Torpedo attack in extremely foggy wheater (realistic)

Nuoz · 06-25-07, 09:34 AM

Whats' the procedure in these cases? It's nearly impossible to find and enter AoB, Speed and range in time for a perfect shot. What do you, the more experinced captains do in these situations?

06-25-07, 09:45 AM

I just give up unless I runt into another ship. Than just a quick T1 full speed snap shot which from 300m can't miss. Just point your scope, feel how the target moves and go for it. In case this is a small cargo I also give it up. Chasing in the fog is a waste of time and fuel for me, also very dangerous when a DD can show up from nowhere...

XLjedi · 06-25-07, 09:52 AM

If it's a radio contact, I can easily sink it BVR.

irish1958 · 06-25-07, 10:08 AM

If late enough in the war, radar helps.

SmokinTep · 06-25-07, 10:21 AM

I like the foggy/rough weather. Some of my best convoy attacks were during bad weather.

Nuoz · 06-25-07, 10:24 AM

There must be a way. The main problem i find is the UZO magnification is too big for me to calculate and roughly enter the AoB. Point and shoot isnt any good if you dont get a measure of speed and where the ship is heading

Nuoz · 06-25-07, 10:25 AM

The only thing i managed to do well while in bad weather is dock hunting

Canovaro · 06-25-07, 10:46 AM

If you got a contact update earlier, you only have to do one observation to calculate course and speed. After the observation, get out of sight and use the map to set a parallel course at 400-700 meters. Go to per. depth and use the hydrophone to determine the relative bearing to your target. Then draw a line to estimate the range. Then you have all the info to do a 90 degrees shot.

Good luck.

Jimbuna · 06-25-07, 10:54 AM

I prefer to chart the course from constant hydrophone readings

XLjedi · 06-25-07, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nuoz

There must be a way. The main problem i find is the UZO magnification is too big for me to calculate and roughly enter the AoB. Point and shoot isnt any good if you dont get a measure of speed and where the ship is heading

If you have a radio contact, you already have heading and an estimate for speed (slow = 6kts in SH3)

If you place yourself ahead of the target and line up 90° abeam, all you have to do is set the TDC for a fast-90 solution. Then the AoB will automatically calculate for you wherever you happen to point the wire.

Then you just tell your hydro guy to track the target... as he calls out bearings you point the scope at the bearing. You point at 340° or 20° and when the hydro guy calls out 340° or 20° you fire and wait for the boom.

The nice thing is, if you don't sink the merchant, you usually at least set it on fire and it's much easier to see.

Distance is not an issue...

In really bad weather I can carryout this type of attack with my scope not even breaking the surface. I'm not using it for a visual, it's just an aiming device.

That's the easy example using a radio contact. If I don't have a radio contact to go by, but I'm within hydro distance... I can use TMA to determine heading and I have a few other tricks for triangulating on the position.

kiwi_2005 · 06-25-07, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronblood

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nuoz

There must be a way. The main problem i find is the UZO magnification is too big for me to calculate and roughly enter the AoB. Point and shoot isnt any good if you dont get a measure of speed and where the ship is heading

If you have a radio contact, you already have heading and an estimate for speed (slow = 6kts in SH3)

If you place yourself ahead of the target and line up 90° abeam, all you have to do is set the TDC for a fast-90 solution. Then the AoB will automatically calculate for you wherever you happen to point the wire.

Then you just tell your hydro guy to track the target... as he calls out bearings you point the scope at the bearing. You point at 340° or 20° and when the hydro guy calls out 340° or 20° you fire and wait for the boom.

The nice thing is, if you don't sink the merchant, you usually at least set it on fire and it's much easier to see.

Distance is not an issue...

In really bad weather I can carryout this type of attack with my scope not even breaking the surface. I'm not using it for a visual, it's just an aiming device.

That's the easy example using a radio contact. If I don't have a radio contact to go by, but I'm within hydro distance... I can use TMA to determine heading and I have a few other tricks for triangulating on the position.

Couldn't of said it better.

06-25-07, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aaronblood

In really bad weather I can carryout this type of attack with my scope not even breaking the surface. I'm not using it for a visual, it's just an aiming device.

Great but what if this is a neutral 17k tanker or a hospital ship? How do you explain this to BdU?

XLjedi · 06-25-07, 12:37 PM

In the game, I just don't worry bout it... sometimes, depending on the grid, I may exercise some restraint. But usually I just sink em.

What's interesting though is sometimes when I attack like this the merchant sinks before I make visual contact and I get credit for the tonnage but the sunk ship icon appears gray instead of red.

But even IRL, if a friendly was traversing certain areas known to be patrolled by uboats, BdU would make their presence known. I know of at least one situation where a Kaleun was brought up on court martial charges for sinking such a ship... but he was found to be not at fault cuz the ship was 100 miles out of it's reported position.

Corsair · 06-25-07, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nuoz

Whats' the procedure in these cases? It's nearly impossible to find and enter AoB, Speed and range in time for a perfect shot. What do you, the more experinced captains do in these situations?

Dive, head south and wait for better days...

joegrundman · 06-25-07, 07:59 PM

Apart from the fact that it is boring, time consuming, difficult and irritating, there are two ways that I regularly use to get at least a reasonable number of kills during those fortnight long storms that apparently we Englishers live with. Both depend on being submerged somwhere with plenty of contacts, e.g. any of the approaches to Great Britain, neither depend on radar or active sonar so can be used early war. Surface only to recharge batteries.

The first is a somewhat unhistorical but very effective target motion analysis described here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=110619

the second is the method i described in the article in my sig link which is similar to late war us submarine doctrine and utilises the SACF, or Is-was. You have built yourself an Is-was, haven't you?

06-25-07, 09:34 AM	#1
Nuoz Sparky Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Here Posts: 155 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Torpedo attack in extremely foggy wheater (realistic) Whats' the procedure in these cases? It's nearly impossible to find and enter AoB, Speed and range in time for a perfect shot. What do you, the more experinced captains do in these situations? __________________ "Listen, 'sir', it's real simple. Add the number of times we dive to the number of times we surface. Divide that number by two. If the result doesn't come out even, don't open the hatch"

06-25-07, 09:52 AM	#3
XLjedi Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Palm Beach, Florida Posts: 1,243 Downloads: 53 Uploads: 8	If it's a radio contact, I can easily sink it BVR. __________________

06-25-07, 10:08 AM	#4
irish1958 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Carmel, Indiana Posts: 3,250 Downloads: 320 Uploads: 11	If late enough in the war, radar helps. __________________ Irish1958

06-25-07, 10:24 AM	#6
Nuoz Sparky Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Here Posts: 155 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	There must be a way. The main problem i find is the UZO magnification is too big for me to calculate and roughly enter the AoB. Point and shoot isnt any good if you dont get a measure of speed and where the ship is heading __________________ "Listen, 'sir', it's real simple. Add the number of times we dive to the number of times we surface. Divide that number by two. If the result doesn't come out even, don't open the hatch"

06-25-07, 10:25 AM	#7
Nuoz Sparky Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Here Posts: 155 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	The only thing i managed to do well while in bad weather is dock hunting __________________ "Listen, 'sir', it's real simple. Add the number of times we dive to the number of times we surface. Divide that number by two. If the result doesn't come out even, don't open the hatch"

06-25-07, 09:45 AM	#2
Hadrys Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I just give up unless I runt into another ship. Than just a quick T1 full speed snap shot which from 300m can't miss. Just point your scope, feel how the target moves and go for it. In case this is a small cargo I also give it up. Chasing in the fog is a waste of time and fuel for me, also very dangerous when a DD can show up from nowhere...

06-25-07, 10:21 AM	#5
SmokinTep Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Suffolk, Virginia Posts: 1,027 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I like the foggy/rough weather. Some of my best convoy attacks were during bad weather.

06-25-07, 10:46 AM	#8
Canovaro Ace of the Deep Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Netherlands Posts: 1,062 Downloads: 34 Uploads: 0	If you got a contact update earlier, you only have to do one observation to calculate course and speed. After the observation, get out of sight and use the map to set a parallel course at 400-700 meters. Go to per. depth and use the hydrophone to determine the relative bearing to your target. Then draw a line to estimate the range. Then you have all the info to do a 90 degrees shot. Good luck.

06-25-07, 10:54 AM	#9
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,473 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	I prefer to chart the course from constant hydrophone readings __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

06-25-07, 12:37 PM	#13
XLjedi Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Palm Beach, Florida Posts: 1,243 Downloads: 53 Uploads: 8	In the game, I just don't worry bout it... sometimes, depending on the grid, I may exercise some restraint. But usually I just sink em. What's interesting though is sometimes when I attack like this the merchant sinks before I make visual contact and I get credit for the tonnage but the sunk ship icon appears gray instead of red. But even IRL, if a friendly was traversing certain areas known to be patrolled by uboats, BdU would make their presence known. I know of at least one situation where a Kaleun was brought up on court martial charges for sinking such a ship... but he was found to be not at fault cuz the ship was 100 miles out of it's reported position. __________________

06-25-07, 07:59 PM	#15
joegrundman Ocean Warrior Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,689 Downloads: 34 Uploads: 0	Apart from the fact that it is boring, time consuming, difficult and irritating, there are two ways that I regularly use to get at least a reasonable number of kills during those fortnight long storms that apparently we Englishers live with. Both depend on being submerged somwhere with plenty of contacts, e.g. any of the approaches to Great Britain, neither depend on radar or active sonar so can be used early war. Surface only to recharge batteries. The first is a somewhat unhistorical but very effective target motion analysis described here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=110619 the second is the method i described in the article in my sig link which is similar to late war us submarine doctrine and utilises the SACF, or Is-was. You have built yourself an Is-was, haven't you? __________________ "Enemy submarines are to be called U-Boats. The term submarine is to be reserved for Allied under water vessels. U-Boats are those dastardly villains who sink our ships, while submarines are those gallant and noble craft which sink theirs." Winston Churchill