The Boxer - Page 2

August · 11-24-09, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Platapus

Honestly, pretty much the same.

I completely disagree. A society that eradicates such things would be bland indeed.

GoldenRivet · 11-24-09, 10:39 PM

I agree they should have the right - im not saying they shouldn't have the right to box, or bungee jump, or play Russian roulette.

I'm just saying that in my opinion - a lot of that stuff seems foolish.

perhaps i have far too great an instinct at "self preservation"

perhaps it comes with my job of being a professional pilot and flight instructor... my job is to ask myself before every flight "what can i do to prevent my passengers and myself from getting injured or killed today?"

I have only been in a few fist fights in my life.

won a couple - lost a couple - but it certainly is not something i would intentionally climb into a ring and do before an audience.

take another example

motocross racer Jeremy Lusk... he had barely started living his adult life when he was killed during a motocross jump.

I wont call the man stupid - apparently he was doing what he loved to do - however - i will say that you wouldnt find my arse whirling 50 feet through the air upside down, holding on with one hand on a dirt bike.

life is risky business.

I agree with you guys that if you don't live your life - it is wasted.

but if you live it so hard as to die in your early 20's... is that not also a waste?

11-24-09, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

won a couple - lost a couple - but it certainly is not something i would intentionally climb into a ring and do before an audience.

How do you know you've won a fist fight that doesn't take place in a ring?

At least around here boxers quite often get pretty good compensation, have doctors who attend to them, get an athletes pension. If one is a boxer in some country where there is no athletes pensionsystem then I guess it can be pretty unrewarding stuff.

GoldenRivet · 11-24-09, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneToughHerring

How do you know you've won a fist fight that doesn't take place in a ring?

When the other guy has a broken nose, a bleeding eye and is crying in the fetal position and you are in more or less the same condition as when you started swinging.

11-25-09, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

When the other guy has a broken nose, a bleeding eye and is crying in the fetal position and you are in more or less the same condition as when you started swinging.

Yea one might think so. But having found out, there aren't any rules in fighting that has no rules. So win one day and next day you'll meet the whole club meaning there might be more rounds then just one. And basicly no rules.

Also there's that pesky law that says, at least around here, that the one who does more damage will have to pay more if and when the case goes to court. Even if the other guy "started it".

Sailor Steve · 11-25-09, 01:44 AM

No. If I knew beyond all doubt that a certain activity would kill me at a certain point, I wouldn't do it. But we never know that. It's a risk, yes, but a certainty?

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

I have never understood why these men have the desire to climb into a boxing ring, or an MMA cage or any other arena and rather pointlessly beat the living crap out of one another's heads.

For the same reason that young men go to war. It's a thrill, there are reasons and excuses, and it's always the other guy who's going to die, not me.

kiwi_2005 · 11-25-09, 09:03 AM

nothing wrong with boxing, helps release alot of anger built up. Best thing for a young man is to get in a ring and go a few rounds - far better than going to a bar and drinking a few rounds.

11-25-09, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

nothing wrong with boxing, helps release alot of anger built up. Best thing for a young man is to get in a ring and go a few rounds - far better than going to a bar and drinking a few rounds.

Yea I agree. Even if one only does the calisthenics/shadow boxing/cardio stuff and not the actual fighting/sparring then it's a good sport for both men and women. Gives confidence and is good for people of all ages.

August · 11-25-09, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

No. If I knew beyond all doubt that a certain activity would kill me at a certain point, I wouldn't do it. But we never know that. It's a risk, yes, but a certainty?

For the same reason that young men go to war. It's a thrill, there are reasons and excuses, and it's always the other guy who's going to die, not me.

Yeah although they rarely admit it, young men are often convinced of their immortality.

Oberon · 11-25-09, 05:22 PM

Bingo, I mean if you're asking why people box, then you might as well ask why people go to war, or play NFL or any other sport which incurs physical damage, not so long ago a report claimed that 'heading' a football increases the likelihood of brain damage. Take from that what you will.
However, at the end of the day no two people on this Earth are exactly alike, and while I agree Boxing certainly doesn't have the appeal today than it used to in the days of Ali, or even Tyson and Bruno (although the recent news about the short Brit who took down that tall Russian gave me a grin, talk about David and Goliath) but surely it's better in the ring between two guys who want to fight, than in the street between a guy who wants a fight and an innocent passer by, something which we see a lot of in the UK these days.

Kiwi and OTH are quite right in a way, it's no surprise that in the British Army and I'm sure the US Army too, there is several boxing teams, quite competative ones too, and they can be put to good use with some people who have, shall we say, a more aggressive streak than others, and the discipline instilled in a) the army and b) the training for boxing. Actually, come to think of it, I think they also used to put in chaps who had confidence problems, help build them up, that kinda thing. I don't know if it still goes on in the British Army...probably too much red tape, but I'm pretty sure that twenty-thirty years ago the chaps used to go in the ring.

I've never boxed, never will, and have no particular desire to, however I understand that there are those that do, and to them I say, good luck, so long as they know what they're getting themselves into and accept that, then good luck to 'em.

GoldenRivet · 11-25-09, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oberon

I've never boxed, never will, and have no particular desire to, however I understand that there are those that do, and to them I say, good luck, so long as they know what they're getting themselves into and accept that, then good luck to 'em.

I agree.

wonder how his widow and infant daughter feel about it though?

The point i was trying to make...

such a waste at just 25 years old.

of course we all take risks just climbing into the shower in the morning... but while taking a shower is not a particularly risky activity; boxing and ama fighting are inherently dangerous, lethally so.

Oberon · 11-25-09, 06:13 PM

The armed forces are also a deep risk, and people younger than 25 die in it, boxing is just one such example of high risk sports, although it's probably one of the most publicised of them, but Ice Hockey is another pretty brutal game at times although it has better safety features. Base jumping, bull riding, cliff diving, cliff climbing (and I mean the nutters without the ropes). It is pretty darn selfish though to do this if you have a wife and kids though, and it's about that time that the gloves should be hung up if not before hand. Although in some peoples case, it's their sport that brings in the money for their lifestyle, look at the Rooneys and the Beckhams, their sport opened up the gateway to their life and admittedly now they can probably bring in as much money off the pitch as they can on it they are still living the life of riley because of a sport which can be dangerous, not as dangerous as boxing, obviously, but still can cause serious injuries at times, likewise rugby players, moreso in fact.
It's a bit of a catch-22 really, but I do agree with the sentiment you bring up on the dependents of people in high risk sports.

GoldenRivet · 11-25-09, 06:15 PM

good points you have made oberon.

on the other hand... very few people join the military or perform some other highly dangerous job for the "sport" of doing so.

August · 11-25-09, 06:46 PM

I'm thinking more about the average person. I regard voluntarily risking ones neck as an important character building life experience for a young man.

GoldenRivet · 11-25-09, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

I'm thinking more about the average person. I regard voluntarily risking ones neck as an important character building life experience for a young man.

true

but to what end?

voluntarily risking one's neck for the purposes of national security or to protect the innocent or to provide for the betterment of mankind etc

thats one thing

but what about voluntarily risking one's neck for the sake of seeing their name in lights? or winning a $50,000 purse to spend on a sports car?

motivation says a lot about the intent and about the sort of "character" the indivudual will be building too

11-24-09, 10:39 PM	#17
GoldenRivet Subsim Aviator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 8,726 Downloads: 146 Uploads: 0	I agree they should have the right - im not saying they shouldn't have the right to box, or bungee jump, or play Russian roulette. I'm just saying that in my opinion - a lot of that stuff seems foolish. perhaps i have far too great an instinct at "self preservation" perhaps it comes with my job of being a professional pilot and flight instructor... my job is to ask myself before every flight "what can i do to prevent my passengers and myself from getting injured or killed today?" I have only been in a few fist fights in my life. won a couple - lost a couple - but it certainly is not something i would intentionally climb into a ring and do before an audience. take another example motocross racer Jeremy Lusk... he had barely started living his adult life when he was killed during a motocross jump. I wont call the man stupid - apparently he was doing what he loved to do - however - i will say that you wouldnt find my arse whirling 50 feet through the air upside down, holding on with one hand on a dirt bike. life is risky business. I agree with you guys that if you don't live your life - it is wasted. but if you live it so hard as to die in your early 20's... is that not also a waste? __________________

11-25-09, 09:03 AM	#22
kiwi_2005 Eternal Patrol Join Date: May 2004 Location: Aeoteroa Posts: 7,382 Downloads: 223 Uploads: 1	nothing wrong with boxing, helps release alot of anger built up. Best thing for a young man is to get in a ring and go a few rounds - far better than going to a bar and drinking a few rounds. __________________ RIP kiwi_2005 Those who can't laugh at themselves leave the job to others.

11-25-09, 06:15 PM	#28
GoldenRivet Subsim Aviator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 8,726 Downloads: 146 Uploads: 0	good points you have made oberon. on the other hand... very few people join the military or perform some other highly dangerous job for the "sport" of doing so. __________________

11-25-09, 06:46 PM	#29
August Wayfaring Stranger Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 23,202 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I'm thinking more about the average person. I regard voluntarily risking ones neck as an important character building life experience for a young man. __________________ Flanked by life and the funeral pyre. Putting on a show for you to see.

11-25-09, 05:22 PM	#25
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Bingo, I mean if you're asking why people box, then you might as well ask why people go to war, or play NFL or any other sport which incurs physical damage, not so long ago a report claimed that 'heading' a football increases the likelihood of brain damage. Take from that what you will. However, at the end of the day no two people on this Earth are exactly alike, and while I agree Boxing certainly doesn't have the appeal today than it used to in the days of Ali, or even Tyson and Bruno (although the recent news about the short Brit who took down that tall Russian gave me a grin, talk about David and Goliath) but surely it's better in the ring between two guys who want to fight, than in the street between a guy who wants a fight and an innocent passer by, something which we see a lot of in the UK these days. Kiwi and OTH are quite right in a way, it's no surprise that in the British Army and I'm sure the US Army too, there is several boxing teams, quite competative ones too, and they can be put to good use with some people who have, shall we say, a more aggressive streak than others, and the discipline instilled in a) the army and b) the training for boxing. Actually, come to think of it, I think they also used to put in chaps who had confidence problems, help build them up, that kinda thing. I don't know if it still goes on in the British Army...probably too much red tape, but I'm pretty sure that twenty-thirty years ago the chaps used to go in the ring. I've never boxed, never will, and have no particular desire to, however I understand that there are those that do, and to them I say, good luck, so long as they know what they're getting themselves into and accept that, then good luck to 'em.

11-25-09, 06:13 PM	#27
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	The armed forces are also a deep risk, and people younger than 25 die in it, boxing is just one such example of high risk sports, although it's probably one of the most publicised of them, but Ice Hockey is another pretty brutal game at times although it has better safety features. Base jumping, bull riding, cliff diving, cliff climbing (and I mean the nutters without the ropes). It is pretty darn selfish though to do this if you have a wife and kids though, and it's about that time that the gloves should be hung up if not before hand. Although in some peoples case, it's their sport that brings in the money for their lifestyle, look at the Rooneys and the Beckhams, their sport opened up the gateway to their life and admittedly now they can probably bring in as much money off the pitch as they can on it they are still living the life of riley because of a sport which can be dangerous, not as dangerous as boxing, obviously, but still can cause serious injuries at times, likewise rugby players, moreso in fact. It's a bit of a catch-22 really, but I do agree with the sentiment you bring up on the dependents of people in high risk sports.