 0	You just cannot get away from them!!! (Lenghty little tale here ;)) Middle of 1942, took USS Triton (Tambor class) out of Fremantle for her first patrol, one of the first boats to be equipped with the new SJ Surface Radar. Commander Mack Larkin is surely pleased with this, as with it being his first command should make things alot easier for him and crew. On entering the Sulu Sea, Triton's radar detects a large Japanese TF bearing down on them, detected out at a range of some 8 to 9 miles. Conditions are absolutely perfect, seas calm, no wind and a blazing sun high in the sky!!! Couldn't be better for torpedo actions. Larkin orderes Triton down to Periscope depth and rigs for SR while they creep along at 2 knots, waiting....waiting as the Japanese TF bears down on them. Larkin identifies a Japanese Mogami class Heavy Cruiser near the front centre, by far the largest warship in the group. Larkin decides this will be Triton's first kill of the war. The Task Force moves onwards, as Larkin gently and quietly manuevers Triton into position. Larkin raises the Periscope and is calculating angles and ranges when all hell breaks loose with the high pitched pings of one of the destroyers. Triton has been detected!!! I guess perfect conditions can work against a submarine too. Larkin lowers the scope and takes Triton and crew deep. Triton is only rated to 250FT test depth, yet the boat makes it down to a staggering 480ft and holds together. Unfortunatley at this depth, a depth charge lands close by, destroying all the aft tubes and bursting open the bulkheads and damaging the rear dive planes. The crew then races for the next couple of hours, fighting the flooding as Triton sits badly lopsided down deep, her enginss running at flank speed just to maintain depth and stop her from sinking as she slips past the 500 mark. It may of been luck, or it may of been the TF moved far enough away, but either way, the destroyers broke off their pursuit of Triton. After several repeated ballast blows, Triton breaks the surface. Larkin no longer comfortable taking his boat into Manila Harbour to snap pictures of Japanese carriers, and, putting his crew ahead of the war effort, and without sinking a SINGLE enemy ship, he orders the boat round and heads back to Austraila!!! His superiors were disappointed at his lack of aggression shown for so new a submarine commander, but the men didn't begrudge him for bringing them back safe and sound. Triton's crew have had their first encounter with the Japanese, and all being said went badly wrong for them. They're shaken, but they are determined. Triton will be repaired, and will sail forth again to challenge the Japanese with Mack Larkin leading the way!!!! Nice little story there, no sinkings, no medals....but I view the fact I brought my boat and crew home to be more important in this regard. I had just better improve my performance next time!!! What a friggin mess. No matter how deep I went, I just could NOT get away from those Japs. Its as if they had stolen ASDIC from the British and could detect me no matter how deep I went, so much for the thermal layer!!!

05-30-11, 07:12 PM	#2
magic452 Sea Lord Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Reno Nevada USA Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	"Conditions are absolutely perfect, seas calm, no wind and a blazing sun high in the sky!!! Couldn't be better for torpedo actions." These are the worst possible conditions to attack a TF. Overcast skys, medium or more swells, a good wind. Those are sub conditions. Especially with radar. But I guess you already learned that. Good story by the way. Magic __________________ Reported lost 11 Feb. 1942 Signature by depthtok33l

05-31-11, 12:27 AM	#6
Anthony W. Grey Wolf Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Central Indiana Posts: 850 Downloads: 130 Uploads: 0	I had that happen. I went to 200ft and a depth charge plopped right on my aft deck. I sank to 500ft and went to flanking speed, at a horrible angle in the water. Was charged for 2 days straight. Finally I managed to inch along and surface. Love fishtales __________________ Sunken Mustangs Proud Ford Mustang owner "Damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead!" - Admiral David Farragut Run silent - run deep - keep the baffles clear - targets front and center. Private pilot and history buff

05-31-11, 07:30 PM	#12
magic452 Sea Lord Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Reno Nevada USA Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	I've taken my boat up to about 50 feet and remained underacted at 1,500 to 2000 yards in heavy seas. 50 to 55 feet will usually clear the scope. There are times you must attack in clear conditions, when that happens I'll use a constant bearing attack form longer range if I can set one up. Magic __________________ Reported lost 11 Feb. 1942 Signature by depthtok33l

05-30-11, 10:19 PM	#3
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	I always try to have my sub pointed dead at or away from enemy DDs if I think I am going to be near them as they pass(a key for me is to try and observe the patterns of the AS escorts and then try to go to their weak spots) I do this to expose a smaller profile to enemy active sonar and ideally try to have my screws as far away from a TF or convoy to try and minimize the sound of my props.It seems to be part science and part art sneaking in for the kill skilled players can post the science part the art just takes time to learn and you never get it perfect every time. Another thing you can try against a TF is getting into a good spot and then going deep at all stop and just wait then go back up to PD when you hear that the enemy is near it is tricky but it will work if you get a good basic track before hand. I prefer the top paragraph method though.At least you survived a very bad situation.

05-30-11, 11:01 PM	#4
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,864 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Sometimes you can't wait for perfect conditions, so you press home the attack. I probably would've tried to shoot a spread, even at long range after I was pinged. Could you not do another end around or did you deem it too dangerous

05-30-11, 11:35 PM	#5
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	True sometimes your best option is to take what you got and fire a spread even though not simulated in the game in a real war it is going to cost the enemy just for the delay that your harassment has caused them harming the enemy in some way is better than not harming him at all.Hell some of my greatest kills where situations where I did have the best position and had to fire a "hope for the best spread" and I got a CA in the process I was going for a BB.

05-31-11, 02:04 AM	#7
NorthBeach Torpedoman Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Francisco Posts: 112 Downloads: 216 Uploads: 0	"seas calm, no wind and a blazing sun high in the sky" Yikes! Depending on how far they were from their destination patience might have been the best tactic. Shadow them from over the horizon until nightfall. Then wreck havoc under the cover of darkness while on the surface.

05-31-11, 03:29 AM	#8
ddiplock Samurai Navy Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Scotland, UK Posts: 552 Downloads: 31 Uploads: 0	With conditions as they were, perhaps I was TOO close for comfort. Had I not been detected, I would've easily been under 1000yds distance for a shot. And with FOUR destroyers up front zigging around, its perhaps no wonder I was found perhaps. In future I might position myself farther out, see how I do. I somewhat disagree with a comment above, with winds and swells being ideal submarine weather. Sure they help hide your submarine, but it makes target calculations really tricky through the scope as the water is always washing over the lense. I can't tell the number of times I abandon an attack on a target because you just can't see them through the scope unless you are REALLY close. Quite often I detect targets in rough seas and just ignore them, superiors would not be pleased ahaha. Hell of an experience though. Though it IS annoying that you can't seem to escape the Japs if they detect you. And with the depth dial in the conning tower only rated to 600 feet, that's pretty much as far down as you'll be able to go.

06-01-11, 01:37 AM	#13
NorthBeach Torpedoman Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Francisco Posts: 112 Downloads: 216 Uploads: 0	"but it makes target calculations really tricky through the scope as the water is always washing over the lens." You have radar and sonar, why do you need to make any calculations with the scope? You have the tools to get course and speed. You only have to get close enough to the track for the torpedoes to reach it. After you've used the scope to id friend or foe and have an idea of the class of target (in order to set best depth of the fish) you don't really need the scope. It's just one more pokey uppy thing that creates sea foam for your targets to see.

06-02-11, 11:52 PM	#15
NorthBeach Torpedoman Join Date: May 2008 Location: San Francisco Posts: 112 Downloads: 216 Uploads: 0	If you made them on radar, and they are making less than 20+ kts, you should have time and distance to plot course and speed while getting ahead of them at an angle that will put you in torp distance before pulling the plug. In rough seas and high wind you can bugger off at flank from a surprisingly close proximity without being detected. Weather puts you at the advantage!