Abortion and You

[RickC Sniper]

The father can also be taken to court to make him help pay for the abortion, even if his choice is to father and raise the child on his own. The father has always been screwed when it comes to this topic. (forgive the use of that word)
No rights, tons of responsibility................depending on her decision.

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by August

Oh yeah? Someone punches a pregnant woman in the stomach and causes her to have a miscarriage. They'd soon be up on murder charges. Now how could that be if they "technically aren't children"?

Because it would have been a child in a few more months.

[August]

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

Because it would have been a child in a few more months.

But so would an aborted fetus had it been allowed to be born.

Like I said i'm not opposed to abortion (not with 6+ billion people on the planet) but it is a huge contradiction to allow a woman (and/or her doctor) to kill her fetus but prosecute a person who causes a fetus to die and like the guys have commented on, complicate the matter even further by making the father financially responsible for the child without giving him any say in whether it is allowed to be born or not.

And it's all based on a rather stretched interpetation of the Constitutional right to privacy. No wonder it is the source of such division and acrimony in our society.

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

[Morally, I too am against abortion. Legally, I think things should stay exactly as they are, because I also realize that it is my moral belief, which not everyone agrees with, and as has been said, you can't legislate morality. If a woman disagrees, it's her body, her baby, her right and her decision, and no-one else's; not yours, not mine.

Is where I stand too.

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

Hold on, the father should have equal decision power. After all, if the woman decides to give birth, he has to provide 50% of the support (well, actually more like 80%).

Neal, I think in the position the woman is (choosing abortion) the father is most times not interested.

[Konovalov]

Originally Posted by Fish

Is where I stand too.

I share the same position also.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Fish

Neal, I think in the position the woman is (choosing abortion) the father is most times not interested.

Vaguely remembering statistics for Germany from many years ago, that holds truth. The majority of women aborting are not easy-minded, but are desperate and cannot see any way out. that'S how it is with human - humans are not always reasonable, but can get trapped in self-made mental mazes that offer no escape, if the despair is too great and fear takes over. Only a few women aborting are career-beasts and lifestyle-fashionistas. That'S why I said that if you want to help in a given situation, don't doom them, but support them, and offer them perspectives, instead of threatening penalty. And historically, penalties have not had any deterrence regarding illegal abortion - which costed many more lives, and crippled many women.

[Letum]

Well, there are millions of ways at looking at the issue.
Here's an analogy that obviously isn't a direct comparison of all the complexities, but
it helps us face one of the issues involved head on with out the other complications.
Namely, the issue of ownership of your own body:


Lets say you find that you have found a tramp living in your garden shed one winter
morning. Perhaps it is your fault because you did not put a lock on the shed.
The tramp also happens to be half related to you.

The tramp says he will go away once summer comes, but if he leaves the shed in
winter he will freeze to death.

The problem is, the tramp is eating your food, is an embarrassment, is causing you
distress and preventing you living your life normally.

Even if the tramp will die of cold if you kick him out of your shed, you should still be in your rights to kick him out; even if you let him in there.
It might not be the most compassionate thing to do, but you would certainly be in your
rights.

People should no more have to put up with trespassers in their body than they should
be forced to put up with a tramp in their garden shed.

[RickC Sniper]

Bad analogy.

The tramp CHOSE to enter and live in the shed.

A fetus is now a trespasser? That suggests somehow it had free will and chose to end up in a womb.

[Iceman]

Lol..Sailor Steve..I was being sarcastic.

Abortion is just like the word implies....abort.

If there was no life to be aborted wouldn't it just be called taking a crap?

[Redbrow]

In a thousand years who will care? If Bible banging Christians are correct it will be those cast into the ovens of hell - right after their demi-god Jesus returns at the head of a heavenly calvary charge with angels all riding white lipizzaners riding down to clobber non believers and believers who don't quite believe enough. But this punishment will not realy come because of abortting babies - because really it comes for the sin of not having accepted Jesus Christ (that doppelganger of Mithra) as their personal Lord and Savior. I should know cause I used to be a preacher long ago - before I saw the light - BABY!

Other than such arguments as this, this question (of abortting) will depend on opinions or other non-Christian religious myths and doctrines. But since I know that the odds of mankind saving the biosphere from its destruction from the hands of civilization is about nill, I say: let's wait a thousand years and ask earth to see if anyone cares:
Nope, no one there seems to care.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

Hold on, the father should have equal decision power. After all, if the woman decides to give birth, he has to provide 50% of the support (well, actually more like 80%).

Originally Posted by RickC Sniper

The father can also be taken to court to make him help pay for the abortion, even if his choice is to father and raise the child on his own. The father has always been screwed when it comes to this topic. (forgive the use of that word)
No rights, tons of responsibility................depending on her decision.

Both excellent points, and I agree; the father should have some say. I was addressing only the concept of government deciding based on moral principles.

[sonar732]

REASONS FOR ABORTIONS: COMPILED ESTIMATES rape0.3 % (0.1-0.6 %) incest0.03 % (<0.1 %) physical life of mother0.2 % (0.1-0.3 %) physical health of mother1.0 % (0.1-3 %) fetal health0.5 % (0.1-1.0 %) mental health of motherdepends on definition "personal choice"
--too young/immature/not ready for responsibility
--economic
--to avoid adjusting life
--mother single or in poor relationship
--enough children already98% (78-99 %)
--(32 %)
--25% (21-28 %)
--(16 %)
--(12-13 %)
--(4-8 %)

[elite_hunter_sh3]

abortion should be banned.. UNLESS the child is concieved because of Rape or sexual assault.. if a girl decided to fool around knowing the risks.. then let her suffer the punishment and not be allowed an abortion.. although illegal immigrants should be encouraged to have abortions.. we dont want anchor babies flooding North America... so im yes and no

[mrbeast]

Originally Posted by elite_hunter_sh3

abortion should be banned.. UNLESS the child is concieved because of Rape or sexual assault.. if a girl decided to fool around knowing the risks.. then let her suffer the punishment and not be allowed an abortion.. although illegal immigrants should be encouraged to have abortions.. we dont want anchor babies flooding North America... so im yes and no

So the child has to suffer as a punishmet too?

So even though abortion should be banned according to you, the unborn children of illegal immigrants are worth less than other unborn children?