The gawd-almighty merged DRM in Silent Hunter V thread

[Armistead]

Well, look at it this way, think of all the marriages they will save. No more wives complaining about playing.

You'll fire up the game on Friday night...server will be down and you'll have time to take your wife out to dinner....

Damn them.....

i would like to take this opportunity to ask the members to finish saying their peace here in this thread and get it out of their system so we can change the subject and stop taking about the DRM/OSP.

yes its a topic we feel strong emotions about but its now going to be what it is and more talk about it will change nothing.

the game IS going to be released on march 4th, 2010 with the new DRM/OSP and those who buy it will post here in the sh5 forums about the game the bought.

the rest of us will move on in other directions but will likely keep a close eye on these forums so we would like to ask people limit the number of thread discussions of DRM/OSP to no more than one or two threads and the rest of the forum can be about the actual sh5 game as it was intended.

the days of 8 or more anti DRM/OSP threads filling the forum has past and its time to move on

[Ragtag]

Originally Posted by goldorak

Mr Neal Stevens, it doesn't matter if the pc is or isn't connected to the internet 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. Its a matter of principle. The moment a third party dicates what you can and cannot do to the game you have PURCHASED well you haven't purchased anything but a promise that they will let you use it. God know for how much time, and if they decide to cut you off you're f **** d.
Let me ask you, would you find acceptable to ask a third party for authorization everytime you would like to read a book in your personal library ?
I bet you wouldn't. See its the same issue. Giving up what you legally PURCHASED.

Totally agree. And what if movie companys suddenly decides to go with something like this on Blu-Ray?...that'll be fun wouldn't it?

They could add an offline option with a weekly or monthly authentication of the gamedisc. Similar authentication is used on the later Company of heroes expansions.

[snapli]

Hi all!

I had to join this forum to comment on this DRM-issue, too. And there is one thing, that didn't get enough attention after all:

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

Crappy DRM would be the only reason for me not buying SH5. I don't care what the rationale behind this or that DRM is, it's crap. Eventually ALL games get cracked, no matter how "strong" their protection is, so a good old serial number is as good as any fancy protection, and it doesn't bother legit users.

You won't buy a complete game; all you'll get for your $$$ is just a fragment of a game, with the missing parts being downloaded at runtime. That's the reason for the permanent connection requirement and that's the reason why the whole crack-idea will fail, in the end.

I agree that almost every other game was cracked in the past, but these guys had the whole package in their hands to do their dirty work ...

I bought SH3, won't buy SH5 as I can not support buying something that I don't own completely and, furthermore, being dependend on external infrastructure.

Cheers,

Snapli

[JU_88]

The biggest question I would have is, what will Ubisoft do if (or should I say 'when') the pirates produce an offline crack for their OSP?
If this happens, wouldn't it be most wise for them to patch out the system on all effected games immediately?
If they dont, surely they could end up with a piracy epidemic similar to that of EA's Spore - or worse?

[Ragtag]

Well, even if they stream in runtime it won't matter. The files has to be local for the period one plays. Anything on a computer can be cracked,hacked and ripped wide open. It's just a matter of skill and time. And there's no doubt in my mind that the crackers out there will take on the challenge.

[partyboy]

Originally Posted by snapli

Hi all!
You won't buy a complete game; all you'll get for your $$$ is just a fragment of a game, with the missing parts being downloaded at runtime. That's the reason for the permanent connection requirement and that's the reason why the whole crack-idea will fail, in the end.

I agree that almost every other game was cracked in the past, but these guys had the whole package in their hands to do their dirty work ...

There have been plenty of games released already where not all of the files necessary to play are on the game disc and you have to connect to a server to download the rest. Half-life 2, for example. And guess what? They were cracked.

The crackers simply go through the legitimate process at least once, gain access to the downloaded files, package them with their release and crack the executable so it doesn't try and connect to any servers. They either include the downloaded files as part of the normal installation process or in a separate directory which you copy over after the regular install.

There is nothing really new here. It will be cracked like just about everything else. The only benefit is in delaying the inevitable. That's what protection schemes are really about - not stopping a crack, just delaying it for as long as possible to increase sales.

[snapli]

Originally Posted by Ragtag

Well, even if they stream in runtime it won't matter. The files has to be local for the period one plays. Anything on a computer can be cracked,hacked and ripped wide open. It's just a matter of skill and time. And there's no doubt in my mind that the crackers out there will take on the challenge.

Uhm, there was a minor but decisive glitch in my argumentation: I said downloaded, but why does this have to happen? Some small files just stay at their servers and being read at runtime. How do you guess their content?

Cheers,

Snake

@partyboy: Yeah, I know that - therefore this post

[partyboy]

Originally Posted by snapli

Uhm, there was a minor but decisive glitch in my argumentation: I said downloaded, but why does this have to happen? Some small files just stay at their servers and being read at runtime. How do you guess their content?

Cheers,

Snake

@partyboy: Yeah, I know that - therefore this post

In that case they use programs to "sniff" the interactions between client/server; watch what is being sent and requested, and either capture it outright or emulate it. Of course, this is a great simplification but that is essentially what happens. Stored remotely or not, necessary files, or functions, will at some point end up in the client computer's memory - and the crackers have direct access to that.

It could turn out to be very easy to crack after all. Or, it might go uncracked for months. Have to wait and see. But sooner or later the processes will be fully understood and broken. Pretty much a fact of life.

[Brag]

Ubi is doing two things wrong. One, is to alienate it's customer base, and, two, is challenging pirates.

The pirates will be further incentivated as large numbers of former Ubi customers will be eager to jump at a "patched" version while Ubi mucks about trying to sell DRM.

Ubi will not gain anything by delaying cracking by a few months because they will have lost it's client base who will be happily playing off line. without Ubi's permission.

[snapli]

Originally Posted by partyboy

In that case they use programs to "sniff" the interactions between client/server; watch what is being sent and requested, and either capture it outright or emulate it. Of course, this is a great simplification but that is essentially what happens. Stored remotely or not, necessary files, or functions, will at some point end up in the client computer's memory - and the crackers have direct access to that.

It could turn out to be very easy to crack after all. Or, it might go uncracked for months. Have to wait and see. But sooner or later the processes will be fully understood and broken. Pretty much a fact of life.

If people who won't pay for software wouldn't profit from this, I, too, would wait for a crack: to buy the game and to get rid of the connection requirement!

But again: I don't think you can cover all possible server-requests with packet-sniffing. You won't get them all and then your game will stop to work. Apart from that, I totally agree with you, partyboy

[Ragtag]

Originally Posted by partyboy

In that case they use programs to "sniff" the interactions between client/server; watch what is being sent and requested, and either capture it outright or emulate it. Of course, this is a great simplification but that is essentially what happens. Stored remotely or not, necessary files, or functions, will at some point end up in the client computer's memory - and the crackers have direct access to that.

It could turn out to be very easy to crack after all. Or, it might go uncracked for months. Have to wait and see. But sooner or later the processes will be fully understood and broken. Pretty much a fact of life.

That's exactly my point

[dcb]

Just when Ubi discovered their ultimate protection tool, others who pioneered it are dropping it. Rise of Flight will get its OSP removed this February:

http://riseofflight.com/Blogs/post/2010/02/05/LOGIN-OFFLINE-ACCESS-GRANTED!!!.aspx

[CaptJodan]

Little late in seeing this topic...I'm not usually here every day. But I wanted to simply add my voice to those who won't buy the game as long as Ubi continues this practice.

It's sad too, because I've bought all the SH titles so far and have enjoyed them all. I agree with Neal that if we ever want to keep seeing sub sims, we need to support them. SHV has some issues (VIIC only, only till 1943) but I was willing to overlook those issues to support the genre. But I'm not willing to support this.

If Ubi decides to remove this insanity, I'll again likely support them and probably buy SHV. Otherwise, even though it pains me, I won't buy this sim.

[Rosencrantz]

If there is still someone left ready to "buy" DRM, I recommend him to check my thread "Star Force sucks!" I really can't imagine, how crazy things would probably go with DRM.

Edit:

You can find the thread from SHIII forum now. And thanks to Neal it has now title "Star Forve hindering me!"


-RC-