Getting a 'sinking' feeling about SH5

[JU_88]

Originally Posted by WitoldGritz

Thats EXACTLY what i wanted to say with my BAD english!!!

Have you seen "gampley" video? I dont mention "dificulty" tat can be ajusted ofcourse, but all GAMEPLAY and Simulation factor

UBI is comercial company and ofcourse they aim for bigger teenager market and not some bunch of 30y/olds Simulation maniacs!

I hope SH1.4 and SH 1.5 will be kept and developed more far y community!!

Originally Posted by Adriatico

Don't be too optimistic Jim...

SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameplay (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim.

If there was genuine intention to incorporate wishes and feelings of "simulation fans" - the whole project would be much, much earlier opened for interaction and community feedback.
Don't you understand that this "sim" (or game) is not in development any more... if this should be released in March there is only time left to polish the bugs.

Simulation fans are "minor proportion" of market - and real bosses of this project don't give a **** what Neal and community behind him cry for...

Otherwise - they would present main features of game three months ago... not waiting mid-January to present their health bars, famous periscope screen, satelite picture of escort's scanning ...etc.

* * *
Anyway, I am grateful for a SH3 and nice memories... and wish them everything best with SH5 on market, consoles, i-phones, flipers, or whatever it's made for...

Sorry guys but all this is based on what? 2 mins of ingame video and..?

IMHO, You guys are making assumptions.
Why not just wait until some of us have played it before deciding who SHV has been created & market for?

Oh and if the Devs didn't give a toss about our opinons and ideas (or had no control over the games content), why would they bother reading and posting on this forum and attending subsim meets etc?
Marketing?? LOL very funny.

Dan has already explained that there are no 'corperate suit types' directing or influencing the project, that is possibly something that we dreamt up oursleves. (Yet more assumptions)

Give the devs some credit - please.

Thats all.

[WitoldGritz]

and first of all the whole concept of game is wrong if they wanted to represent "life of Uboat Captain"


Its not just about sinking ships and chasing some marchant with "compressed time" its all about inner Sub life! dialogues? i bet UBI gonna put mth like in Footbal Manager!
"You gonna be promoed"
"Well done Sailor on last attack!"
"You not gonna be replaced in next Patrol" and etc...

If it gonna be real life we have not just to attack ships and plot courses we have to manage ALL SHIP with food suplies that should be even more important then Fuell reserve, doing minor maintanances over ship even play card game if you want with some crew

[Jimbuna]

Don't be too optimistic Jim...

Never am, but I do store my hope and faith in those I believe in.....those who have this community at the forefront of their minds (and there are those at Ubi dev team in addition to Neal still about).

SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameplay (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim.

That may well be the case....but after the release of SH5 I hope.

If there was genuine intention to incorporate wishes and feelings of "simulation fans" - the whole project would be much, much earlier opened for interaction and community feedback.

My understanding is that this has been dictated by an earlier negative/contentious experience involving an area of the community and SHIV....and not something I know a great deal about.

Don't you understand that this "sim" (or game) is not in development any more... if this should be released in March there is only time left to polish the bugs.

That may or may not be the case, but a 'polishing of bugs' as you put it could lead to less disenchantment and a better game experience straight out of the box.

Simulation fans are "minor proportion" of market - and real bosses of this project don't give a **** what Neal and community behind him cry for...

Assuming you are correct....I doubt the same can be said of the dev team...I am of the firm belief they will do everything in their power to ensure as good a simulation as is possible, given the constraints place upon them by Ubi regarding time and finances.

Either way, we'll all know come March

I once attended a restaurant with a friend of mine. When the waiter came around to inquire if everything was alright min friend responded that everything was not alright. He then gave the waiter a short list of what was wrong followed by insisting he neither wanted a free meal, nor a replacement meal.

When the waiter finished picking up his jaw my friend went on to explain that his deceased father had been a succesful restaurenteur. An approximate quote follows:
If people refuse to report a problem with their meal, and don't come back, you're out of business.

By the way, not only did my friend pay his bill in full, he also left a VERY healthy tip for the waiter.

It's better to save some-one's business than their feelings, even if you're viewed in a negative light for doing so.

Although they may get annoyed with us at times, the fact that they are reading and responding to our posts tells me that Ubisoft is in fact, interested in our input. Negative input, although less popular, is generaly more constructive than posative input, provided there still remains time for changes.

[Apos]

Originally Posted by Adriatico

Don't be too optimistic Jim...

SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameplay (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim.

If there was genuine intention to incorporate wishes and feelings of "simulation fans" - the whole project would be much, much earlier opened for interaction and community feedback.
Don't you understand that this "sim" (or game) is not in development any more... if this should be released in March there is only time left to polish the bugs.

Simulation fans are "minor proportion" of market - and real bosses of this project don't give a **** what Neal and community behind him cry for...

Otherwise - they would present main features of game three months ago... not waiting mid-January to present their health bars, famous periscope screen, satelite picture of escort's scanning ...etc.

* * *
Anyway, I am grateful for a SH3 and nice memories... and wish them everything best with SH5 on market, consoles, i-phones, flipers, or whatever it's made for...

+1 Its not first time when sim/strategy games changed into arcade-mainstream game cr**. Such games like Rainbow Six changed from strategic sims into arcade shooters.

Im wondering why Ubisoft doesnt listen real fans of SH game series and hire modders of TMO, GWX etc to make game better. It'd make game perfect w/o annoying bugs of 1.0 version.

Somebody could ask @ Ubi forum in FAQ section about realism and HUD thing? Will it be adjustable? I dont really want to buy game which was designed only for little kids. I also dont like Win7 Aero skin on attack periscope, i want real one -> http://www.subsim.com/ssr/sh2/prev6.jpg.

BTW: Im not against it, to make game easier for newcomers but c'mon! I think the SH game series vets deserved for something too.

[Lord Justice]

And still ye come!!

[Adriatico]

Jimbuna... I genuinly wish you were right. From your mouth to god's ears...

But... I bet that you'll be clicking with your right hand to far-left side torp buttons... while staring trough far-right "whole", instead of "holding" periscope between your hands.

No matter what "community" said in nearby thread...

If I'm wrong - I'll reply to every your future post with "Your Majesty"...

***
Just feel terribly sorry that GWX4 was cancelled... Feeling deep in my guts - that we missed out a great simulation experience... till moding comunity try to fix SH5.

[JU_88]

Originally Posted by Snestorm

I once attended a restaurant with a friend of mine. When the waiter came around to inquire if everything was alright min friend responded that everything was not alright. He then gave the waiter a short list of what was wrong followed by insisting he neither wanted a free meal, nor a replacement meal.

When the waiter finished picking up his jaw my friend went on to explain that his deceased father had been a succesful restaurenteur. An approximate quote follows:
If people refuse to report a problem with their meal, and don't come back, you're out of business.

By the way, not only did my friend pay his bill in full, he also left a VERY healthy tip for the waiter.

It's better to save some-one's business than their feelings, even if you're viewed in a negative light for doing so.

Although they may get annoyed with us at times, the fact that they are reading and responding to our posts tells me that Ubisoft is in fact, interested in our input. Negative input, although less popular, is generaly more constructive than posative input, provided there still remains time for changes.

Good story, but while you friend had eaten some of his food, we have not played SHV yet.
Maybe even something as simple as a HUD should not be judged until it has actually been used/experienced in game?
Complaining about SHV now, is about as logical as 'your freind' complaining about the resturant food, after only reading the menu.

P.S This is not SH3 and as far as we know there are no major issues (e.g lack of a dynamic campaign etc)

[Méo]

Originally Posted by Uber Gruber

If we do not voice our desires now then we should not expect them to be accomodated.

Therefore, if you have a requirement for SH5 you should shout loudly from the roof tops...and shout now!

I agree and that's not the problem IMHO.

The thing is that everytime something new comes, lot of people here seem to be acting like groupies and become hysterical.

You can express some doubts, shout it, but there's a difference between this and saying that it's gonna be an inevitable failure everytime there's a little sample of an unfinished product that comes out.

Try to think if you were Dan, would you like to come here after a hard day at work and spend time reading those threads where most of the comments are continuously bashing your work? Would this motivate you to interact more with this community?

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Adriatico

Jimbuna... I genuinly wish you were right. From your mouth to god's ears...

But... I bet that you'll be clicking with your right hand to far-left side torp buttons... while staring trough far-right "whole", instead of "holding" periscope between your hands.

No matter what "community" said in nearby thread...

If I'm wrong - I'll reply to every your future post with "Your Majesty"...

***
Just feel terribly sorry that GWX4 was cancelled... Feeling deep in my guts - that we missed out a great simulation experience... till moding comunity try to fix SH5.

Let us both hope together

Your Majesty eh

Has a nice ring to it

Right now I'm simply trying to counter the number of bear traps my friend keeps putting his feet in



There be sharks in those waters as well

[THE_MASK]

Susan Boyle said " i knew once i started singing they would like me " .

[Lord Justice]

Originally Posted by jimbuna

Let us both hope together

Your Majesty eh




l

LMHO one would be more suited to your grace, lordship, your excellency.

[urfisch]

is anybody here really thinking, that something from subsim reaches the dev-HQ? maybe...but do they care about, thats the point. i think we can say and cry as much we want, we wont change much. maybe in 2005 when the revival of the series started, it was possible to listen and built in a dynamic campaign, as the community wanted.

but

some of the posters here are right. the market itself is changing, and with it ubi goes. the masses are now the only target group, due to selling problems. concepts are drifting to be more and more for console games. arcade-play with sports, shooters and adventures is the new hope of the publishers. simulation games never had a major role, but will go apart. thats no curiosity. worldwide seen, only europe was a kind of bastion with players, who liked to play highly detailed sims for hours just to evade a destroyer or go and cutting hundrets of trees for building houses in games like anno, etc.

most players do not want to "dive" into a game, just to feel it. they want: "switch it on" and ACTION. thats what the market says. poor, but true.

in my opinion the studios grow to big and therefore need to take care of the masses. in times of SSI or similar studios (sierra with aces series), there was time and effort to take care of the smaller, more grateful groups, like us. theres not much we can do about this. a solution for the future would be, that big and functional modding groups, like the GWX team, etc. collect some money and found new, small studios. maybe, the great games market will correct itself and give these groups the chance of getting the niches back to real life. the big publishers do have the money, but not the passion. but i hope, there will come times, when quality of gameplay is needed again.

so, lets hope for the game sh5 and the winds of change.

[stabiz]

Amen!

[Turbografx]

Originally Posted by urfisch

is anybody here really thinking, that something from subsim reaches the dev-HQ? maybe...but do they care about, thats the point. i think we can say and cry as much we want, we wont change much. maybe in 2005 when the revival of the series started, it was possible to listen and built in a dynamic campaign, as the community wanted.

but

some of the posters here are right. the market itself is changing, and with it ubi goes. the masses are now the only target group, due to selling problems. concepts are drifting to be more and more for console games. arcade-play with sports, shooters and adventures is the new hope of the publishers. simulation games never had a major role, but will go apart. thats no curiosity. worldwide seen, only europe was a kind of bastion with players, who liked to play highly detailed sims for hours just to evade a destroyer or go and cutting hundrets of trees for building houses in games like anno, etc.

most players do not want to "dive" into a game, just to feel it. they want: "switch it on" and ACTION. thats what the market says. poor, but true.

in my opinion the studios grow to big and therefore need to take care of the masses. in times of SSI or similar studios (sierra with aces series), there was time and effort to take care of the smaller, more grateful groups, like us. theres not much we can do about this. a solution for the future would be, that big and functional modding groups, like the GWX team, etc. collect some money and found new, small studios. maybe, the great games market will correct itself and give these groups the chance of getting the niches back to real life. the big publishers do have the money, but not the passion. but i hope, there will come times, when quality of gameplay is needed again.

so, lets hope for the game sh5 and the winds of change.

Double plus good.