s class opinion

[tmdgm]

Anyone out there play with S boats? I just started an sboat campaign in the asiatic at start of war and it's a pain, really because of it's speed. In medium seas, most i can do is 10-12 knots. Most freighters i'm running into are going 10 knots (which seems 3 knots faster than in SH3 btw?)

If i'm not in the front quarter of the freighters, ferget bout it. I can't catch em.

Doesn't seem like any other subs are available to upgrade to yet when i'm in dock.

i like the boat, just too slow on surface.

[Capt. Morgan]

I like the "Sugar" boat too. I've begun every Pacific career in one.

Some Skippers may start out in an air conditioned, radar equipped, 10 tubed Gato, but they won't appreciate what a Gato is capable of nearly as much as you will appreciate a lowly Porpoise when you finally get offered one (that's usually around partol 3).


In the words of the immortal Harry Callahan ( ), "A man's got to know his limitations", and that's what the S' is all about.

Survive in an S-Boat long enough to be offered anything better and you'll be unstoppable.

[tmdgm]

Originally Posted by Capt. Morgan

I like the "Sugar" boat too. I've begun every Pacific career in one.

Some Skippers may start out in an air conditioned, radar equipped, 10 tubed Gato, but they won't appreciate what a Gato is capable of nearly as much as you will appreciate a lowly Porpoise when you finally get offered one (that's usually around partol 3).


In the words of the immortal Harry Callahan ( ), "A man's got to know his limitations", and that's what the S' is all about.

Survive in an S-Boat long enough to be offered anything better and you'll be unstoppable.

k, so it's 3rd patrol i can upgrade? I think i'm about ready for a porpoise.

[Rockin Robbins]

The blind chimp tosses a dart at the bonus board every time you end a cruise to see what upgrades you're offered. Don't extend your cruises by resupplying. Get home, let the chimp do his thing and you'll get your porpoise quicker.

[Ducimus]

s class opinion

Leaky, pop riveted, outdated WW1 rust buckets fit only for training duty!

(duck's and runs )

[razark]

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Leaky, pop riveted, outdated WW1 rust buckets fit only for training duty!

But that's what makes them so much fun!

[Gerald]

Originally Posted by tmdgm

Anyone out there play with S boats? I just started an sboat campaign in the asiatic at start of war and it's a pain, really because of it's speed. In medium seas, most i can do is 10-12 knots. Most freighters i'm running into are going 10 knots (which seems 3 knots faster than in SH3 btw?)

If i'm not in the front quarter of the freighters, ferget bout it. I can't catch em.

Doesn't seem like any other subs are available to upgrade to yet when i'm in dock.

i like the boat, just too slow on surface.

[pickinthebanjo]

Yeah, I like the S-class myself, you gotta respect something that outdated. Didn't they crush at 100m? I'm just going of old history channel on that, never actually had to dive one past 100m

[Rockin Robbins]

Outdated????? The S-Boat was the first submarine to be optimized for underwater performance, beating the Type XXI U-Boat by 24 years! Smaller and with less power than the later fleet boats, it was faster and quicker handling underwater.

However, not having solved the battery problem, when it was time to design a fleet boat, the designers chose to build a surface raider that could submerge when it actually had to. But the S-Boat absolutely disproves the notion that the Germans were just some kind of alien supermen who designed an absolute breakthrough in the Type XXI because of its optimization for submerged speed. Pure poppycock!

So I'll take that 9 knot surface speed with a smile! The S-Boat was almost 30 years out of date and STILL acquitted itself admirably in WWII. Build some new ones with decent ice cream machines and they would have been good for another 20 years.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

Outdated????? The S-Boat was the first submarine to be optimized for underwater performance, beating the Type XXI U-Boat by 24 years! Smaller and with less power than the later fleet boats, it was faster and quicker handling underwater.

However, not having solved the battery problem, when it was time to design a fleet boat, the designers chose to build a surface raider that could submerge when it actually had to. But the S-Boat absolutely disproves the notion that the Germans were just some kind of alien supermen who designed an absolute breakthrough in the Type XXI because of its optimization for submerged speed. Pure poppycock!

So I'll take that 9 knot surface speed with a smile! The S-Boat was almost 30 years out of date and STILL acquitted itself admirably in WWII. Build some new ones with decent ice cream machines and they would have been good for another 20 years.

Wow, a bunch of stuffage I did not know about the S class boats. I feel chagrined dissing the Sugar boats.

[rein1705]

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

Outdated????? The S-Boat was the first submarine to be optimized for underwater performance, beating the Type XXI U-Boat by 24 years! Smaller and with less power than the later fleet boats, it was faster and quicker handling underwater.

However, not having solved the battery problem, when it was time to design a fleet boat, the designers chose to build a surface raider that could submerge when it actually had to. But the S-Boat absolutely disproves the notion that the Germans were just some kind of alien supermen who designed an absolute breakthrough in the Type XXI because of its optimization for submerged speed. Pure poppycock!

So I'll take that 9 knot surface speed with a smile! The S-Boat was almost 30 years out of date and STILL acquitted itself admirably in WWII. Build some new ones with decent ice cream machines and they would have been good for another 20 years.

ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!!
Ive been in love with the pig boats ever since SH1
If you can be successful in these boats you'll never feel the same in another.

[TorpexXIII]

I love the S boats. Always start in one. It makes upgrading to a bigger boat real sweet. Mind you its fun trying to get anywhere in them fast.
I even have trouble catching up with downed pilots!! LOL

[joegrundman]

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

Outdated????? The S-Boat was the first submarine to be optimized for underwater performance, beating the Type XXI U-Boat by 24 years! Smaller and with less power than the later fleet boats, it was faster and quicker handling underwater.

However, not having solved the battery problem, when it was time to design a fleet boat, the designers chose to build a surface raider that could submerge when it actually had to. But the S-Boat absolutely disproves the notion that the Germans were just some kind of alien supermen who designed an absolute breakthrough in the Type XXI because of its optimization for submerged speed. Pure poppycock!

So I'll take that 9 knot surface speed with a smile! The S-Boat was almost 30 years out of date and STILL acquitted itself admirably in WWII. Build some new ones with decent ice cream machines and they would have been good for another 20 years.

The principles of surface and subsurface optimisation were well understood before the outbreak of world war one, and several world war one boats were designed for sub-surface optimisation, in various navies.

This was proven to be an ineffective design concept. This goes for the S-boat, in that it is not a boat that is designed to operate effectively for long periods underwater, and the attempts to do so also harmed its performance on the surface.

All other boats were designed to be divable surface cruisers for good reason, with hydrodynamic optimisation focussing on reduced drag when on the surface.

The late war german boats went back to earlier design principles of optimisation for sub-surface operations for they were the first boats designed completely to operate underwater at all times, therefore not requiring efficient performance on the surface.

[kylesplanet]

Here is a question I have wondered. Did the S-Boat crews and Fleetboat crews interchange or did they stick with one or the other? The reason I ask is they were very different animals. I've read several books and don't remember anyone addressing this.

[Rockin Robbins]

Originally Posted by joegrundman

The principles of surface and subsurface optimisation were well understood before the outbreak of world war one, and several world war one boats were designed for sub-surface optimisation, in various navies.

This was proven to be an ineffective design concept. This goes for the S-boat, in that it is not a boat that is designed to operate effectively for long periods underwater, and the attempts to do so also harmed its performance on the surface.

All other boats were designed to be divable surface cruisers for good reason, with hydrodynamic optimisation focussing on reduced drag when on the surface.

The late war german boats went back to earlier design principles of optimisation for sub-surface operations for they were the first boats designed completely to operate underwater at all times, therefore not requiring efficient performance on the surface.

Correction. The first boats to be designed to operate underwater at all times were the US nuclear boats. Operating on snorkel cannot be called submerged operation. However there is some justification that it made an underwater optimized design more feasible. There are many who claim that the underwater optimization was the revolutionary breakthrough of the Type XXI. As you have said, it was not, as the principles were already well understood by all.

Snorkel operation is just as affected by surface conditions as operating with the entire boat up on the surface, as it is kinda important that it suck air instead of hydrogen dioxide. In addition the boat was not well hidden on snorkel, as it was a large and prominent radar reflector having no value to keeping the submarine hidden. Our hunter killer groups learned that early on and used it to great advantage when hunting the few U-Boats that were so equipped. The snorkel's effect, then, was to blind the submarine crew, giving them a false sense of security. Advantage Allies.