Are there any real deal breakers in SH5 ?

[HundertzehnGustav]

Unfinished product, why rely on unpaid modders, yaddy ya yaddy ya

wich means ignore all problems SHV has?
(--> not to mention their DRM)

why start this thread and ask for opinions?
if Unfinished product, why rely on unpaid modders, yaddy ya yaddy ya is no deal breaker, then tell me:

what is?

(--> not to mention their DRM)

and i honestly ask that question.

The way the question s phrased, everything bad about SHV (Unfinished product, why rely on unpaid modders, yaddy ya yaddy ya) can not be named as a "deal breaker".

I find it funny...
if

Unfinished product, why rely on unpaid modders, yaddy ya yaddy ya

is no deal breaker... then maybe it is time to wake up for some people?

ela-ali-baba is making relatively good money, and his team as well.IMO...
instead of collectinbg welfare checks.

------------------------

I see what the OP is trying to achieve: he is trying to draw a list of things the community needs to work on, he has a positive "pro-work", "lets-get-it-done" attitude. Focus on the future, stop the ranting about the past.
Still, i shake my head and refuse to buy a product as deeply flawed as this one.

[robbo180265]

Originally Posted by HundertzehnGustav

I see what the OP is trying to achieve: he is trying to draw a list of things the community needs to work on, he has a positive "pro-work", "lets-get-it-done" attitude. Focus on the future, stop the ranting about the past.
Still, i shake my head and refuse to buy a product as deeply flawed as this one.

He's trying to get a reasoned debate going about issues ingame, he's trying to do this without the usual trolling

You've somehow missed that point

[tommyk]

> Are there any real deal breakers in SH5 ?

For me the answer is simple: all of it...

DRM, Bugs & Game-Design are not what I will spend my money on...

too much WoW: Bring me 12 spromkis, no wait, sink me 500 ships

[HundertzehnGustav]

No... i did NOT miss that.0 I understood. proof:

"i see what OP is trying to achieve:..."

no matter, thanks for telling lme i am trolling (and by definition, am a troll)

o put it more harshly:
the OP is blind as hell, and the community has gotten the shaft up their collective arses this time.

and yet they (okay... the OP) are/is trying to stay positive... stop the bleeding.

That is a situation where i would avise "seeing someone" or "taking legal action" instead of "licking its own wounds". Yum.



or if it is indeed "licking its own wounds"... then even the question is useless:
-Players have pointed out the problems, and keep doing so all the time
-Ubi is still releaseing minor updates (i guess?)
-the problems listed must be modded
-there is a mods section.


Bottom line:
even the OP question( i applaude your positive attitude, Sir)
no matter how good its intention is

• is Flawed (can not list the fundamental problems)

• useless (there is bug reporting and modding/fixing going on next door)

at the same time.
So why ask the question?

Forgive me my rather black and white way of seeing things... This time around, i see no real way to do otherwise.

[robbo180265]

Originally Posted by HundertzehnGustav

No... i did NOT miss that.0 I understood. proof:

"i see what OP is trying to achieve:..."

no matter, thanks for telling lme i am trolling (and by definition, am a troll)

o put it more harshly:
the OP is blind as hell, and the community has gotten the shaft up their collective arses this time.

and yet they (okay... the OP) are/is trying to stay positive... stop the bleeding.

That is a situation where i would avise "seeing someone" or "taking legal action" instead of "licking its own wounds". Yum.



or if it is indeed "licking its own wounds"... then even the question is useless:
-Players have pointed out the problems, and keep doing so all the time
-Ubi is still releaseing minor updates (i guess?)
-the problems listed must be modded
-there is a mods section.


Bottom line:
even the OP question( i applaude your positive attitude, Sir)
no matter how good its intention is

• is Flawed (can not list the fundamental problems)

• useless (there is bug reporting and modding/fixing going on next door)

at the same time.
So why ask the question?

Forgive me my rather black and white way of seeing things... This time around, i see no real way to do otherwise.

Sorry didn't see you reply right away. I was too busy playing my bugged and broken unplayable game (and enjoying playing it too)

I think the point you are missing (still) is that the game needs work , no-one can deny that. But most of us who actually own the game are still enjoying playing it.

I'll go back to my bugged game now

[janh]

Originally Posted by robbo180265

Sorry didn't see you reply right away. I was too busy playing my bugged and broken unplayable game (and enjoying playing it too)

I think the point you are missing (still) is that the game needs work , no-one can deny that. But most of us who actually own the game are still enjoying playing it.

I'll go back to my bugged game now

And that's why I still am hopeful that it will be a worthy sequel to SHIII one day. And why I keep checking the forum for a "big announcement"...

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by HundertzehnGustav

No... i did NOT miss that.0 I understood.

No, you're still missing the point. This thread isn't about what you're going on about. You can have your opinion, but the topic of this thread isn't about what you're opining on. It's poor forum etiquette to disregard a thread's topic and hijack it with your own subject.

[HundertzehnGustav]

Sooo okay?

i re-red the first post, wich defines what this thread is about.
Hmm.
what are the deal breakers? what prevents people like me to buy the game?

Quite a bit of deal breakers here imo...

Disregard the half product, disregard the Ubi bashing, disregard the yadda yadda...

There are no more Deal breakers any more...?

The first post gives me a question to answer.

What are the Deal breakers?

My answer is:

The way the first post is worded, the way my answers are limited, i am "pushed" to admit that the game is good, has no problems and works as advertized. That is has no deal breakers, because the actual deal breakers are banned from the answer list.

A) that aint my opinion
B) that aint other peoples opinion
C) the question sugests an answer to the user reading said question.
D) that leaves no room for discussion

and also included in my answer is:
why ask such a question if there are no possible deal breakers? sort of "WTF!? " spontaneous reaction.

Does that make me a Troll?



cooool.

[Heretic]

Some people's mountains are other people's molehills and verse visa.

It's subjective.

[HundertzehnGustav]

Originally Posted by horsa

SH5 was a train crash. Right ?

Morale was broken.
too many unnecessary changes to the UI,
very little information on what to do or how to do it ,
character dialogue tediously limited
lack of sub damage control
and so on ....

But hey . Wait. What is really missing ?
A lot of stuff is in there but either underdeveloped (like the character dialogue) or inexplicably hidden away (like compass and 'depth under keel'). All moddable.

Forget the ethics for a moment ( Ubi sucks, unfinished product, why rely on unpaid modders, yaddy ya yaddy ya ......) .
What features are really missing or annoyingly obtrusive. So much so that they are real deal breakers for you? Things that should be in (or not in), which no amount of modding can put right ( like the red triangle in SH2).

Which are the real deal breakers of SH5 ????

so let me play the game...

• AI of all kind do not use torpedoes

Planes, DDs, Torpedo Boats, Schnellboats, Submarines...
no progress in 5 years since shIII

• Wolfpacks

clearly a interaction with BDU/CFlottilla command/inter-uboot operations and communication is needed and was desired.
Nobody seems to have listened

• Substandard

The Supermods of 2008 and 2009 have set the standard to a modern Uboat game.
Units, functions, Weaponry,
variations in ship liveries, ship types,
Radio messages,
User interfaces,
Sounds
AI routines
documentation

are still well below what supermods of SHIII era offer.

I expect a new product to at least "take a look" at what the community implemented over the last...3?4?5? years, and "read" their wishlists.
I expect that a devteam, because the persons are the same ones, to be smart and open their eyes.

Until shortly before release i believed the creators of the game to build on things like GWX or LSH. It was only few months before Day X that we were offered info about the re-definition of the series, primarily based on systems, to aim for a more personal approach.

Such is clearly not the case. No SHIII 2.0? No Money from me. Broken Deal.

...just 3 things off the top of my head, and not in the "ubi bashing, half game, modders needed category".

My opinion valid now?

[Méo]

Originally Posted by HundertzehnGustav

Sooo okay?

The way I see it, it's quite simple, the OP is looking for ''big features'' that are currently missing (i.e. wolfpacks, type IX, 1944-1945, etc.) and not details and bugs that are underdeveloped or unfinished.

For me I would say wolfpacks (I know there are some files about it in the game, but for the moment, they are missing).

But I'm not saying it's a deal breaker until the game gets more polished.

----

btw, EVERYBODY here knows the DRM thing is a deal breaker for some people, so it's nothing new.

[horsa]

The way the first post is worded, the way my answers are limited, i am "pushed" to admit that the game is good, has no problems and works as advertized. That is has no deal breakers, because the actual deal breakers are banned from the answer list.

Not true. Even after the question "forces" you to ditch your main complaint, SH5 still has issues. Some of these may be real deal breakers. That is important because it means that, as a a game, it is indeed a complete turkey.

The question remains open.

( added before your latest post 70)

[horsa]

.just 3 things off the top of my head, and not in the "ubi bashing, half game, modders needed category".

My opinion valid now?

Yes. Now we can work with that

[HundertzehnGustav]

Originally Posted by Méo

The way I see it, it's quite simple, the OP is looking for ''big features'' that are currently missing (i.e. wolfpacks, type IX, 1944-1945, etc.) and not details and bugs that are underdeveloped or unfinished.

Okay... but then the missing years and content are not valid... (half finished product)

If i must leave out the underddevelopped stuff... i have NO answers because "underdevelopped" has such a broad meaning.
Hard call!

Wolfpacks are underdevelopped too... they are missing!
-->Wolfpacs are Missing... the game aint finished (half product)

AI using torpedoes is underdevelopped too... they just do not have any!
-->AI do not have torpedoes... the game aint finished (half product)

Horsa, dude, you are asking an impossible-to-answer question.
and that kind of ticks me off, because its a really interesting one to wich i would like to see a few good answers.

What about you show me your line of thinking by answering your own question? I just do not seem to get it.

[EAF274 Johan]

I'll have a go. I do not have much knowledge of the true modding potential of SH5. I know it's supposed to be big, but just how big I have no clue. So forgive me if some of my game breakers can be modded.

- Weather, AI damage, map markings not saved in Save games
- Intrusive "synchronising" messages even when I have this option turned off
- No Kriegsmarine grid or other detailed coordinates system (degrees in latitude/longitude is not enough)
- Lack of crew animation (not expecting them to run forward during crash dive, but at least I expect to see them cringe when under attack and see them work at repairs like in SH4)
- Lack of detail in the damage system
- No blind spot in hydrophones
- Abrupt patrol endings when macro-mission objectives are fulfilled
- Lack of interaction with BdU via radio
[EDIT: 2 more]
- Immortal officers and no detailed crew management like in SH3/4
- Colliding ships in ports

Given the fact that these features were present in SH3/4 or these issues did not exist (apart from the savegame issue - you'd expect they had fixed that by now), I can only find SH5 to be a step back from its predecessors.

Apart from that, not having a Type II is also a major disappointment for me. I know this can probably be modded in, but who knows how long that will take.