Game or sim?

[jazman]

[QUOTE=quitefrankly][quote=jazman]

Originally Posted by quitefrankly

What am I not understanding? I don't think you are understanding me. It IS like a flight sim. You might be sailing a sub instead of flying a plane, but its still technically the same process. You leave base, travel to your target and fight stuff, and then come home. Its the same process, and I like both equally! I explained that already.

Your description of the process is a vast over-simplification. It's like saying "everyone is born, lives, then dies, so everyone's life is basically the same." No, Britney Spears' life is not the same as Johann Sebastian Bach's. At your simplified level, sure they both breathed, metabolized, procreated, etc. But that's not all there is to it.

SH4 has depth to it (pun intended) for those of us with a more contemplative nature who like a good puzzle (sinking ships with manual targeting), in a cat-and-mouse kind of game. And who like to take the scenic view, because it is scenic (I live near the ocean, and am hopelessly mesmerized by it). And those of us who are fascinated by the theatre and the campaign.

Maybe that's why everything you say against the game just doesn't bother me. I'm pretty sure we have different temperaments.

[quitefrankly]

[quote=jazman][quote=quitefrankly]

Originally Posted by jazman

Your description of the process is a vast over-simplification. It's like saying "everyone is born, lives, then dies, so everyone's life is basically the same." No, Britney Spears' life is not the same as Johann Sebastian Bach's. At your simplified level, sure they both breathed, metabolized, procreated, etc. But that's not all there is to it.

SH4 has depth to it (pun intended) for those of us with a more contemplative nature who like a good puzzle (sinking ships with manual targeting), in a cat-and-mouse kind of game. And who like to take the scenic view, because it is scenic (I live near the ocean, and am hopelessly mesmerized by it). And those of us who are fascinated by the theatre and the campaign.

Maybe that's why everything you say against the game just doesn't bother me. I'm pretty sure we have different temperaments.

Ok first off, don't assume you have a "more contemplative" nature than me, and don't assume I don't like a good puzzle. You don't know me, and even if we met, I very much doubt you would understand me anyway. It sounds like you are so wrapped up in your own self importance, you can't digest anything anybody else says.

The compexity of Silent Hunter 4, is a drop in the ocean (Yes, I can pun too), to actually being in the Navy. The watered down (hah, and again) experience of Silent Hunter 4, is not even comparable to my time spent at sea.

There is depth to a flight sim too. Infact, its significantly harder to master a game like LOMAC, than it is to master Silent Hunter 4... One of the reasons it isn't especially well known, is because most people don't last 5 minutes.

But my point still remaims, and I'm sure, it will continue to go over your head. A flight sim and a sub sim, works in very similar ways, whether you can understand that or not. This highlights clearly, that SH4 is missing a few key features that it should really have.

If you want to just sail around, looking at the scenery, you can buy Ship Simulator 2008, or actually buy a boat and go out into the ocean for real. Fill up with fuel, food, drink, and then plot a course to somewhere for a day trip. SH4 is meant to be a combat simulator, not just a sub sim. And as a combat simulator, it is lacking. If you where really as contemplative as you claim, you would welcome more depth in the game you love so much, rather than trying to argue with me.

The game's shortcomings may not bother you, because you are so busy being mesmerised by the ocean scenery, but it bothers me. So, are you more important than me? Am I not entitled to want more from the game? Because you are already satisfied, would you rather I keep quiet?

It must be a very lonely experience, getting mesmerised by that ocean of yours, and being able to interract properly with other humans.

I suppose we do have different temperaments. Thank god for that!

[jazman]

[QUOTE=quitefrankly][quote=jazman]

Originally Posted by quitefrankly

Ok first off, don't assume you have a "more contemplative" nature than me, and don't assume I don't like a good puzzle. You don't know me, and even if we met, I very much doubt you would understand me anyway. It sounds like you are so wrapped up in your own self importance, you can't digest anything anybody else says.

You're probably quite right there. I do have my faults. But I'm not the one bored by SH4.

[quitefrankly]

Being bored of SH4 is a fault?

[jazman]

Originally Posted by quitefrankly

Being bored of SH4 is a fault?

Not my problem. Sorry I stuck my nose into your thread.

[Winston Caine]

Originally Posted by tomoose

Quitefrankly;
This game/simulation is all about patience and manoeuvering stealthily in for the kill as opposed to jumping right into the action (although the single missions do that). Yes, the missions are fairly repetitive but for the U-boats and Pacific Sub drivers that was the reality ("go to Area X, patrol, sink enemy ships, come back home, rest, refit, go out and do it all over again"). The bonus for us is we can do in hours in the game what it took months to do in reality.

And if you really think that's a problem, try one of those war patrols or naval battles. They tend to be a bit more dynamic than the career.

[the_belgian]

Originally Posted by the_belgian

1)I have been in the SH-series from the beginning and,although mainly graphical,SH4 is a great game i went back to SH3 and am not scared to share my vision to others(not in a way"I am not satisfied but can better leave in silence...").

2)The reason i leave is simple;tention.SH3 has allot more of it than SH4.But when those who change collors(US into German)keep silent here it feels to me as if you could not stand the critics on SH4!

3)Sniping?I'd call it an anouncement
And who knows,one day i'll be back...

And now,i'm back in the Pacific!(once the cat has tasted the milk she keeps comming back )

[aurora-7]

I'm also from the world of flight sims (IL-2, specifically). It's apples and oranges to compare flight simming to sub simming. Air combat is more fast paced, especially for the jet sims. It's a true duel between individuals and their mounts. Submarine warfare is about management of resources and careful planning.

Flight simming can accurately reflect the way it is for a person to pilot and aircraft. It’s centered around an individual and his/her control over their machine. It’s combat is fast paced and reflexive responses are critical for survival.

Submarine warfare is just a different story. You need to try to replicate a scenario that in real life involved a crew of 75+ people to get the job done. Missions are measured in days and months. It’s planning and resource management. It’s a job. You spend most of your time hiding and trying to sneak up on unsuspecting enemies. No perception of speed or soaring.

That said, I’m just as much into SH-IV as I am in IL-2. I see them both more as historical simulations then just games. You have to be in different mind sets to enjoy either sim. As much as I like the exhilaration I get by attacking tiger tanks with my stormavik, I also like planning my course, speed and surface/submerge points as I sip my coffee while studying the charts.

Sub simming definitely not fast paced combat sim and maybe the problem for someone getting bored with SH-IV is that it’s just too realistic reflecting what submarine warfare was like. Fair enough. But it’s also the same reason why I like it.

I had also gotten the 1/72 Revell Gato class submarine and thought it would be a great motivator for me to complete the build. It definitely is! Now I just need to find a mod for the kit that will allow me to have an early style fairwater for the conning tower.