To install or not to install.....

[goldorak]

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

I'm going to say something controversial here. I think the reason why the US units AAW is dumbed down is because the mod is made by Russian modders.

I've been around a few Russian language forums that discuss military matters and the conclusion I have come to is that they do not believe the US systems to be superior to their own.

However you will find that in the English speaking world we have strategypage which is almost as bad.

No, I don't think the mod favours the russian units in any way. There are oversights that can be corrected, and since the database is going to be open in the future people will adjust to their liking the values (and maybe in the process destory the playability of the mod but thats another question).
Take for instance the subrocs, in DWX they are quite inoffensive. You can't base your strategy on launching subrocs and bet on sinking a sub (not only because you have to be precise, but also because the damage is very small compared to torpedos). Your primary ASW weapon is the torpedo, and then as a last resort tactics subrocs. As it should be.

Xabbarus, believe me I have had experience with Alfa Tau over more than one year and I can tell you that each game on the russian side is always reduced to launching several subrocs and waiting for the hit because 1 asroc hit = 100% damage even to enormous subs.
AT is impossibly imbalanced, much much worse than DWX ever was.
Each mission (and I'm talking about missions with 10 players on average) is always reduced to an subroc fest.
This is no way to play a game, the players not once launched torpedos because the subrocs are a god weapon in AT.

Now, since the modders are russian they use russian sources. For instance, in the case of the Alfa eveyone was shouting that it should have had an operating depth of 800 meters or so, just because US estimates said so. Estimates can be + or -, and in Norman Polmar's Cold War Submarines, many times american sources said that they overestimated russian capabilities making them appear more deadly than they actually were.
I think maybe the same thing happens from the russian side.
Back to the Alfa, the modders sent me a russian pubblication (a book published in russia and entirely devoted to the Alfa (a pity it is not translated in english ) and the tables clearly stated that the Alfa never even had a normal operating depth of 800 meters. But still, people believe in the "myth of the Alfa" and so think the modders are just picking figures out of their asses (pardon the expression).

[XabbaRus]

I know all about the Alfa.

I was just saying my opinion as one country set usually over or underestimates another countries capabilities.
.

I think I will wait until a later build and keep an eye on the discussion.

[Castout]

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

I'm going to say something controversial here. I think the reason why the US units AAW is dumbed down is because the mod is made by Russian modders.

I've been around a few Russian language forums that discuss military matters and the conclusion I have come to is that they do not believe the US systems to be superior to their own.

However you will find that in the English speaking world we have strategypage which is almost as bad.

That is not controversial to me . It's just facts.

[XabbaRus]

Goldorak can you tell me the name of the Alfa book the Russian guys gave you.

I might get my inlaws to find it.

Cheers.

[Molon Labe]

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

I'm going to say something controversial here. I think the reason why the US units AAW is dumbed down is because the mod is made by Russian modders.

I've been around a few Russian language forums that discuss military matters and the conclusion I have come to is that they do not believe the US systems to be superior to their own.

However you will find that in the English speaking world we have strategypage which is almost as bad.

Just throwing this out there...

In stock SC and DW, the Russian AAW is superior to US, including AEGIS ships.

[Castout]

Oh really??

[Pillar]

Fascinating. What evidence is there that, in reality, the Russian AAW systems were superior to the AEGIS system?

[Castout]

Well the Soviet deployed the first Anti ballistic missile system during the cold war . Take it easy Pillar I think after all the complaints the modders will try to improve US Aegis system. I certainly hope so.

[dd149]

The modders have already announced that the Aegis system behavior will be improved. They say it is already implemented and will be released in version 1.1

[dd149]

The Modders have announced that AA systems of US ships have been improved, the new release (1.1) will include this change.

[Molon Labe]

Originally Posted by Pillar

Fascinating. What evidence is there that, in reality, the Russian AAW systems were superior to the AEGIS system?

In terms of the AEGIS fire control system, I don't think there is any. Most Russian SAM systems are capable or engaging only 1 or 2 targets simultaneously--and that includes the SA-15. Kinematically, though, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the Grumble or Gauntlet is superior to the SM-2.

The reason for Russian AAW being superior in stock DW and SC had nothing to do with RL, it was just that the US AEGIS ships only had two launcher entities (the VLSs) which could only engage one target at a time and at a range limited to 10nm. The Russians tended to have multiple SAM systems and multiple launcher entities for each system, so they could get a lot more missiles in the air at multiple targets a lot more quickly.

[Pillar]

Take it easy Pillar? I was just curious, sheesh!

Thanks for the info ML.