Run away lorry and why im getting dismissed

[danlisa]

brakes should have been checked on the service it had 8 months before hand

Correct me if I'm wrong. This dust cart / trash truck should be classed as a HGV and as such is subject to 6 weekly maintenance/service checks as part of the vehicles classification. These 6 wkly checks are on top of/in addition to a yearly service/VOSA Certified MOT inspection.

As STEED says, fight them on the grounds that the vehicle was not maintained correctly. Just make sure that inspection documents have not been falsefied by the council's maintence dept after the accident (this does happen). The member of your company/council who holds the Transport Certificate is ultimatley responsible for the upkeep of all vehicles. He should be in court not you.

[August]

If I read the op right, the brakes were set but the truck slid down the hill. Not much anyone could do about that maintenance wise...

[TteFAboB]

Originally Posted by August

If I read the op right, the brakes were set but the truck slid down the hill. Not much anyone could do about that maintenance wise...

Chuck Norris could. He would run after the truck, jump inside the cabin, turn the truck 180 degrees, loose the brakes and put it back under control, stopping 3 inches away from the Jaguar.

Well, if Chuck Norris was a dustmen, we wouldn't need anybody else to collect the waste anyway. We wouldn't even need a truck, he'd just crush the trash with his own hands into tiny little balls and eat them, since his stomach can digest anything.

[badhat17]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Also im negligent for allowing the lorry to enter the road as i should have said it is too dangerous to stop the viechle.
But again if i had said no to doing the road we would have been sent back and forced to do it later in the day so the same thing may have happend.

Are you qualified to drive this vehicle Kap ? If you are not then you should not be expected to make that safety call, it would be your drivers decision.

Your driver left the vehicle unattended, he was helping with the collection you say. Is that his job ? I would imagine it is not. Was he doing this at your bequest ? Are you the team leader ?

Unless you asked the driver to help with the collection task then you ought not take any blame over this. It depends on what authority you have over the driver. Check you employment contract and your employees handbook for terms and conditions. If you were in charge of this vehicle team then you will share some responsibility, if not you shouldn't.

A driver is responsible for the vehicle no matter what though, he left the cab and is at fault.

Suspended without pay, that is unusual. They should keep paying you until you are actualy dismissed.

[Kapitan]

The veichle is classified as HGV class 2 and im not qualified to drive it but as i am chief loader as the other two guys were agency i have to make the decision.

The driver is required to help the loading of the lorry as and when he can, the brakes were fine only 30% worn but when the driver went through the paper work it appeared they hadnt been checked he told the supervisior and manager about this (after the crash) but they took it into the work shops and had it all off and found the brakes were only 12% worn.

And if the 6 weekly checks were ever done they would have rectified alot of the current faults such as the ones with the sliding doors that like to decapitate the loaders.



This is similar to the one i work on but this one is smaller and is 17 tonnes, the one i work on is bigger has another axle and carrys 26 tonnes, and has sliding doors.

[badhat17]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

The veichle is classified as HGV class 2 and im not qualified to drive it but as i am chief loader as the other two guys were agency i have to make the decision.

The driver is required to help the loading of the lorry as and when he can, the brakes were fine only 30% worn but when the driver went through the paper work it appeared they hadnt been checked he told the supervisior and manager about this (after the crash) but they took it into the work shops and had it all off and found the brakes were only 12% worn.

And if the 6 weekly checks were ever done they would have rectified alot of the current faults such as the ones with the sliding doors that like to decapitate the loaders.



This is similar to the one i work on but this one is smaller and is 17 tonnes, the one i work on is bigger has another axle and carrys 26 tonnes, and has sliding doors.

Forget about the brakes issue, it is unlikely to get you anywhere.

Did the driver refuse or question your decision to take that route or did he just get on with it? This is important, no matter what your employers may say about it being your decision. If you are not qualified to drive the vehicle then you can not make such a decision, you would ask your driver if he thought it was safe. I'm presuming he said yes. Or nothing was said at all and the driver just took the route and you went along with this. Being un-qualified to drive the vehicle you can not be expected to question the driver here, it is his call.
As long as you haven't over ruled your driver and told him to take the route when he said it was not safe then you are in the clear.

The driver is required to help with the loading as and when he can

Is that really company policy? Your union should be able to make a lot out of this. Had the driver been in the cab then the incident was avoidable, if he was within company rules to leave the cab and help with the loading then the company policy is badly at fault. Was the engine running on the vehicle when he left it ? Unless the law has changed then he has broken the law if he left the cab whilst the engine was running. As loading was in progress I would guess the engine was left running.

How long have you been with this company ?

[Kapitan]

For a start 90% of refuse lorry drivers sign contracts that say DRIVER / LOADER and in that contract there is a statement that says "you will be required to help with the loading when ever possible"

2ndly yes the engine was running standard proceadure as its a rotodrum which means if your engine is off the drum on the rear will not turn and will not crush and compact the refuse, also the same for the other lorries.

3rdly safety mesure means that you cant move the viechle when the blade is running it will automaticaly stop and the bin lifts will raise to travelling position same goes if its in gear regardless if the hand brake is on or not.

When we left the 2nd part of friday hill i said "next left to the top we will clear this one then tip", thats all i said, the driver took the next left and went up the hill was struggling a little but nothing to worry about.

Its not a company policy its more of a nation wide policy about drivers loading the fact is some roads your going to need 3 pairs of hands other wise it can take forever.

Its not that im not qualified this is my route the guy was an agency driver the other guy was agency loader niether of them knew the route there fore i was chief loader directing the driver as to where he goes but ultimatly the driver does still have the right to refuse to travel up the road he also has the final say as to what goes on the lorry, he didnt use that.

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Another example of someone who works their arse off to get by getting screwed by the bloody system.


Tell them exactly where they can place their bin lorry, Kap.

[badhat17]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

For a start 90% of refuse lorry drivers sign contracts that say DRIVER / LOADER and in that contract there is a statement that says "you will be required to help with the loading when ever possible"

2ndly yes the engine was running standard proceadure as its a rotodrum which means if your engine is off the drum on the rear will not turn and will not crush and compact the refuse, also the same for the other lorries.

3rdly safety mesure means that you cant move the viechle when the blade is running it will automaticaly stop and the bin lifts will raise to travelling position same goes if its in gear regardless if the hand brake is on or not.

When we left the 2nd part of friday hill i said "next left to the top we will clear this one then tip", thats all i said, the driver took the next left and went up the hill was struggling a little but nothing to worry about.

Its not a company policy its more of a nation wide policy about drivers loading the fact is some roads your going to need 3 pairs of hands other wise it can take forever.

Its not that im not qualified this is my route the guy was an agency driver the other guy was agency loader niether of them knew the route there fore i was chief loader directing the driver as to where he goes but ultimatly the driver does still have the right to refuse to travel up the road he also has the final say as to what goes on the lorry, he didnt use that.

It seems to me that you are not at fault here but you seem to be accepting that you are responsible, do you want to get sacked ?

Who cares what it says in the drivers contract, you are not the driver. It is what it says in your contract that matters to you.

This is clearly a profit before safety issue. If the company dismiss you over this incident then you would have a case for wrongful/unfair at a tribunal. However the company can terminate you very easily if you have not been with them for one year which is why I asked about that.

What you may think as standard procedure or a nationwide policy does not make it law. Everything is pointing towards the driver as far as this goes, why would or should you carry the can for any of this ?

Have you made contact with your union over this yet? I would seek professional advice at the earliest if I were you.

What union are you with, TGWU ?

[Kapitan]

I am a contractor to a contractor i havnt been with a union since i left basildon maybe the might still support me il have to find out.

But yeah your right i shouldnt take the crap so i will seek legal advice.

[The Munster]

Here it's down to the Driver. Even if a member of the public approaches a Loader with something they want to dispose of outwith the wheelie-bin, the Loader points 'Joe Bloggs' in the direction of the Driver and he makes the decision then it's usually what mood the Driver is in; different in this case when you're doing a special 'green waste' uplift.
I know what you mean about wanting to get the run finished then tip as quickly as possible, been there, done that.
Newer vehicles have 'weight display' in the Cab so when you reach the max point then it's leave everything that's left and tip = having to return later.
If it's any consolation to you, here, the Loaders wouldn't have ended up 'on the mat' but the Driver would have been hammered !

[Kapitan]

In our lorries we have no wieght display at all its all done by guessing, theres only one lorry that ive ever worked on and ive worked on alot of them, that have a cut out when they hit max wieght.

The driver may loose his class 2 for this one.

[The Munster]

I know, we don't have them either; Councils with money will have them.
Had the demonstraters but that's as far as it's gone.

[Kapitan]

The council i used to work for would rather spend the money on wages and new veichles rather than wieght display machine and what have you, they get good rates of pay too.

[XabbaRus]

Even if you are not a member of the union I think you could probably get them to help you.

Interesting as the refuse vehicles I see here the driver stays at the wheel at all times. Mind you we have wheelie bins so he just drives up to the side as we leave them out the night before and up they go.

Sorry Kap but check with your union rep and don't shoot your mouth off. Oh and I know this sounds ****, but you have to look after yourself, if it looks like the driver is going to carry the can, let him. Might not be to moral but that's the way it is.