Not going to your patrol grid

[Schwuppes]

I've dumped the stupid renown thing all together... its not like the commanders had to "buy" their equipment.
I just edited the basic cfg to have all u boats and equipment to cost me nothing.

And I'm not planning go overboard and buy 50 T5 torpedos for every patrol.... I will play my career within realistic boundries... just without the renown system.

Speaking of which:
What was the typical torpedo payload of a VII submaine?

Would a commander have the choice to equip only electric torpedos if he so chose?
And in the later part of the war how many acoustic torpedos would each boat have got allocated?

[Gezoes]

I will be editing the basic.cfg then. I have a question on this fuel issue though. Abt has a point.

I always use my full batteries until they are at 60% or so, submerged at 2-3 knts, then re-surface. However, I do not set the speed manually, just Langzame Fahrt voraus or what is it called (the second one). That way the engines will run at say, 5,6 knts because the rest is used for charging. When recharged, the speed returns to the usual 8,9.

I've done this in all my IX's and now VII's.

You bet ya my fuel last longer if I also use my batteries to the fullest. There is NO way you will get back from the US in a VIIC with 8 knts and as little diving as possible.

Batteries = free speed

[Sailor Steve]

Renown:
No, captains didn't have to 'buy' upgrades or especially qualified personel. However, as the devs explaine in the beginning, upgrades are free later on; that is, later in the war boats come with upgrades that you had to 'buy' earlier, because more successful captains were able to obtain the newest, best stuff earlier than anyone else. As for qualified men, the devs said that they wanted it to feel like the best guys wanted to serve with you and they would say "no" if they didn't respect you enough.

Maybe they should have made the renown 'invisible'. That way you would request equipment or personel and be granted or denied, and never be sure why. That would have been more realistic.

Originally Posted by Gezoes

You bet ya my fuel last longer if I also use my batteries to the fullest. There is NO way you will get back from the US in a VIIC with 8 knts and as little diving as possible.

Batteries = free speed

Unfortunately that's exactly the opposite of the way it works in real life. The game helps you to cheat a lot if you know how to work it.

[kiwikapitan]

Originally Posted by Abd_von_Mumit

As far as I know charging batteries doesn't consume any diesel fuel at all IN THE GAME. It's unrealistic, but probably not moddable (someone would have fixed it if it was).

Optimum speed for VIIb type is 8.25 knots and after upgrading with GW Kapselgeblase it's 8.5 knots. The value is different for other types of boats.

Not true.

Recharging the batteries does use up diesel. Even just sitting on the surface at 0 kts on recharge will use up fuel. So you can't 'cheat' by just relying on the electrics. However it's not possible to run on the surface on the electric motors which is what a real u-boat could do to save fuel.

[Abd_von_Mumit]

Originally Posted by kiwikapitan

Not true.

Recharging the batteries does use up diesel. Even just sitting on the surface at 0 kts on recharge will use up fuel. So you can't 'cheat' by just relying on the electrics. However it's not possible to run on the surface on the electric motors which is what a real u-boat could do to save fuel.

1. As to consuming fuel or not, I'll wait for some modders' opinion - they usually know best for obvious reasons. I might be wrong, yes, but I'm still strongly convinced that loading batteries doesn't consume fuel at all IN SH3.

2. What do you mean saying that they used batteries for saving fuel? IRL using batteries doesn't help to save fuel, in fact it's an opposite, as you need more fuel to recharge the batteries after than you'd need to make the same distance. :hmm:

[VipertheSniper]

Hehe, I think the worst flaw in the game is in the XXI, ok it goes faster submerged than surfaced, but as far as I know because it had stronger electrical motors than diesels, ever tried to snorkel around with it in calm seas? Set speed to 8 knots and watch where the needle stops. At 10 knots... Correct me if I'm wrong but when you're submerged your boat creates more drag because more of it's surface is covered with water or not? Guess that's not taken into account by the game, only the maximum speed the boat can reach surfaced and submerged... I can get about 53.000km (IIRC) range out of the XXI that way, bad thing is you're prey for the airplanes, because early on you don't have that snorkel radarwarning reciever.

[Tobus]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Renown:
No, captains didn't have to 'buy' upgrades or especially qualified personel. However, as the devs explaine in the beginning, upgrades are free later on; that is, later in the war boats come with upgrades that you had to 'buy' earlier, because more successful captains were able to obtain the newest, best stuff earlier than anyone else. As for qualified men, the devs said that they wanted it to feel like the best guys wanted to serve with you and they would say "no" if they didn't respect you enough.

Maybe they should have made the renown 'invisible'. That way you would request equipment or personel and be granted or denied, and never be sure why. That would have been more realistic.

Unfortunately that's exactly the opposite of the way it works in real life. The game helps you to cheat a lot if you know how to work it.

Ok , I tested this last night guys. Batteries half-emptied, type IXB, only GWX2 and OLC-GUI mods. Speed at surface set at 8 kts.
Rangereport current speed when recharging: 3392 km.
Rangereport current speed when NOT recharging: 6670 km.

Dunno if it is broke on other boattypes, but on the IXB is works as it would IRL.

[danlisa]

Now run the same test surfaced @ all stop. Crank up the TC.

Stooopido SH3.

[Sniper_Fox]

i asked for a max range when at all stop when recharging

N: Max Range 600 km

"I thought it was impossible to go back out through the straights of Gib? Because of the currents you cant get back out submerged." - Steel Tomb

I KNEW IT THOSE BASTARDS AT BDU ARE TRYING TO KILL ME!

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Tobus

Ok , I tested this last night guys. Batteries half-emptied, type IXB, only GWX2 and OLC-GUI mods. Speed at surface set at 8 kts.
Rangereport current speed when recharging: 3392 km.
Rangereport current speed when NOT recharging: 6670 km.

Dunno if it is broke on other boattypes, but on the IXB is works as it would IRL.

The problem with that kind of test is that it's calculating how far you can go with one diesel cruising and one recharging at full speed. Once you're done recharging the estimated range will go right back up again, and ruin the whole thing.

[Heibges]

If you use SH3 Commander, you can set your patrol grid to whatever you think is appropriate or realistic or fun (the choice is up to you).

8.25 is only the optimum speed for the type VII if time is an issue.

If time is not an issue, which it almost never is in the uboat war, the slowest speed eats the least fuel and is the most "efficient".

For example, in WWII Reinhardt Hardegan spent 23 days crossing the Atlantic practicing maximm fuel efficiency. Yet he had the fuel to make the return trip in only 10 days.

In regards to fuel, the goal should be to keep your boat at sea for 56 days if possible.

[Abd_von_Mumit]

Originally Posted by Heibges

8.25 is only the optimum speed for the type VII if time is an issue.

If time is not an issue, which it almost never is in the uboat war, the slowest speed eats the least fuel and is the most "efficient".

I don't understand it, could you make it more clear, please? :hmm:

I think time is not a factor here. IN SH3 any lower or higher speed with VIIB type boat will LOWER your maximum range. With higher speeds you move faster but burn the fuel like hell, with lower speeds you burn less fuel per a certain amount of time, but you also move even "more slower" - thus burning the same amount of fuel at slower speed reduces the distance you can make compared to the optimum value of 8.25 knts. Am I wrong?

[Sniper_Fox]

8kts is the prime speed for the IXB, anything lower or higher is a waste... especially lower... i can get about 40k klicks out of her at 8kts, thats far enough to go to the panama canal and have a joy ride on the western seaboard and back, ( rough estimate as i dont have exact figures off the top of my head)

[Tobus]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

The problem with that kind of test is that it's calculating how far you can go with one diesel cruising and one recharging at full speed. Once you're done recharging the estimated range will go right back up again, and ruin the whole thing.

Uhm, isn't that how it's supposed to go? Even lying still in the water on the surface will cost you fuel, since one of your diesels is running full speed on recharge mode?

[Storabrun]

Originally Posted by VipertheSniper

Hehe, I think the worst flaw in the game is in the XXI, ok it goes faster submerged than surfaced, but as far as I know because it had stronger electrical motors than diesels, ever tried to snorkel around with it in calm seas? Set speed to 8 knots and watch where the needle stops. At 10 knots... Correct me if I'm wrong but when you're submerged your boat creates more drag because more of it's surface is covered with water or not? Guess that's not taken into account by the game, only the maximum speed the boat can reach surfaced and submerged... I can get about 53.000km (IIRC) range out of the XXI that way, bad thing is you're prey for the airplanes, because early on you don't have that snorkel radarwarning reciever.

But the XXI had lower drag submerged. It was designed for high underwater speed and really was the first submarine. Everything before is basically a surface vessel that can dive. You can look at swimmers for another example of lower drag submerged. They stay as long as possible under water at the start using only their legs for propulsion (its worth noting that the primary propulsion is the arms for crawl). Breast stokers even "submerge" during their swimming.