Map contact updates...

Camaero · 04-10-07, 03:27 AM

Honestly, how often would a sub crew receive a position and heading of enemy shipping? I just can't imagine it was anywhere near the amount we have in the game. I just want to hear from the experts who have been around this a lot longer than I have.

nattydread · 04-10-07, 04:03 AM

I got the impression from my readings that you'd get a 1 or 2 a week...maybe 3 on the rare occassion...this i stotally subjective on my part though. When you did get them, they werent as precise as we get them. They'd mention shipping or a convoy in an area, not a precise coordinate and a general heading and speed and any other speculative info if applicable. But you couldnt just lay down a track from the map and get a nice easy straight line track to go down. Lots of the traffic maybe following coastline contours, or have a bit of a circle arc to them, etc.

Because the ships had real origins and destinations, one could speculate and use intuition and intelligent guesses to aid in finding them. It seems the most important factor to finding targets wasnt open ocean contacts, but lurking outside of high traffic ports.

It was a waste of time hoping for a lucky open ocean contact, you waited right outside of where a lot of ships were coming and going from. You'd sink these guys close enough for the population on the coast to just make out the smoke on the horizon, a half days travel in or out of port. You sent merchants down before they had their bags unpacked.

horrgakx · 04-10-07, 04:35 AM

On a similar vein to this, is it possible to get the torpedoes to show on the attack map? (and is there a keyboard shortcut to the attack map - used to be F6 in SHIII)?

Bilge_Rat · 04-10-07, 06:19 AM

It depends on the year. The US had broken japanese codes and were reading radio messages the whole war. The japanese were a chatty bunch and would send contact reports every day.

For example in early 1943, the US navy set up a department just to decode merchant radio traffic. Japanese convoys were supposed to follow strict timetables and to be at a certain position at noon of every day. This info was relayed to the subs and it got to the point were skippers would complain if the convoys were late for their noon rendezvous.

so yes, the large amount of contact reports does reflect real life.

Steeltrap · 04-10-07, 09:27 AM

The underlying issue is that the devs are trying to avoid simulating patrols in the Pacific too closely, as that would make 98-99% of the game sailing vast distances in search of targets.

Sinking 2 ships in a patrol was enough to get you a Silver Star! For the amount of time spent on patrols, the amount of that spent tracking/attacking targets was VERY small. They have to balance that against the problem of most gamers wanting to sail out of their bases and have a plethora of targets. Hence the crazy numbers of contacts on your map.

SHIII did this too, for the same reasons I imagine, and it was corrected by modders.

AVGWarhawk · 04-10-07, 10:21 AM

What I have noticed is if 'Very Hard' is selected. contacts become few. Also, select 'no map updates'. This reduces finding ships considerably. I do however use the mod that reduces the radioed convoy contacts from SUBCOM. This just stopped the clipboard lag as if fills up with junk.

SKurj · 04-10-07, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by horrgakx

On a similar vein to this, is it possible to get the torpedoes to show on the attack map? (and is there a keyboard shortcut to the attack map - used to be F6 in SHIII)?

mine show on the attack map....

Camaero · 04-10-07, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

What I have noticed is if 'Very Hard' is selected. contacts become few. Also, select 'no map updates'. This reduces finding ships considerably. I do however use the mod that reduces the radioed convoy contacts from SUBCOM. This just stopped the clipboard lag as if fills up with junk.

I have played with the very hard settings since day one. Everything has been on full real except for the manual TDC, but I now even play with that on. The whole reason I am finding so many ships is from the radioed contacts. They just appear very close to me and without thinking or plotting I just set a line to where I imagine they will be, go to ahead flank, and never fail to miss them.

Maybe I will try that mod you are talking about then.:hmm:

AVGWarhawk · 04-10-07, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camaero

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

What I have noticed is if 'Very Hard' is selected. contacts become few. Also, select 'no map updates'. This reduces finding ships considerably. I do however use the mod that reduces the radioed convoy contacts from SUBCOM. This just stopped the clipboard lag as if fills up with junk.

I have played with the very hard settings since day one. Everything has been on full real except for the manual TDC, but I now even play with that on. The whole reason I am finding so many ships is from the radioed contacts. They just appear very close to me and without thinking or plotting I just set a line to where I imagine they will be, go to ahead flank, and never fail to miss them.

Maybe I will try that mod you are talking about then.:hmm:

Yes, the mod reduces contacts that hit the clipboard because it lags when loading after a week at sea. In doing so, the radioed contacts become fewer and the clipboard stay clean and load quickly. With that said, you get less contacts to chase after. You still get radioed convoy messages but like the vanilla version does it. So, in all reality, you depend more now on your watch and sonarman....much like SH3. Your tonnage becomes a bit more realistic as well.

When you do find a merchant....you really begin to savor the moment because there may not be another for a long time.

Camaero · 04-10-07, 03:52 PM

Yeah, that sounds pretty much like what I have been trying to fix. Thanks!

Camaero · 04-10-07, 10:44 PM

Hey AVG, whats the name of that mod? I can't seem to find it.

Quillan · 04-10-07, 10:57 PM

Less Radio Messages. Here it is. It works.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=108959

Camaero · 04-10-07, 11:07 PM

Thank you sir!

04-10-07, 03:27 AM	#1
Camaero The Old Man Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA, Massachusetts Posts: 1,477 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	Map contact updates... Honestly, how often would a sub crew receive a position and heading of enemy shipping? I just can't imagine it was anywhere near the amount we have in the game. I just want to hear from the experts who have been around this a lot longer than I have. __________________

04-10-07, 10:21 AM	#6
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,257 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	What I have noticed is if 'Very Hard' is selected. contacts become few. Also, select 'no map updates'. This reduces finding ships considerably. I do however use the mod that reduces the radioed convoy contacts from SUBCOM. This just stopped the clipboard lag as if fills up with junk. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

04-10-07, 03:52 PM	#10
Camaero The Old Man Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA, Massachusetts Posts: 1,477 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	Yeah, that sounds pretty much like what I have been trying to fix. Thanks! __________________

04-10-07, 10:44 PM	#11
Camaero The Old Man Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA, Massachusetts Posts: 1,477 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	Hey AVG, whats the name of that mod? I can't seem to find it. __________________

04-10-07, 10:57 PM	#12
Quillan Samurai Navy Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 579 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Less Radio Messages. Here it is. It works. http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=108959 __________________ We, the unwilling, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have done so much, for so long, with so little, that we are now qualified to do anything with nothing.

04-10-07, 04:03 AM	#2
nattydread Captain Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 498 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	I got the impression from my readings that you'd get a 1 or 2 a week...maybe 3 on the rare occassion...this i stotally subjective on my part though. When you did get them, they werent as precise as we get them. They'd mention shipping or a convoy in an area, not a precise coordinate and a general heading and speed and any other speculative info if applicable. But you couldnt just lay down a track from the map and get a nice easy straight line track to go down. Lots of the traffic maybe following coastline contours, or have a bit of a circle arc to them, etc. Because the ships had real origins and destinations, one could speculate and use intuition and intelligent guesses to aid in finding them. It seems the most important factor to finding targets wasnt open ocean contacts, but lurking outside of high traffic ports. It was a waste of time hoping for a lucky open ocean contact, you waited right outside of where a lot of ships were coming and going from. You'd sink these guys close enough for the population on the coast to just make out the smoke on the horizon, a half days travel in or out of port. You sent merchants down before they had their bags unpacked.

04-10-07, 04:35 AM	#3
horrgakx Ensign Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 230 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	On a similar vein to this, is it possible to get the torpedoes to show on the attack map? (and is there a keyboard shortcut to the attack map - used to be F6 in SHIII)?

04-10-07, 06:19 AM	#4
Bilge_Rat Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: standing watch... Posts: 3,856 Downloads: 344 Uploads: 0	It depends on the year. The US had broken japanese codes and were reading radio messages the whole war. The japanese were a chatty bunch and would send contact reports every day. For example in early 1943, the US navy set up a department just to decode merchant radio traffic. Japanese convoys were supposed to follow strict timetables and to be at a certain position at noon of every day. This info was relayed to the subs and it got to the point were skippers would complain if the convoys were late for their noon rendezvous. so yes, the large amount of contact reports does reflect real life.

04-10-07, 09:27 AM	#5
Steeltrap Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 818 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	The underlying issue is that the devs are trying to avoid simulating patrols in the Pacific too closely, as that would make 98-99% of the game sailing vast distances in search of targets. Sinking 2 ships in a patrol was enough to get you a Silver Star! For the amount of time spent on patrols, the amount of that spent tracking/attacking targets was VERY small. They have to balance that against the problem of most gamers wanting to sail out of their bases and have a plethora of targets. Hence the crazy numbers of contacts on your map. SHIII did this too, for the same reasons I imagine, and it was corrected by modders.

04-10-07, 11:07 PM	#13
Camaero The Old Man Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA, Massachusetts Posts: 1,477 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	Thank you sir! __________________