Syria conflict: 'Chemical attacks kill hundreds'

[eddie]

Assad destroying the evidence?

http://news.msn.com/world/syria-bomb...hemical-attack

[mapuc]

Found this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nerve_agent

especially this caught my eyes

Originally Posted by wikipedia

Initial symptoms following exposure to nerve agents (like sarin) are a runny nose, tightness in the chest, and constriction of the pupils. Soon after, the victim will then have difficulty breathing and will experience nausea and drooling. As the victim continues to lose control of his or her bodily functions, he or she will involuntarily salivate, lacrimate, urinate, defecate, and experience gastrointestinal pain and vomiting. Blisters and burning of the eyes and/or lungs may also occur.[2][3] This phase is followed by initially myoclonic jerks followed by status epilepticus. Death then comes via complete respiratory depression, most likely via the excessive peripheral activity at the neuromuscular junction of the diaphragm.[4]
The effects of nerve agents are very long lasting and increase with successive exposures. Survivors of nerve agent poisoning almost invariably suffer chronic neurological damage. This neurological damage can also lead to continuing psychiatric effects.[5]

Markus

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by eddie

Assad destroying the evidence?

http://news.msn.com/world/syria-bomb...hemical-attack

That wouldn't surprise me in the least....the west should push as hard as they can diplomatically to get inspectors in there (and I mean in short time...a month at most).

Failure to do so as a consequence of Syrian refusal then put a no fly zone in place similar to that in Libya previously and live by their morals....otherwise stop moaning and keep out of the whole affair.

Obama must be getting embarrassed by his previous 'red line' comments.

[Wolferz]

Obama should be embarrassed because he can't overtly help his Muslim brethren without pissing off all of us citizen types. He better stick to his campaign to usurp us.

See through you we can.

[Skybird]

It is counter-intuitive to think Assad ordered the use of chemical weapons now that weapon inspectors already are underway in Syria, although being held on a very short line by the Syrians. But does this really mean anything? He could as well just think that he nevertheless could get away with it if doing this publicity stunt right under the nose of the inspectors and the UN. And who would accuse him for assuming that? Obama and the EU and the UN all have so far given extremely weak reactions to the whole Syrian bloodshed, and Assad knows he has the Russians behind him. Probably also the Chinese. Even the Israelis have an interest to see him staying, instead of having to deal with a chaotic breed of several rivalling factions and ultra-fundamentalists who in case of victory will have access to those weapons.

I don't bet a cent on who committed that chemical strike. That the rebels did it, is as possible as that Assad ordered it. It even is possible that there was a break in the chain of command, or that local military commanders overstepped their responsibility. Heck, it is even possible that the strike was ordered from somebody in Assad's camp who wanted to struck the beloved Fuhrer from behind to improve his own cards when weakening or removing Assad, or to settle an open bill.

I still recommend to do the same as we did in reaction to the genocide committed by the Janjaweed, or the genocide committed in Rwanda, and so many other massacres that we witnessed: let's do nothing. We do that often, so what makes Syria so precious that now we should change it? Syria is not worth our tax money and the defense budget it finances, nor the health and life of our soldiers. In the thread on Egypt I recently linked an article "Nobody needs a democratic Egypt". What was written in that, in principle is true for Syria as well. Especially the part about the nature of mentality and ideological basis of those on whose behalf some now want to intervene.

And btw, in reality we do not have money anyway. What our nations have, is debts. Plenty of them. Implicit debts that are several, many times as high as our nations' yearly GDPs.

[eddie]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

That wouldn't surprise me in the least....the west should push as hard as they can diplomatically to get inspectors in there (and I mean in short time...a month at most).

Failure to do so as a consequence of Syrian refusal then put a no fly zone in place similar to that in Libya previously and live by their morals....otherwise stop moaning and keep out of the whole affair.

Obama must be getting embarrassed by his previous 'red line' comments.

I agree about the No-fly zone! But, a couple of things to ponder-

How would the Russians react about foreign aircraft near their sea base that they have in the area?

Would love to see Iranian aircraft turned back at the Syrian border, but again, who would be involved with enforcing it?

[Feuer Frei!]

Originally Posted by Skybird

that weapon inspectors already are underway in Syria

Underway? They are situated in Damascus, but thats about it.

They need to get access to be able to verify if Nerve gas (and that is what is alleged to have been used) was used. Which it is almost certainly the case.

So far, no access for them.

Underway? They are situated in Damascus, but thats about it.

They need to get access to be able to verify if Nerve gas (and that is what is alleged to have been used) was used. Which it is almost certainly the case.

So far, no access for them.

And as such is the situation they need the approval of the government and the various rebels, also whichever specific armed group holds that particular area and whichever specific armed groups hold the neighbouring areas.
It takes a lot of negotiating with a lot of groups to allow a bunch of foreigners to go poking around the neighbourhood in any degree of safety.

[Feuer Frei!]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

And as such is the situation they need the approval of the government and the various rebels, also whichever specific armed group holds that particular area and whichever specific armed groups hold the neighbouring areas.
It takes a lot of negotiating with a lot of groups to allow a bunch of foreigners to go poking around the neighbourhood in any degree of safety.

Indeed.

Never mind about not letting them in because (possibly) you have something to hide.

[Feuer Frei!]

Under Analysis:

as a clearer picture begins to emerge of the alleged attack and its consequences, some experts say they are becoming more convinced that a nerve agent may have been used.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23806491

23 August 2013 Last updated at 01:22 GMT

[kraznyi_oktjabr]

I think VX was possibly used. If I remember correctly it in sufficient dose causes paralysis in whole body and especially in muscles around lungs. Latter causes death by suffocation.

This is based completely on memory though so I maybe wrong... Its also possible that I mix up symptoms with some other nerve agent.

[Feuer Frei!]

Originally Posted by kraznyi_oktjabr

I think VX was possibly used. If I remember correctly it in sufficient dose causes paralysis in whole body and especially in muscles around lungs. Latter causes death by suffocation.

This is based completely on memory though so I maybe wrong... Its also possible that I mix up symptoms with some other nerve agent.

This will jog your memory perhaps?

http://www.bt.cdc.gov/agent/vx/index.asp

As for other forms:

https://www.osha.gov/SLTC/emergencyp...des/nerve.html

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Feuer Frei!

Underway? They are situated in Damascus, but thats about it.

They need to get access to be able to verify if Nerve gas (and that is what is alleged to have been used) was used. Which it is almost certainly the case.

So far, no access for them.

their mission was planned and decided long before, they are not there to examine recent events, they also are on such a short line that their mission probably is pretty much useless.

Why are people expecting Assad to act stupid? Anyone here really believing that if latest massacre was him, he would help to reveal it? I think politicians should not make even greater fools of themselves and should not demknstrate their helplessness so exhibitionalistically . If you do not have the power and strength to put your hands where your mouth is - shut the hell up. Don't be so eager to draw attention to your own helplessness and cluelessness.

Assad should allow examination of his crime. And the thief in the team should raise the hand please and hand nimself over without need. Hilarious. Whom do these idiots believe they are dealing with? A weakling and retard?

[MH]

Originally Posted by Skybird

their mission was planned and decided long before, they are not there to examine recent events, they also are on such a short line that their mission probably is pretty much useless.

Why are people expecting Assad to act stupid? Anyone here really believing that if latest massacre was him, he would help to reveal it? I think politicians should not make even greater fools of themselves and should not demknstrate their helplessness so exhibitionalistically . If you do not have the power and strength to put your hands where your mouth is - shut the hell up. Don't be so eager to draw attention to your own helplessness and cluelessness.

Assad should allow examination of his crime. And the thief in the team should raise the hand please and hand nimself over without need. Hilarious. Whom do these idiots believe they are dealing with? A weakling and retard?

The evidence and data is out there.
Surly US goverment knows exactly what happend.
The thing is that nobody in the west want to know- as it seems.
So it all can be left to UN then which is known for its uselessness.
By the time UN comes up with something nobody will be interested and this thread will be on page 100.




.

The evidence and data is out there.

Being "out there" is meaningless without access to "out there".
If they don't get access all they are going to be able to say is along the same lines as last time. Which in the end was .....Two people at an unknown time and unknown location are confirmed to have been exposed to chemical agents from an unknown source by unknown people.
Which when it comes to data and evidence is pretty worthless.