Thoughts on UnitTypes and coastal trafic

Mikhayl · 07-16-09, 02:56 AM

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rowi58 · 07-16-09, 05:13 AM

Hi Mikhayl,

first of all, i agree with you: the number of classes for (coastal) merchant ship is to low. In 2006, when AG124 released his famous “LightShip”, I tried to use the “UnitTyp=100” class for this ship. I used the UnitType=100 class for Anvarts illuminated ship too.

So, a very small number of ships were classified as UnitType 100. Then I scripted them into the SCR (not RND). But with this “classification”, sometimes i got CTD when approaching to these ships (not every time, but sometimes).

Therefore I changed the “LightShip” to UnitType=12 (this class is renamed into “Auxiliary Ship” instead of “Minelayer”) and the illuminated ships back into UnitType 102 (and created a new Nation: “RedCross”). Since that, I never got CTD with these ships again.

I don’t know why this happened with the “UnitType=100” classification. But from that time, I never used “UnitType=100 again”. So have an eye on this class.

Greetings
rowi58

Graf Paper · 07-19-09, 05:31 AM

I like where this is going. I've also been one who has tended to miss the more "alive" feeling you get with lots of small coastal traffic, usually only found in harbors as it currently stands.

I wanted to work up such a mod, not just for the random but the scripted layer as well, but I know nothing about how unit types work so the only course left open to me was the very daunting task of adding these small ships and coastal convoys by hand.

The work I did with the SCR, RND, and LND layers, when I was creating the CSP Online Mod and making layered multiplayer missions, gave me some good lessons on how the layers work together and plenty of experience with the Mission Editor. It's always been most fun for me when a mission takes place near enough to shore that I can populate my creations with all those fishing boats, tugs, and small merchants, etc.

I'd be happy to help test this idea and even happier if anyone can explain the unit types so I could properly alter and re-script them.

Graf Paper · 07-21-09, 05:42 AM

Notepad++ works very well with the .mis files SH3 uses for the campaign layers as well as the missions.

See if Notepad++'s "Find/Replace" feature might do the trick for whittling this task down to size.

Meanwhile, I'll do some study on the info you've so kindly provided, Mikhayl. Thank you very much for that!

linerkiller · 07-21-09, 06:29 AM

In my opinion Gwx spawning system is the best for coastal traffic...And making escort DDs behaving like merchant ships wouldn't be a bad thing at all...since it would make S-boat attacks a more realistic experience

Are you talking about S-boot mod, aren't you

?

Graf Paper · 07-21-09, 08:52 PM

Notepad++'s Search/Replace feature is very flexible, allowing the use of Boolean operators, wildcards, case, partial matches, strict matches, and regular expressions. It's not Vi or Emacs but it's also more manageable for those smaller jobs I'm used to.

I've got some real-world matters that are going to keep me tied up for a couple of days but I'm eager to tinker with this idea.

Thank you for your kindness, Mikhayl, in sharing some lessons and being just an all-around good fellow. We need more modders like you!

karamazovnew · 07-24-09, 11:10 PM

Does that mean that we won't see lone Coastal Merchant in the middle of the Atlantic anymore? Or convoys made up of 30 Tramp Steamers? Or Large Merchants making the "long" trip from Calais to Dover? Actually, that last one would be nice. My favourite one was seeing a lone tugboat smack in the middle of the Atlantic. I called it "Andrea Gail" syndrome

.
I don't have any answers to your questions, but you actually answered most of my questions regarding the UnitTypes

.

iambecomelife · 07-26-09, 03:45 PM

Great ideas in this thread. FYI I eventually hope to do a revision of merchant traffic with similar recategorization - appropriate ship size depending on the vessel route, plus more balanced convoys so that huge ships are rare. Also I would like to clone the merchants so that they are in ballast or low in the water, depending on what their destination is.

07-16-09, 02:56 AM	#1
Mikhayl Captain Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 485 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	Thoughts on UnitTypes and coastal trafic --- Last edited by Mikhayl; 02-10-10 at 12:44 PM.

07-16-09, 05:13 AM	#2
rowi58 Eternal Patrol Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Karlsruhe Posts: 679 Downloads: 56 Uploads: 0	Hi Mikhayl, first of all, i agree with you: the number of classes for (coastal) merchant ship is to low. In 2006, when AG124 released his famous “LightShip”, I tried to use the “UnitTyp=100” class for this ship. I used the UnitType=100 class for Anvarts illuminated ship too. So, a very small number of ships were classified as UnitType 100. Then I scripted them into the SCR (not RND). But with this “classification”, sometimes i got CTD when approaching to these ships (not every time, but sometimes). Therefore I changed the “LightShip” to UnitType=12 (this class is renamed into “Auxiliary Ship” instead of “Minelayer”) and the illuminated ships back into UnitType 102 (and created a new Nation: “RedCross”). Since that, I never got CTD with these ships again. I don’t know why this happened with the “UnitType=100” classification. But from that time, I never used “UnitType=100 again”. So have an eye on this class. Greetings rowi58 __________________

07-19-09, 05:31 AM	#3
Graf Paper Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Pacific Northwest United States Posts: 1,146 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 2	I like where this is going. I've also been one who has tended to miss the more "alive" feeling you get with lots of small coastal traffic, usually only found in harbors as it currently stands. I wanted to work up such a mod, not just for the random but the scripted layer as well, but I know nothing about how unit types work so the only course left open to me was the very daunting task of adding these small ships and coastal convoys by hand. The work I did with the SCR, RND, and LND layers, when I was creating the CSP Online Mod and making layered multiplayer missions, gave me some good lessons on how the layers work together and plenty of experience with the Mission Editor. It's always been most fun for me when a mission takes place near enough to shore that I can populate my creations with all those fishing boats, tugs, and small merchants, etc. I'd be happy to help test this idea and even happier if anyone can explain the unit types so I could properly alter and re-script them. __________________ Still sailing the high seas, hunting convoys with those who join me.

07-21-09, 05:42 AM	#4
Graf Paper Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Pacific Northwest United States Posts: 1,146 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 2	Notepad++ works very well with the .mis files SH3 uses for the campaign layers as well as the missions. See if Notepad++'s "Find/Replace" feature might do the trick for whittling this task down to size. Meanwhile, I'll do some study on the info you've so kindly provided, Mikhayl. Thank you very much for that! __________________ Still sailing the high seas, hunting convoys with those who join me.

07-21-09, 06:29 AM	#5
linerkiller Captain Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Modena,Italy Posts: 486 Downloads: 36 Uploads: 0	In my opinion Gwx spawning system is the best for coastal traffic...And making escort DDs behaving like merchant ships wouldn't be a bad thing at all...since it would make S-boat attacks a more realistic experience Are you talking about S-boot mod, aren't you? __________________ "A hard drill makes an easy battle" Alexander V. Suvorov "When we realized that our clubbing and kickings were being administered by the burned, mutilated survivors of our handiwork, we found we could take it with less prejudice." Captain Richard "Dick" O'Kane-USS Tang http://www.youtube.com/user/willembrock

07-21-09, 08:52 PM	#6
Graf Paper Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Pacific Northwest United States Posts: 1,146 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 2	Notepad++'s Search/Replace feature is very flexible, allowing the use of Boolean operators, wildcards, case, partial matches, strict matches, and regular expressions. It's not Vi or Emacs but it's also more manageable for those smaller jobs I'm used to. I've got some real-world matters that are going to keep me tied up for a couple of days but I'm eager to tinker with this idea. Thank you for your kindness, Mikhayl, in sharing some lessons and being just an all-around good fellow. We need more modders like you! __________________ Still sailing the high seas, hunting convoys with those who join me.

07-24-09, 11:10 PM	#7
karamazovnew The Old Man Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Bucharest, Romania Posts: 1,403 Downloads: 151 Uploads: 0	Does that mean that we won't see lone Coastal Merchant in the middle of the Atlantic anymore? Or convoys made up of 30 Tramp Steamers? Or Large Merchants making the "long" trip from Calais to Dover? Actually, that last one would be nice. My favourite one was seeing a lone tugboat smack in the middle of the Atlantic. I called it "Andrea Gail" syndrome . I don't have any answers to your questions, but you actually answered most of my questions regarding the UnitTypes .

07-26-09, 03:45 PM	#8
iambecomelife Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 4,706 Downloads: 300 Uploads: 0	Great ideas in this thread. FYI I eventually hope to do a revision of merchant traffic with similar recategorization - appropriate ship size depending on the vessel route, plus more balanced convoys so that huge ships are rare. Also I would like to clone the merchants so that they are in ballast or low in the water, depending on what their destination is. __________________ https://www.facebook.com/WolvesoftheKaiser/