How do you deal with air attacks?

shegeek72 · 01-10-07, 03:59 AM

I'm on a 1942 patrol, IXC, CB grid off the coast of Amerika (damn long, boring trip

), assignment: patrol CB16. The planes are more deadly in GWX that makes it more challenging, which is good.

How do you deal with frequent enemy aircraft attacks and the need to surface to recharge? Especially with flat seas and practically no fog. You cannot stay submerged for hours on end like you could in the stock version. Wondering what other katpitan's strategy is in this case?

Also, what are the protuberances on this plane for? Radar?
--

katzenjammer

1. A loud, discordant noise.
2. A hangover.
3. A state of depression or bewilderment.

Pants · 01-10-07, 04:21 AM

One or two planes i engage, more i submerge. As soon as i get the snorkel i use that extensively,Or i use the 37mm's which ever i get first.
Regarding the Wellington, yes those are the radar antenors.

shegeek72 · 01-10-07, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pants

One or two planes i engage, more i submerge. As soon as i get the snorkel i use that extensively,Or i use the 37mm's which ever i get first.

My experience has been the planes in GWX are impervious to the flak guns (at least in 1942), even taking direct hits at close range.
--

Pants · 01-10-07, 04:35 AM

It is possible to down the planes, even with just two single 20mm, my settings are engage closing targets at maximum range, Always keep on the move and when you see the plane start to dive on you,Goto to full ahead flank and turn hard (eitherway is fine ) and the bombs should miss you.

Ducimus · 01-10-07, 05:47 AM

Ohh, i got the drumbeat routine down to a science.

Your chances of air attack are Less at night. Your chances of an air attack are greatest at dawn/dusk. But thats just about anywhere, in any year.

In short, i submerge at or before first light (check your "local time" tool tip over the game clock), and surface at 0 hour (midnight). Sometimes ill surface earlier, but ill try and stay under as long a possible to miniize my surface explosure time, and to save on fuel. The only cavet being is that when i surface, im at at my greatest state of vulnerablity having both oxygen and batteries at about 60%ish (or more) drained. If i have to dive again in an emergency before replenishing the air and some of the batts, i'll be in a bit of a spot.

Oh ya, a quick way to end a career game is under the following conditions:

- it's Night
- with Heavy fog
- you have No Radar or RWR
- and your surfaced and on the continental shelf

Nothing quite says, "hello" like a destroyer coming out of a night fog, guns blazing because he had you on radar and you coudlnt see him until it was too late.

at any rate, if i see a plane, and hes like 6000 meters away, i crash dive and dont think twice about it.

If hes like 4800 meters away or less, its too late to dive. 4800 meters distance is .. IFFY. its like getting dealt a 16 playing blackjack. In that scenario, ill go to flank speed, position myself to give him my broadside, and as hes about 2000 metesr off, turn into him. (IE if hes on port, ill turn hard to port), idea being to screw his aim and make him miss. the bombs typically fly over the conning tower landing on the other side. At which point, ill straighten the rudder and crashdive RIGHT after the bombs drop and he passes. You have enough time to get under before he sets up for another attack run.

Corsair · 01-10-07, 06:12 AM

Wow, not much time to estimate if plane is 6000 or 4800 m away...
Laser measure ?

JU_88 · 01-10-07, 06:24 AM

depends on the plane. and my boats flak configureation

Hurricanes, sword fish and wellingtons are usually less of a threat and reletivly easy to down

Sunderlands and PBYs are so so, I'll take one on, but not two or more. and Ill only do this if I have C38s

Liberators and Avengers are nasty so I hit the floor (unless I have a SAM luancher on my sub).

Cant comment on any of the new planes in GWX as Ive yet to see one. The beaufigher looks like it might not be worth tangling with.

As Ive said before crossing Biscay in the late war is too easy, In reality Uboat commanders were deeply troubled by air attacks over the suicide run that was biscay and felt safer once they were out to sea! In SH3/GWX its the opposite. This is one area of the game that definatly needs more work.

AndyW · 01-10-07, 06:58 AM

December 1943: My crew (unexperienced) shot down a Wellington with 1,369 shots with the two 2 cm-AA twins. It took three approaches, the hull integrity went only down by 4%.

June 1942: A Catalina from Malta hits me on her first approach, hull integrity down from 80% to 8%. The a/c was eating the 2cm beans like a hog without taking any harm. Her second approach finished me off, boat lost with all hands.

I'm currently playing in winter 43/44 and don't have a schnorchel (5000 points!). It's no fun. During daytimes I crawl submerged at 50 m and during night I cruise surfaced with 1/3 speed. Nevertheless I had 24 air attacks during 9 nights, but that's relatively "calm" compared to during daytime. METOX and NAXOS are your best friends at night, without them it's a better idea to scuttle your boat by yourself, because you're 100% screwed without them.

My advise: DIVE !!

Even if you shoot 'em down like turkeys, they're too many and are gnawing off your hull integrity piece by piece.

Cheers,

AndyW
currently U-792 König, 1st patrol 12/1943 [SH3 + GWX 1.0 @ 84% realism]
Total: 10 careers, 40th sailing, 856 days at sea, 544,474 tons sunk

Tijn · 01-10-07, 07:47 AM

Does GWX still has the problem of not spawing any planes at TC higher then 256? In stock SH3 there where more planes then in GW 1.1a. How does GWX compare?

fredbass · 01-10-07, 07:49 AM

I may stay surfaced in the very early portion of the war because I know I'll run into a byplane and can easily shoot them down, but other than that, I always dive. Remember, once you've been seen, you're position will now be known. As a result, merchant ships and convoys could possibly change course, making it tougher for you to find them.

JU_88 · 01-10-07, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fredbass

I may stay surfaced in the very early portion of the war because I know I'll run into a byplane and can easily shoot them down, but other than that, I always dive. Remember, once you've been seen, you're position will now be known. As a result, merchant ships and convoys could possibly change course, making it tougher for you to find them.

I dont think that level of AI (regarding evasion) is modelled in to the game.

fredbass · 01-10-07, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tijn

Does GWX still has the problem of not spawing any planes at TC higher then 256? In stock SH3 there where more planes then in GW 1.1a. How does GWX compare?

I'm sure you'll run into planes more often at lower TC's but you will still encounter them at a higher compression too. The thing is that at higher TC, your range to detect could be a little closer,. Lower TC will give you some distance at times. So what happens is that when you're cruising along at a high compression, by the time they're spotted, they could be too close to escape without being attacked.

fredbass · 01-10-07, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JU_88

Quote:

Originally Posted by fredbass

I may stay surfaced in the very early portion of the war because I know I'll run into a byplane and can easily shoot them down, but other than that, I always dive. Remember, once you've been seen, you're position will now be known. As a result, merchant ships and convoys could possibly change course, making it tougher for you to find them.

I dont think that level of AI (regarding evasion) is modelled in to the game.

You sure about that?

andy_311 · 01-10-07, 08:09 AM

So far Ive only took out a handfull of planes in gwx PBY's,wellintons,Sunderlands,Mossies,I have took afew of those out but the wildcats are a different kettle of fish fast and deadly although I took 3 out Last night flak set to fire at closing targets at medium range, it cost me 12 crew members. and these didn't even show up on the map for some reason.

Mush Martin · 01-10-07, 08:26 AM

If you choose avoicance follow the sensible approach.
It is important in surface combat to continue to maneuver
your boat. normally I am flank on the surface with 15 degrees
or twenty degrees rudder alternately port and starboard

the Subs AI gunners arent quite as sharp as enemy AI it
said so in GWX manual ammo consumption and inneffective
shooting can be corrected by manning the gun yourself
and learning to use the sight correctly to lead oncoming
aircraft

when using AI gunners on sub I also choose target
approaching aircraft but I choose engage at medium
range as it increases the chances of my boys getting
a hit by allowing a bigger target but reduces ammo use
by the crew by 20-30% (close range not recommended)
MM

01-10-07, 03:59 AM	#1
shegeek72 WAV Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: somewhere in the Pacific Posts: 603 Downloads: 95 Uploads: 0	How do you deal with air attacks? I'm on a 1942 patrol, IXC, CB grid off the coast of Amerika (damn long, boring trip ), assignment: patrol CB16. The planes are more deadly in GWX that makes it more challenging, which is good. How do you deal with frequent enemy aircraft attacks and the need to surface to recharge? Especially with flat seas and practically no fog. You cannot stay submerged for hours on end like you could in the stock version. Wondering what other katpitan's strategy is in this case? Also, what are the protuberances on this plane for? Radar? -- katzenjammer 1. A loud, discordant noise. 2. A hangover. 3. A state of depression or bewilderment.

01-10-07, 04:21 AM	#2
Pants Grey Wolf Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Somewhere in the Atlantic Posts: 849 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	One or two planes i engage, more i submerge. As soon as i get the snorkel i use that extensively,Or i use the 37mm's which ever i get first. Regarding the Wellington, yes those are the radar antenors. __________________ Ex GWX Dev Team member and proud GWX user

01-10-07, 04:35 AM	#4
Pants Grey Wolf Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Somewhere in the Atlantic Posts: 849 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	It is possible to down the planes, even with just two single 20mm, my settings are engage closing targets at maximum range, Always keep on the move and when you see the plane start to dive on you,Goto to full ahead flank and turn hard (eitherway is fine ) and the bombs should miss you. __________________ Ex GWX Dev Team member and proud GWX user

01-10-07, 06:12 AM	#6
Corsair Ace of the Deep Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Toulouse France Posts: 1,140 Downloads: 51 Uploads: 0	Wow, not much time to estimate if plane is 6000 or 4800 m away... Laser measure ? __________________ NYGM 3.4A / Living SH3 V5.1 + SH3 Commander

01-10-07, 07:49 AM	#10
fredbass Ace of the Deep Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: New Port Richey, Fl, USA Posts: 1,066 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I may stay surfaced in the very early portion of the war because I know I'll run into a byplane and can easily shoot them down, but other than that, I always dive. Remember, once you've been seen, you're position will now be known. As a result, merchant ships and convoys could possibly change course, making it tougher for you to find them. __________________

01-10-07, 05:47 AM	#5
Ducimus Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 12,987 Downloads: 67 Uploads: 2	Ohh, i got the drumbeat routine down to a science. Your chances of air attack are Less at night. Your chances of an air attack are greatest at dawn/dusk. But thats just about anywhere, in any year. In short, i submerge at or before first light (check your "local time" tool tip over the game clock), and surface at 0 hour (midnight). Sometimes ill surface earlier, but ill try and stay under as long a possible to miniize my surface explosure time, and to save on fuel. The only cavet being is that when i surface, im at at my greatest state of vulnerablity having both oxygen and batteries at about 60%ish (or more) drained. If i have to dive again in an emergency before replenishing the air and some of the batts, i'll be in a bit of a spot. Oh ya, a quick way to end a career game is under the following conditions: - it's Night - with Heavy fog - you have No Radar or RWR - and your surfaced and on the continental shelf Nothing quite says, "hello" like a destroyer coming out of a night fog, guns blazing because he had you on radar and you coudlnt see him until it was too late. at any rate, if i see a plane, and hes like 6000 meters away, i crash dive and dont think twice about it. If hes like 4800 meters away or less, its too late to dive. 4800 meters distance is .. IFFY. its like getting dealt a 16 playing blackjack. In that scenario, ill go to flank speed, position myself to give him my broadside, and as hes about 2000 metesr off, turn into him. (IE if hes on port, ill turn hard to port), idea being to screw his aim and make him miss. the bombs typically fly over the conning tower landing on the other side. At which point, ill straighten the rudder and crashdive RIGHT after the bombs drop and he passes. You have enough time to get under before he sets up for another attack run.

01-10-07, 06:24 AM	#7
JU_88 Silent Hunter Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: UK Posts: 3,803 Downloads: 11 Uploads: 0	depends on the plane. and my boats flak configureation Hurricanes, sword fish and wellingtons are usually less of a threat and reletivly easy to down Sunderlands and PBYs are so so, I'll take one on, but not two or more. and Ill only do this if I have C38s Liberators and Avengers are nasty so I hit the floor (unless I have a SAM luancher on my sub). Cant comment on any of the new planes in GWX as Ive yet to see one. The beaufigher looks like it might not be worth tangling with. As Ive said before crossing Biscay in the late war is too easy, In reality Uboat commanders were deeply troubled by air attacks over the suicide run that was biscay and felt safer once they were out to sea! In SH3/GWX its the opposite. This is one area of the game that definatly needs more work.

01-10-07, 06:58 AM	#8
AndyW Electrician's Mate Join Date: May 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 133 Downloads: 66 Uploads: 0	December 1943: My crew (unexperienced) shot down a Wellington with 1,369 shots with the two 2 cm-AA twins. It took three approaches, the hull integrity went only down by 4%. June 1942: A Catalina from Malta hits me on her first approach, hull integrity down from 80% to 8%. The a/c was eating the 2cm beans like a hog without taking any harm. Her second approach finished me off, boat lost with all hands. I'm currently playing in winter 43/44 and don't have a schnorchel (5000 points!). It's no fun. During daytimes I crawl submerged at 50 m and during night I cruise surfaced with 1/3 speed. Nevertheless I had 24 air attacks during 9 nights, but that's relatively "calm" compared to during daytime. METOX and NAXOS are your best friends at night, without them it's a better idea to scuttle your boat by yourself, because you're 100% screwed without them. My advise: DIVE !! Even if you shoot 'em down like turkeys, they're too many and are gnawing off your hull integrity piece by piece. Cheers, AndyW currently U-792 König, 1st patrol 12/1943 [SH3 + GWX 1.0 @ 84% realism] Total: 10 careers, 40th sailing, 856 days at sea, 544,474 tons sunk

01-10-07, 07:47 AM	#9
Tijn Loader Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nijmegen Posts: 83 Downloads: 16 Uploads: 0	Does GWX still has the problem of not spawing any planes at TC higher then 256? In stock SH3 there where more planes then in GW 1.1a. How does GWX compare?

01-10-07, 08:09 AM	#14
andy_311 The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Oldham, Lancs,England Posts: 1,312 Downloads: 82 Uploads: 0	So far Ive only took out a handfull of planes in gwx PBY's,wellintons,Sunderlands,Mossies,I have took afew of those out but the wildcats are a different kettle of fish fast and deadly although I took 3 out Last night flak set to fire at closing targets at medium range, it cost me 12 crew members. and these didn't even show up on the map for some reason.

01-10-07, 08:26 AM	#15
Mush Martin Eternal Patrol Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,398 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	quickly If you choose avoicance follow the sensible approach. It is important in surface combat to continue to maneuver your boat. normally I am flank on the surface with 15 degrees or twenty degrees rudder alternately port and starboard the Subs AI gunners arent quite as sharp as enemy AI it said so in GWX manual ammo consumption and inneffective shooting can be corrected by manning the gun yourself and learning to use the sight correctly to lead oncoming aircraft when using AI gunners on sub I also choose target approaching aircraft but I choose engage at medium range as it increases the chances of my boys getting a hit by allowing a bigger target but reduces ammo use by the crew by 20-30% (close range not recommended) MM __________________ RIP Mush Tutorial