Do we really want to ruin this forum with constant DRM and SH5 trashing?

[Faamecanic]

Originally Posted by robbo180265

Ok I will bite now.

I've seen threads where SHV owners ask for help with something and get the reply: "blah, blah, blah, DRM. Blah , blah , blah Unfinished game - not buying it"

I've seen threads praising SHV (like this one in fact) Only for the first or second reply to go: "blah, blah, blah, DRM. Blah , blah , blah Unfinished game - not buying it"

I've seen reviews where the replies go something like: "blah, blah, blah, DRM. Blah , blah , blah Unfinished game - not buying it"

I GET IT OK??????

Saying it over and over and over - what does it achieve ? Nothing other than annoying a lot of people.

If we dare to argue against the "blah, blah, blah, DRM. Blah , blah , blah Unfinished game - not buying it" Then we are called fanbois or worse.

Ok...understand your irritated. And you will never see me post a complaint in a "help wanted on xxx" thread (that is Off topic and should be deleted).

But if a poster is giving his/her opinion on SH5 (which then says "this thread is for opinions") I will post mine. I will NOT attack someone that says they like the game... if you like it GREAT. Your opinion and your entitled to it.

I just find it humorus those people that not only post complaints about reading complainers...but then complain about all the complainers (sounds like a Monty Python skit).

As soon as you see a thread :

1) Asking for opinions on SH5

2) Commenting on Good/Bad of SH5

3) or the mulitudes of threads with the topic of why someone love/hates SH5

Your pretty much 100% guarenteed to see people posting who are not happy with the product.

So if it irritates you to see all the negative posts on SH5 (which really one must ask WHY so many SH series vets are totally ticked off) then the solution is simple....

Dont read those threads. Then you wont be tired/bored anymore.

[Bilge_Rat]

Originally Posted by Faamecanic

And who is holding the gun to your head forcing you to not only read the complaint posts but then comment on the people posting their dissatisfaction?

As much as you and others constantly kavetch about being tired and bored of reading all the complaint posts.... you sure have no problem leaving your comment in every one of them (usually just to bash those with valid complaints).

I wish to complain about the complainers complaining about the complaints!!

..but then what would WE have to complain about if the persistent complainers ceased all their persistent complaints in multiple complaints threads. That would force us to actually talk about the game..hmmm, what a novel concept.

Anyway, I want to lodge a complaint against the motion that certain complainers should be excluded from lodging complaints in complaints threads started by another faction.

Lets face it, we are all born complainers, if we did not complain about the game, we would complain about something else. For example, who chose the lame colours for the forum skins and why are we limited to only four choices? I want to lodge a complaint!

[Faamecanic]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

..but then what would WE have to complain about if the persistent complainers ceased all their persistent complaints in multiple complaints threads. That would force us to actually talk about the game..hmmm, what a novel concept.

Anyway, I want to lodge a complaint against the motion that certain complainers should be excluded from lodging complaints in complaints threads started by another faction.

Lets face it, we are all born complainers, if we did not complain about the game, we would complain about something else. For example, who chose the lame colours for the forum skins and why are we limited to only four choices? I want to lodge a complaint!

ROFLMAO..... now that IS a Monthy Pyton skit in the making

We need a forum Mod that ensures all complaints are compliant with the forum rules of complaining. First rule you must be complaining.... second rule you must post a second thread that complains about someone elses complaint, and lastly when someone complains about your complaining about the original complaint, you must respond complaining that they are complaining about your complaint that you where orginally complaining about.

There...... understand ....

(PS...nice way to defuse a thread that was getting too tense )

[robbo180265]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

..but then what would WE have to complain about if the persistent complainers ceased all their persistent complaints in multiple complaints threads. That would force us to actually talk about the game..hmmm, what a novel concept.

Anyway, I want to lodge a complaint against the motion that certain complainers should be excluded from lodging complaints in complaints threads started by another faction.

Lets face it, we are all born complainers, if we did not complain about the game, we would complain about something else. For example, who chose the lame colours for the forum skins and why are we limited to only four choices? I want to lodge a complaint!

Is that the 5 min complaint - or the full half hour?

Seriously - that post is full of win

[Alcibiades]

with thread where everyone feels a need to post... including me too I guess

*tacks up another complaint*

[Brag]

Give SHV a chance? Reward Ubi for diregarding and ignoring its customer base? Rewarding Ubi for producing shoddy goods?

The promoters of this philosopy deserve what they get.

What we need is a publisher who is responsive to subsimmers. If Ubi leaves the subsim market, there will be room for a responsive and responsible publisher to develop a submarine simulation we'll all enjoy to play and get value for money.

[kylania]

Originally Posted by Brag

What we need is a publisher who is responsive to subsimmers. If Ubi leaves the subsim market, there will be room for a responsive and responsible publisher to develop a submarine simulation we'll all enjoy to play and get value for money.

What we have is Ubisoft. Where's Falcon 5? Where's Harpoon 4? There's not a big market for simulators and by not supporting Ubisoft, even in the face of bugs and this disastrous DRM, you're not saying "Screw you Ubisoft", you're saying "screw you sim games!"

There won't be some publisher saying, "Well, Ubisoft tanked badly with Silent Hunter 5, we should step in and make a bug free super immersive game for those fans! They deserve it after what UbiSoft did to them!"

[John Channing]

Originally Posted by kylania

What we have is Ubisoft. Where's Falcon 5? Where's Harpoon 4? There's not a big market for simulators and by not supporting Ubisoft, even in the face of bugs and this disastrous DRM, you're not saying "Screw you Ubisoft", you're saying "screw you sim games!"

There won't be some publisher saying, "Well, Ubisoft tanked badly with Silent Hunter 5, we should step in and make a bug free super immersive game for those fans! They deserve it after what UbiSoft did to them!"

Where are E/A's new combat simulations?

Where are Janes Combat Simulations new projects?

Where are Sonalysts?

Where is Sierra?

Where is "Akula: Red Hunter" ?

Where is any company or individual that is even remotely contemplating simulation development?

You have Fighter Ops (8-9 years and counting).

You have Jet Thunder (4 years and counting)

you have SOW (3 years and counting)

But where are the independant developers that have expressed any on-going interest at all in a Sub Sim? I would love to see one actual name.

There have been a few people who got off to impressive starts but then ran out of steam and just disappeared. The arguement is foolish on the face of it. If Ubisoft is so very bad at this (5 strikes if you go back and read the archives), and Subsims really aren't a niche market, then someone would have stepped in already instead of virtually every publisher that ever developed a Sub Sim running away like someone doused them with scalding hot water.

So again I ask.

Where are these phantom developers?

JCC

[audessy]

The reality is that the PC gaming industry is crippled and dieing.

As consoles become more competitive with pc's in their multi-functionality (eg. using a keyboard, mouse, internet, and hard drives) you can kiss your sweet gaming rig goodbye.

I think UbiSoft's last "PC only" simulator that struck it big was IL-2. Now that's dead and they don't know what to do I'm assuming. Maddox in part let it die by making it completely unmoddable... Not everyone who plays a flight sim wants a bland flightsim anymore with no personality. Just realism. Silly stubborn Maddox... A $30 cd with fmv's, voice acting, and a more attractive game interface could've kept the game alive a little longer.

SH5 is beautiful but a disappointing mess. A lot of potential yes. But look at it this way. If everyone who developed mods for SH3/4/5 grouped together and put all their long hours on one thing we'd have the perfect sim by now.

In all honesty Ubi had something great in SH5. But it's incomplete. Ever click on a crew member and watch him for a few seconds? He keeps turning away and looking back. Really bad animation. It's as if they didn't hire beta testers or even played their own game once before releasing it.

[Méo]

Originally Posted by IanC

say how good a subsim SH5 is and actually be right for once.

Ok, cuz I've already said that

[Placoderm]

Originally Posted by kylania

What we have is Ubisoft. Where's Falcon 5? Where's Harpoon 4? There's not a big market for simulators and by not supporting Ubisoft, even in the face of bugs and this disastrous DRM, you're not saying "Screw you Ubisoft", you're saying "screw you sim games!"

There won't be some publisher saying, "Well, Ubisoft tanked badly with Silent Hunter 5, we should step in and make a bug free super immersive game for those fans! They deserve it after what UbiSoft did to them!"

>>"Where's Falcon 5?"

It's called "Lock-on: Modern Air Combat", "Flaming Cliffs", and now "DCS: Black Shark".

>>"Where's Harpoon 4?

"Dangerous Waters" likely filled that position, although the games genre is even more limited than that for Silent Hunter. Unfortunately, many who love submarine games just can't seem to get into modern submarine warfare due to it's need for super stealth and dependance on fire-and-forget weapons. It takes a very, very unique kind of sub-simmer to enjoy a game where there are no deck guns and if you wish to survive for any length of time you should avoid ever using your periscope. To me, following wire-mesh seafloor contours was fun for a while, as was hearing whales on the hydrophones...but spending my entire war career hiding under multiple thermal layers and staring endlessly at electronic readouts and nothing else was just too tedious. Someday, another publisher may create a new modern-era subsim...but if so it will likely be a very independent team of niche developers who I am sure will do a great job, but for a very limited audience.



Other examples of games that should not exist according to your logic are "T-34 vs Tiger", "Steel Fury", "Jutland" and "Distant Guns", "Theatre of War" (the whole series), "Rise of Flight", "PT Boats: Knights of the Sea", "Storm of War: Battle of Britain" (which, interestingly, has been produced independently of Ubisoft who published the prior IL-2 series), "R-Factor", "Pacific Storm", and even "ARMA II" (developed independently after Codemasters took over control of the now-failed Operation Flashpoint 2).

MOST of the above are great games, written by dedicated teams of enthusiast gamers...NOT mega-publishers. The simple truth is that as long as there is a dedicated fan base that is large enough for which to develop a commercial title...there WILL be developers who will meet that demand. Sometimes those titles will also end up being the best ever developed, as can be evidenced by some of the titles listed above.


Do not sell the independent developer short. Often times, it is they who really drive the art that is our obsession.



.

Ladies and Gentleman,

I must say that to be honest I'm getting a rather a lot fed up of constantly seeing threads full of people having constant arguments, or moaning about Silent Hunter 5.

I would like to petition the moderators of this forum, to lock down any more 'moan' topics and put the argument to rest permanently, or at least create just one thread for people to continue the discussion in a gentlemanly fashion and stop littering the forum with threads that seem to always turn into a pro/anti DRM/SH5 argument.

I feel that this forum is becoming more than a little ruined by the constant bickering about SH5, its DRM etc...

Its getting a little childish seeing people moaning at others because they bought SH5, and also seeing the people who bought it moaning at the people who won't because of the DRM, or other issues. We now know your feelings, whatever they are! Is there any need to keep going on about it? Why become so animated about the whole thing? If people have a problem, could they not just submit their complaint in writing to Ubisoft and have done with it?

We all know about the issues SH5 has, some people can get past that and get on with enjoying the game, others choose not to. That is fine! But can we, please, finally get past that and give it a rest. Its turning a really good forum that I want to be a part of into a flame-bin!

Many thanks,

Sev.

[Sailor Steve]

You're certainly entitled to your feelings, but do we really need yet another thread?

[Nisgeis]

I'm no lady.

The point i'm trying to make is. I'd like to ask the moderators to stop the nonsense before this forum turns into one big flame war. If people are actually fed up of the bickering, which from many of the threads I've read they seem to be, then they should register it, let the mods see it, and ask for something to be done about it. Thats all that I'm doing.