How to plot,get range,speed,all with map updates off

[Paul Riley]

Well,i've just spent the last hour or so in the academy,refining my skills without the map updates,and to be honest with you I found myself looking less at the map trying to mark points,lines etc,and more on what was actually happening 'out there'.This I think is perfectly normal,and proves that what is happening is you're relying on your own two eyes instead of technical accuracies/inaccuracies on the map as the case may be.
Against the C3 cargo in the torpedo training,I already knew from previous training sessions that he is on a mean course of 70deg.I first set course for east,at full,and carefully watched his bow,and it was still pointing away to the north,so,I pointed the uboat 10deg towards him,and kept doing this until his beam was roughly level with my beam,alas,at approx 70deg.I slowed down as he came close to the 270 mark,and altered my speed until we were about constant.He was observed at doing 3kts.I set the 2 torp spread (0.2 spread) to 3.5kts,and a depth of about 5m.
I used the stadimeter to get a basic range to him,it read 1600m,so I set the torp range to 1500-2000m.I don't think range is that important is it?,after all,it just determines how far it will travel?.
I fired the spread when at 270 and watched what was probably my best shot I have ever done in the game,they both slammed into his fore section,and tore his bow completely off.He sank like a brick.

The next section describes how I engaged one of the merchants further out to the north.I have found that in order to get a good fix on his course I turned the uboat so that the scope read 0 at his position,this then was the base for the course estimate.I have observed that the ideal angle from this point to draw parallel to a target and at a good range is about 30deg,so from the zero point I swung the boat round until he read 330.I steamed ahead at flank,until he was drawing ever more level.I kept watching his beam and when he closed to 270 again,his beam was practically aligned with mine.He was observed at doing 5kts using the earlier method,and again,because they are liable to speed up quite a bit as a torp closes on them,I set 1 mag torp to 5.5kts.The result was very reassuring,it slammed into his foresection,and he plummeted down bow first instantly.

Let me know what you think to the above methods,and not one attack was made or plotted on the map,it was all down via visual cues,and watching the target closely in relation to me.
Were these methods used in real uboats?.They are very successful methods I think.

The only problem I will have I think,is when it comes to convoys with strong radar,as making actual observations like these will be very hard,as most of the time you have to keep out of their radar range
Naturally,to combat this I think being able to plot using the hydrophones is essential,beyond visual range I mean ...so be it

[Paul Riley]

By the way,thanks pisces
This has been quite an enlightenment

[Pisces]

It's too late for me to completely picture what you did there. But I can explain the range factor. Range is needed as a hidden input to the speed measurement with the notepad procedure at the attackscope. If that is wrong speed is also wrong by the same proportion. But if you measure speed by some other means (like that fixed wire method) range is only a factor as an aiming correction when the torpedo has to turn. When firing straight out of the tube the torpedo doesn't turn and range is no factor at all. (hmm, maybe the torpedo run time on the stopwatch is wrong, but all other things being correct it should still hit where intended.) If the torpedo has to turn (because you want to hit something more to the side of your uboat) it first moves a certain distance straight ahead before it moves in a circle-arc. This straight and circle move causes a slight parallax angle to the direction of the periscope. The torpedo needs to turn a bit further. This parallax angle becomes bigger with bearings away from bow and stern upto a maximum at 90/270. And is also larger at a close range, but then the target looks bigger, so it may not matter.

But here's a question that often puzzles me. If you (manual targeting players in general) want to train or test yourself in hitting something accurately from a distance, why do you fire with a shotgun (salvo angle)? It covers up any mistakes made as you are more likely to hit anyway. Ask yourself questions like; if it passed infront or aft of the intended location (speed or AOB wrong). Did it hit too early or too late (range wrong)?

[Paul Riley]

The salvo on the C2 was fired out of force of habit I think,because of its size.I know I am hitting pretty much where I want it most of the time,and the salvo was uneccessary.
Your last answer was a bit complex for this hour,you're right its too late

See you tomorrow if you're on,and thanks