WWII US sub losses

acetoolguy · 06-05-07, 09:25 PM

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq39-1.htm

interesting site

Reaves · 06-05-07, 10:35 PM

Cisco (SS-290) 28 Sep 43 76 killed
Sunk by Japanese observation seaplane (945th Kokutai) and gunboat
Karatsu [ex-U.S. river gunboat Luzon (PR-7)] in Sulu Sea off Panay
Island.

Sunk by an ex-US river gunboat? Nasty.

Von Tonner · 06-06-07, 04:30 AM

Thanks for that site Acetoolguy. I think I counted 40 odd boats destroyed by enemy contact and another 18 odd by other means such as sea and mechanical.

What I am finding hard to understand, is that given the above stats, how can some argue that upping the A1 in the game is unrealistic as the IJN were not that good at destroying subs. I think Beery (and I stand to be corrected) for example, argues that the vanilla A1 is correct. That statistically one should have up to 50 patrols for every one 'death screen'.

With a Real loss of over 50 odd subs it would not appear to me that the Pacific theatre of war was a 'walk in the park' for any sub commander and his crew.

To get a really true picture I would be interested to know the total amount of patrols taken and total number of subs that accrued these patrols - anyone know?

Pablo · 06-06-07, 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Von Tonner

To get a really true picture I would be interested to know the total amount of patrols taken and total number of subs that accrued these patrols - anyone know?

Hi!

Clay Blair in Silent Victory has data for every patrol in the Pacific. I glanced through the results through December 1942: six submarines lost in 335 patrols, or on the order of about one in 50.

Pablo

Von Tonner · 06-06-07, 10:37 AM

Thanks for the stats on 1942 Pablo but to get a true picture the operative word is "total". i. e. The entire war years from the first patrol to the last - only then will one be able to say 1942 stats are the average. It might well be that 1942 was a good or bad year, only a full picture will tell.

vatek · 06-06-07, 11:56 AM

Tullibee (SS-284) 26 Mar 44 79 died
Accidentally sunk by circular run of own torpedo off Palau Islands.

Tang (SS-306) 24 Oct 44 78 died, 9 POWs
Accidentally sunk by circular run of own torpedo in Formosa Strait.

Damned circle runners...

06-05-07, 09:25 PM	#1
acetoolguy A-ganger Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 74 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 0	WWII US sub losses http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq39-1.htm interesting site

06-05-07, 10:35 PM	#2
Reaves The Old Man Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 1,509 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	*Cisco* (SS-290) 28 Sep 43 76 killed Sunk by Japanese observation seaplane (945th Kokutai) and gunboat Karatsu [ex-U.S. river gunboat Luzon (PR-7)] in Sulu Sea off Panay Island. Sunk by an ex-US river gunboat? Nasty. __________________

06-06-07, 04:30 AM	#3
Von Tonner Seasoned Skipper Join Date: May 2005 Location: South Africa Posts: 711 Downloads: 44 Uploads: 0	Thanks for that site Acetoolguy. I think I counted 40 odd boats destroyed by enemy contact and another 18 odd by other means such as sea and mechanical. What I am finding hard to understand, is that given the above stats, how can some argue that upping the A1 in the game is unrealistic as the IJN were not that good at destroying subs. I think Beery (and I stand to be corrected) for example, argues that the vanilla A1 is correct. That statistically one should have up to 50 patrols for every one 'death screen'. With a Real loss of over 50 odd subs it would not appear to me that the Pacific theatre of war was a 'walk in the park' for any sub commander and his crew. To get a really true picture I would be interested to know the total amount of patrols taken and total number of subs that accrued these patrols - anyone know?

06-06-07, 10:37 AM	#5
Von Tonner Seasoned Skipper Join Date: May 2005 Location: South Africa Posts: 711 Downloads: 44 Uploads: 0	Thanks for the stats on 1942 Pablo but to get a true picture the operative word is "total". i. e. The entire war years from the first patrol to the last - only then will one be able to say 1942 stats are the average. It might well be that 1942 was a good or bad year, only a full picture will tell.

06-06-07, 11:56 AM	#6
vatek Sailor man Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 44 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	*Tullibee* (SS-284) 26 Mar 44 79 died Accidentally sunk by circular run of own torpedo off Palau Islands. *Tang* (SS-306) 24 Oct 44 78 died, 9 POWs Accidentally sunk by circular run of own torpedo in Formosa Strait. Damned circle runners...