Realism- and gameplay-related hardcode fixes for SH3.EXE

[h.sie]

Regarding BDU-Messages:

1) The Mod not only analyses the total tonnage sunk category, it also analyses the difference in tonnage since the last status report. So if you are e.g. Kaleun Kretschmer and have a total tonnage of 80000t but then accidently sunk a neutral fishing boat of 10t, your tonnage sinks to 79990t and thus you get the message to not sink neutrals, even if your total tonnage (79990) is very high. This is okay in my opinion.

2) The higher the tonnage sunk, the lower a chance for receiving a motivation message, but even for 80000t there remains a little chance. Would you suggest to completely disable motivation messages for high tonnage?

3) Why do you suggest a congratulaton for no torpedoes left?? Maybe none of the torpedoes sunk a ship.

4) I didn't include a reason (e.g. "low fuel" or "hull damaged") for the "return to home base" command, since I think the kaleun is informed very well about the state of the hull and the remaining fuel. Additionally, I assumed that he did sent that information in his status report to BDU, so a reason for returning to base is redundant in my eyes, but could be added in further versions, if very much desired.

[NGT]

Originally Posted by h.sie

Regarding O2-Supply / Diving times

.................................................. ......................

3) Or, if you don't like the O2-Mod at all, I could provide you the source-code of the V15E version, which you like more. You could use that and build your own exe. This gives the people here an opportunity to choose between 2 different approaches. .........................................

Yes please, h.sie, provide it to Stiebler

Yes please, Stiebler, take it. . .


Really, I prefer earlier versions of V15 (Instead of V15G1) because of oxygen management. CO2 tweak was, for me, better.

I am "oblige" to use the V15G1 because of the given torpedoes in U-tankers (not provided from Stiebler's patch), but with O2 / CO2 tweak disable.


It is totally impossible (or offensive?) if I suggest to re-introduce the old CO2 tweak as an option? With restriction between them [CO2 or O2].


Thank you both for everything

(currently I do trials concerning AI U-boots, but no results for the moment)

[Stiebler]

@Hsie, LGN1.

1. Concerning the air supply.
I think it is unlikely that air consumption can be very different between NYGM and GWX or stock SH3. I cannot think of any cause for a difference.

As stated earlier, the problem I have with the air supply system in V15G1 is that it is not consistent with operational orders. It was definitely the case that Type VII and IX U-boats, if necessary, could patrol/move continuously submerged (excepting time on the surface to recharge batteries once per day) for a week or longer - without a schnorchel.

If this were not the case, it would have been impossible for U-boats to operate off any coastline patrolled continuously by aircraft, for example the east coast of the USA. Nor could they cross the Bay of Biscay in 1943, under constant air attack. This is the reality of the situation, and therefore H.sie's coding for the oxygen supply must be fitted around it. Incidentally, no U-boat would use 'silent-running' when Allied units were not close, because of the serious effect on crew morale.

I lack knowledge of whether the problem is with an under-estimate of the time 'natural' oxygen (obtained by venting the boat on the boat on the surface) could be consumed in the U-boat, or if the U-boat carried more compressed air cylinders than people believe, or if the 'natural' air could be partly compressed for storage. Perhaps all three estimates are in error. But something is definitely wrong. The U-boats would *not* surface twice in a day just to replenish their air. They surfaced because they needed to recharge batteries - once per day - and renewed their air at the same time.

H.sie, yes please, please send me code from V15E and hex-addresses of relevant variables for V15G1.

2. BdU Messages.
H.sie, now that I understand how the 'motivation' messages are being calculated, I have no problem with them.

However, I am receiving the message to stop sinking neutrals after I send a radio message with no ships sunk at all! (And also after sinking one small ship.) It seems there must be an error here somewhere.

Concerning the 'out of torpedoes' message, simply send the 'congratulations' that are appropriate for the tonnage already sunk.

Good luck with the wolf-packs!

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

@NGT: Due to very low time for modding and some burn-out, I decided from now on to only spend time for and include those mods into V15XYZ which I will personally use. Since I prefer the O2-Fix, I will not include the old alternative. Sorry.

In the last time, Stiebler and me had little different opinions regarding what is important and what not, and I suggested him to continue with his own project. Of course, we will still help each other as we did in the past. Two different exe-patch versions may be irritating, but have the advantage, that players can choose between his and my version.

Since Stiebler also prefers the old CO2 fix, maybe this is now reason enough for him to start his project......

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: Okay, I'll look into the BDU congrats mod this weekend. Also, I'll send you the sources of V15E3 and V15G1.

Thanks for explaining your view. Sounds plausible.


@ALL: Any other historical data available regarding diving-times?

[Hitman]

If I might suggest something, it could be useful to allow the player to choose in the fixes selector tool how many hours does he want the Uboat to be able to endure without silent running and without use of compressed O2. Or at least give two options, standard and double time.

[h.sie]

@Hitman: Maybe a good idea /compromise. But Stiebler has to answer your question. From my point of view that is possible. He will soon know the addresses of the 4 variables for diving times.

2 suggestions:

a) invalid entries must be catched

b) use of sliders to avoid invalid entries. sliders for factor 1x to 5x for example.

[Hitman]

b) use of sliders to avoid invalid entries. sliders for factor 1x to 5x for example.

Ohh yess, that would indeed be awesome ... so there is a default and then supermod authors can recommend a setting for theirs

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: If you really plan to change the OptionsSelector to adjust diving-times: Please contact me, because I have an important point and information that has to be considered. Thanks.

[Stiebler]

There is no technical difficulty about adding sliders to the Options Selector, except the fact that the dialog box is becoming rather crowded.

I have written to an old U-boat officer concerning air supply. He should know the answer, or be able to find one who does know the answer. Unfortunately, this will probably take some weeks.

If you really plan to change the OptionsSelector to adjust diving-times: Please contact me, because I have an important point and information that has to be considered. Thanks.

@H.sie, please send me a PM concerning these points.

Stiebler.

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: Great. You'll get PM soon.


@NGT, ALL: as a second compromise, additionally to the possibility to change divingtimes for the o2-mod, I could offer the following:

I could permanently (that means: cannot be disabled back to stock sh3 values) enlarge the max. diving-times (resulting from CO2 production) as follows:

type 2: from 30h to 60h
type 7: from 36h to 72h
type 9: from 40h to 80h
type21: from 75h(?) to 150h

but these times are not depending on silent-running or crew number or anything else. it's only a factor of 2 compared to stock sh3.

so one can choose to either use the o2-mod, or, if o2-mod is disabled, use these longer diving times.

POLL: Is this desired or not?

[Wolfstriked]

If I was a Uboat captain I would not surface just once a day though.I would surface at night and then surface every time the Oxygen was being used to fill boat with air and get a little bit of battery recharge done.I would then do a final surface with full battery recharge right before dawn so that as little of the oxygen tank is used.

EDIT.....which brings me to my next request.Is their a way to put TC at 1 when you start using oxygen?

[tekai]

@hsie and Stiebler

1. I remember playing AOD, where torpedoes were fired by planes and subs, you could be hit by them surfaced or at periscope depth. I was even attacked by an airplane with torpedoes, they missed me and killed a freighter in the convoy. Is it possible to include these options in sh3.exe or other files?

2. I'm using Sergbutos wolfpack mod with GWX and I can say it works great, here some experiences with this mod:
- AI subs are attacking merchants and escorts, in the last convoy 2 of them sunk 4 of 24 ships and damaged 3 units.
- Escorts then attacked the AI subs with all weapons and they even killed an AI sub with depthcharges.
- You can find damaged ships following the convoy so there are easy victims after an attack of AI subs.
- There is often a way to penetrate a convoy from the front, because some escorts are hunting the AI u-boats behind the convoy.
- It's possible to kill an AI sub with torpedoes when you miss your target...

But there are some points to advance:
- AI subs can be detected easily because they run always with maximum speed
- AI subs fire shells instead of torpedoes
- The installation of this mod is very difficult, it's very easy to do something wrong.

So why are you doing so much work when this mod is really working fine?
Which of your improvements will be better than Sergbutos mod?
May I remind that the AI subs already are doing enough damage, when you make them better, you'll not find targets worth to attack.

And for all who use Sergbutos mod, do we need a clean version of the menu_1024_768.ini to install your new mod?

Greetz
Tom

[h.sie]

@Wolfstriked: Good point. Will be added in V15G2 or H1

@tekai: I partially agree. See this post:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...postcount=1678

Sergs AI Subs have nothing to do with menu1204.ini

[h.sie]

@Stiebler: What part of diving time do you want to change?

1) the part resulting from the O2 in the air of the sub (regenerative)

2) the part resulting from the O2-supply in bottles (non-regenerative)

3) both?

I looked in the code: For all 4 sub types and for each of those 2 parts above there is one variable to change, so that there are 8 variables in total to change.

I don't like this, and thus I will rewrite the code a little bit and implement a correction factor that results in an overall-change for all sub types. so it's easier for you to manipulate 1-2 instead of 4-8 variables.