SH4 Targeting

[Majestik 909]

You gentlemen could be right about thechi ice American subs having better targeting in SH4. My youngest son (7) likes to play quick missions and I noticed it was really easy for him to score hits at even 40% realism. My feeling was the American boat didn't dive as deep or as fast and didn't seem as maneuverable as my U-Boat.

Silent,

I have a long history in civilian police and military and auto racing before that, so before I figured out how to target properly I would just make some rudimentary calculations.

I know that 30 knots is around 50 feet per second and each degree of course variation will alter point of impact 5 feet for every 100 yards. Using the periscope readout to find yardage and speed allowed me to cook up a shot with fairly decent results on big slow targets, or DD'S up close.

Now with some of the tutorials and advice found here, I'm getting better at doing it "right" and scoring hits from a safer distance...

[ColonelSandersLite]

You would be right in thinking that the uboats dive faster and are more maneuverable but there is more to submarine warfare than that and the american subs definitely have their advantages. There's a persistent idea out there that the u-boats where just better than the us subs but it's largely the result of propaganda. I.E. We where on the receiving end of the u-boat campaigns and deliberately didn't publish much of anything about our own subs.


For starters, the american TDC's position keeper makes the american TDC hands down superior to the german equivalent.

The american subs are straight up faster than the german subs.

The american subs have more firepower than the german subs. All us subs being manufactured at the start of WW2 had 6 bow and 4 stern tubes with older models having less. Compare to the german setups of 4 bow and 1 or 2 stern.

The american radar and radar detection packages are just flatly superior to the german stuff.

The american boats are pretty much all able to go as far as the type 9s, easily out ranging the type 7s

You won't really see the effects in the game, but quality of life for the sailors was much better on an american submarine than a german submarine.



All that being said, don't get the impression that I don't like the german boats. But IMHO, it's like Silent said. SH3 with GWX is definitely where it's at for them.

[Majestik 909]

I seemed to have earned the new U Boat. It has a load out of 17 torpedoes on board and 6 forward, but no stern tubes. It's much better at evading surface craft, but I killed more ships with the old boat. Being able to launch torpedoes and simultaneously attack with deck gun yielded more tonnage.

My record thus far was 10 merchants in a single convoy attack.

[Majestik 909]

Colonel....

You may laugh but my favorite u boat of all time is the XXIII. Not saying it is better, just simple and interesting to me. I always told my wife if I win a huge lottery, I want to have Voss and Blohm build me a Typ XXIII and embark on a world cruise with it.

I have got really good at my current boat. I can out turn destroyers and dive super deep. I routinely cruise at 140 meters when depth provides for it. I'm now in January 1945 and 9 combat patrols in. thus far i am just 300,000 GRT sunk.

[Hambone307]

I use auto targeting and have yet to touch the offset dial for my spreads. I lock the target, and track him. This way the computer fills in everything and all I do is set torpedo depth, etc.

My method:
While in periscope view, on the panel where you adjust torpedo depth, etc, there is the other screen that shows you the distance and ID of target. There will be two dials on this screen. The top screen is the enemy ship (angle on bow, and a red line), the bottom is your boat. You will see two red lines on the dial for your boat. The outside line is the direction of your periscope, the second (inside line) is the track of your torpedos. Once the periscope line hits about 30-35 deg, I unlock the target and rotated the periscope so the torpedo track line is at about zero. Once I do that, I use the Dick O'kane method and just select a tube and press fire when each section of the ship I want to hit passes the crosshairs.

The TDC will automatically correct for range, speed, aob, if you are close enough that the green/yellow/red triangle appears when the ship hits your crosshair.

I'm afraid that I don't have any pics on this.

*Edit: I just realized you are talking about the U-boats. My method works for fleet boats. Will pull out U-178 and advise you of any differences.*

[Majestik 909]

Nice!

[les green01]

i know on the US side on auto just point the scope to the spot you want to hit keep it there until the torpedo leaves the tube so you can target other part of the target not sure about the u-boats side

[slipf18]

Originally Posted by ColonelSandersLite

Edit: Also, when asking for help with attacking targets, you kinda need to tell us if you're using the manual or automatic TDC difficulty setting. It makes a difference .

Ok... I just started playing this game. Took a while to figure out how things work and now doing reasonably well...except...

Sometimes I get in what I consider a great position with a target on my bow less than 1000 yards at a bearing say +-20 degrees off zero. I use Autotargeting, open the tube door, get a "Good Lock", fire, cycle to the next tube, open the tube door, get a "good lock" again, and fire the second tube.

Target stays on same course and...both miss. MK14's

I wrote another post in a different area about this specific problem with a tanker. On that one she was much closer and I wasted 2 bow torps and 2 stern torps. How could I fire at a ship at zero bearing that is under 300 yards away when neither of us are moving and miss? Or in the case of the stern shot she was at 180.

Is the auto targeting choosing an incorrect depth? How close is too close? How many yards before they arm? Any other guidance?

[fireftr18]

The torpedoes don't arm until about 400 yards. I give at least 500 yards to make sure.

[Char]

Auto Targeting automatically plots the torpedo's path to the target. It does not change depth setting, Detonation method, or speed setting. You can do that yourself. You're Running into two problems. First was already covered, in which you're too close.

The Second is the Mark 14 Torpedo itself. Which, to put it nicely, is a very bad Torpedo. If you're running Dud Torpedoes on, It could be running deep, making contact and simply not detonating, exploding before reaching the target, or for your added enjoyment, making a Circle Run and slamming into you. Possibly killing you in the process.

[slipf18]

Ok thanks that helps a lot. I think I have been too close too often.

Although...Auto targeting does set the depth...If I flip that little switch and look, it will be a different depth setting for different targets.

I have a Gato now with MK23's. They seem to be more reliable anyway.

How far away from a target on a steady course would you fire and not feel like you are just pissing away a torpedo?

[KaleunMarco]

slipf18,

you didnt state what version and mods you are playing with, so this will be generic help.

you may not be aware of a couple of unexpected features of your TDC. sometimes, when you playing with auto-targeting, the TDC will not lock onto the target with all attributes. by that i mean, you may lock bearing and speed and not depth. or speed and depth and not bearing. there have been other posts on this subject but there are thousands of posts and it takes a newbies a while to get used to it.

ok, enough background...how do you fix these? the bearing issue seems to happen most often on the first shot of the mission. you will perform your detection and approach beautifully, lock onto the target and then miss forever. you can detect this error by locking on to a target and then switch to the attack screen. that will show you the bearing that your torpedo shot will take to the target. if it is way-off, then you will need to either adjust your bearing on the TDC or adjust your approach and take your first shot with the stern tubes. after the first shot, the TDC snaps out of its funk and you are good to go for the remainder of the session. if you exit the app and then re-start and load a save, you may have the same disease until your first shot.

the depth-issue can be cured more easily but it occurs more often. for some reason, one can lock onto a target but the TDC will not automatically lock the proper depth for the target. you can see this by flipping the TDC option to view the bearing angle and depth setting. to fix the problem, i usually, lock onto the target, unlock, and then lock again, then take my shot.

as time goes by and you gain more experience with different torpedos and situations, you will learn to be more confident with shooting from greater distances than 1000 yds. As practice for this, try sneaking into a port with stationary ships and fire from 3000 or 4000 yds.

anyway, i hope this helps. write any time.

mark

remember: in the world, there are only submarines and targets.

[slipf18]

Thanks for the explanation. I will check the things you say to see if I can figure out what is going on.

I am using completely stock version with the Uboat missions. So I think that means v1.5. I wanted to figure the game out and know what I am doing before adding mods since they make it more difficult from what I read.

[KaleunMarco]

i agree with your objective.
you should download jones' mod handler. that will allow you to control the mods you decide to try out.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/down...o=file&id=4725

[Sniper297]

One thing all newbies should be aware of is the feature that automatically opens the outer doors is flawed. If you fire without opening the tubes before, the TDC gyro angle is set at the moment of firing, and the delay while opening the doors screws up the firing solution.

As you set the torpedoes (several minutes before firing, preferably) hit the Q key before changing to the next tube to make sure the outer door is open. Then when you do fire there's no delay and you'll get a lot more hits.