The poker game continues in the latest satillite shootdown

[RickC Sniper]

Typical USA. China whines about the missle shoot, so we offer them free technical data.

Why don't we just tell them to go to blazes instead?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23280280/

"Defense Secretary Robert Gates said Thursday the United States is prepared to share with China some of the information it has about the U.S. shootdown of a spy satellite.
His comments came hours after Beijing complained the missile strike Wednesday could cause harm to security in outer space and some countries."

[SUBMAN1]

Well they did release video footage of the actual mission, so what more do they want?

Here is is if you care to watch:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=71c_1203596547&p=1

Is it me, or does an SM block 3 accelerate like a bat out of hell?

-S

[geetrue]

This shoot down only proves that a falling satellite can be shot down ...

not an orbiting satellite ... only James Bond movies can shoot down a real satellite.

[Ishmael]

What this shows me is the Navy having a cheaper, mobile ASAT weapon than the Air Force's fixed installations. It's also a note to let the Chinese know such a mobile system could take out Chinese sats in a Taiwan invasion scenario.

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by geetrue

This shoot down only proves that a falling satellite can be shot down ...

not an orbiting satellite ... only James Bond movies can shoot down a real satellite.

The sat is in a low Earth orbit! Duh! Not picking on you, but if you already achieve low Earth orbit, getting to a higher orbit is very easy. That is why the SHuttle uses those tiny engines rotates the nose away from earth and fires them briefly to increase its orbit. Total burn time if you watched the last launch for that manuver was a total of about a 30 second burn with very low thrust to weight ratio.

The short answer - this showed me that it doesn't matter where your sat is, it's vulnerable.

The reason for the low Earth orbit shot - this is so your debree field doesn't orbit for years on end creating a navigation hazard to other spacecraft - this is why everyone was ticked at China.

-S

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

[quote=SUBMAN1The sat is in a low Earth orbit! Duh! Not picking on you, but if you already achieve low Earth orbit, getting to a higher orbit is very easy. That is why the SHuttle uses those tiny engines rotates the nose away from earth and fires them briefly to increase its orbit. Total burn time if you watched the last launch for that manuver was a total of about a 30 second burn with very low thrust to weight ratio.[/quote]
Actually, the Shuttle can use those little orbital thrusters because a large main rocket already made it reach orbital velocity. With a ABM, its own velocity is below orbital velocity, so getting to a higher altitude becomes much harder.

The reason for the low Earth orbit shot - this is so your debree field doesn't orbit for years on end creating a navigation hazard to other spacecraft - this is why everyone was ticked at China.

Not really. That satellite was de-orbiting for some time. It'll have made little difference - knocked further below its orbital speed, the satellite will be headed for Earth in very short order no matter what altitude of orbit it is in.
Two possibilities:
1) The shot altitude was chosen to fit the capabilities of the SM-3.
2) Of course, the possibility that can never be disproven: Deception by deliberately shooting under your capabilities.

[Brag]

U.S. Marine General Pointing at our Galaxy.


__________________
If we spend enough money we will find Osama Bin Ladin somewhere here.

[AkbarGulag]

Originally Posted by Ishmael

. It's also a note to let the Chinese know such a mobile system could take out Chinese sats in a Taiwan invasion scenario.

If a country thinks sending troops or lending tactical support to save Taiwan (in a hyperthetical invasion by the mainland) is a good idea, then it has collectively lost it's marbles. Especially with the Kosovo precedent making a move not only more likely, but possibly completely legal.

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

Not really. That satellite was de-orbiting for some time. It'll have made little difference - knocked further below its orbital speed, the satellite will be headed for Earth in very short order no matter what altitude of orbit it is in.
Two possibilities:
1) The shot altitude was chosen to fit the capabilities of the SM-3.
2) Of course, the possibility that can never be disproven: Deception by deliberately shooting under your capabilities.

You are correct, but it was publically stated that the window was used because the debris would fall within a week later. The window extended till March 1st. As of March 1st, the sat would be skipping off the upper atmosphere making its plunge to Earth unpredictable and uncontrolled. This shot has apparently been ready since early Jan but the decision to wait was made to let the sat get into a position that would let its debris fall shortly after. Higher and you create hazard.

It doesn't take rocket science (or maybe it does, but maybe I have a better understanding than I think) to figure out that if you can achieve Mach 10 in a pure ballistic profile (remember this is also a kinetic profile and I believe Mach 7 is the key if I remember my physics correctly) and break atmosphere while doing it (The space shuttle does not use a pure ballistic profile by the way since it is trying to achieve orbit), its a joke from that point on to reach almost any altitude that you dare want from that point on. You are basically above the majority of Earths gravitation pull. So don't fool yourself for a second that going higher is not possible. It is not only possible, much much higher is way more than possible to the point you can probably can even achieve an alt of pure geosynchronous orbit and kill a sat there if you wanted to and even go farther.

-S

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

You are correct, but it was publically stated that the window was used because the debris would fall within a week later. The window extended till March 1st. As of March 1st, the sat would be skipping off the upper atmosphere making its plunge to Earth unpredictable and uncontrolled. This shot has apparently been ready since early Jan but the decision to wait was made to let the sat get into a position that would let its debris fall shortly after. Higher and you create hazard.

Why would it? You'll still deorbit the hazard.
And if there was some valid reason to shoot it at the lowest altitude, why don't they shoot on say the 28th?
As for public statements, look at it through this lens. If this whole thing had been Russian instead of American, would you have been so generous?

It doesn't take rocket science (or maybe it does, but maybe I have a better understanding than I think) to figure out that if you can achieve Mach 10 in a pure ballistic profile (remember this is also a kinetic profile and I believe Mach 7 is the key if I remember my physics correctly) and break atmosphere while doing it (The space shuttle does not use a pure ballistic profile by the way since it is trying to achieve orbit), its a joke from that point on to reach almost any altitude that you dare want from that point on. You are basically above the majority of Earths gravitation pull. So don't fool yourself for a second that going higher is not possible. It is not only possible, much much higher is way more than possible to the point you can probably can even achieve an alt of pure geosynchronous orbit and kill a sat there if you wanted to and even go farthe

First, Mach 10 (and at SL) is about 3km/s, which is far below orbital velocity. In fact, a ballistic missile with that speed generally has a range of ~1000km. It will not achieve an orbit, let alone get higher.
Orbits are ultimately a form of ballistics that does not hit the ground. It is otherwise the same gravitationally influenced arc.
And you are NOT "above the majority of Earth's gravitation" in low orbit. The gravity in low orbit is actually almost as strong as on the Earth's surface. You just don't feel it in orbit because you are "falling" towards Earth.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth%27s_gravity#Altitude

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Double

[August]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

Why would it? You'll still deorbit the hazard.

Yeah but isn't the issue over the time it would take for the pieces to fall into the earths atmosphere? Two weeks does sound a lot better than, say 10 years i'd think.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by August

Yeah but isn't the issue over the time it would take for the pieces to fall into the earths atmosphere? Two weeks does sound a lot better than, say 10 years i'd think.

What determines time before descent is mostly orbital stability, not the object's height above ground. By further disrupting orbital stability at high altitude, the drama would have been over a lot sooner.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Brag

U.S. Marine General Pointing at our Galaxy.


__________________
If we spend enough money we will find Osama Bin Ladin somewhere here.

We have reason to believe that this planet has weapons of mass destruction, capable of being launched within 45 lightyears.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by Oberon

We have reason to believe that this planet has weapons of mass destruction, capable of being launched within 45 lightyears.

:rotfl::rotfl: