Sub physics - experts needed

[Zachstar]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead Nuke

99.8% of the time, the things that I and others can tell you in roundabout ways will NEVER been released in any shape or form in a public domain article from the goverment.

What you COULD find might be some old WWII ops manuals. You might find some archives of ships readiness forms.

Things about ops and capabilities, no matter how washed over, watered down and censored are verboten. They do not exist without big red stamps on them. They sure as heck will not be on a public server.

Well the .2 persa of stuff that is public domain will just have to do.

This is one of those times that people have to accept that some parts of this realism stuff are classified so "guessing" has to be made. This is perfectly acceptable because only the people that get into these boats will tell the difference.

Whatever yall can find in News Reports, NAVY public papers, .gov public articles, etc... that is public domain will work fine! Even if they are from WWII

[Bubblehead Nuke]

Dr. Sid,

Read page 160 in 'A Complete Idiots Guides to submarine'

That will give you some basic info. In fact, that whole chapter should be read and analyzed. I found most of that chapter online at google books for preview.

Here is the link:
http://books.google.com/books?id=W0_...with-thumbnail

and yes, you can read most of the chapter that you might find interesting.

A majority of the noise from a sub is propulsion related. Extrapolate from what you read and it may give you a better insight into some things.

This is a publicily available book that talks about sub construction and operations. It will give you a good starting point on some principles of operation and how to control noise levels vs operational constraints.

And that folks, is ALL I could find in about 2 days of exhaustive searching of the internet and a public library. One book that had some decent starting points to consider. Everything else I could find was either JUNK, fiction, or fantasy.

They do keep a tight lid on things eh?

[Zachstar]

If they did not make it public domain... There was a good reason for it and we just have to accept that.

Let me ask you this. HOW deep must the realism go before people that serve on these vessels don't think it is stupidly unrealistic?

I mean common 2 days man? Is that aspect THAT important? Only yall would notice the unrealistic part anyway right?

I think if it can beat DW on realism even SLIGHTLY it will be enough in my view.

[sonar732]

One thing I would like to see is on the sonar side. The level of experience of the operator is of importance. I'm not for sure on how much I can tell you of my experience on the boat and how we staffed the stacks...so I'll leave it at that.

[Bubblehead Nuke]

Originally Posted by Zachstar

If they did not make it public domain... There was a good reason for it and we just have to accept that.

Let me ask you this. HOW deep must the realism go before people that serve on these vessels don't think it is stupidly unrealistic?

I mean common 2 days man? Is that aspect THAT important? Only yall would notice the unrealistic part anyway right?

I think if it can beat DW on realism even SLIGHTLY it will be enough in my view.

Is it that important? That would be hard to explain at this point. Later, if Dr. Sid can pull this sim off, I think you will be shocked at how important it might be.

Some of the biggest things are some of the most mundane sounding.

[Zachstar]

Maybe contact the US NAVY then and ask them if they will see if they can make public domain info to make it more realistic?

Otherwise I can only say use the WWII docs?

[TopTorp '92]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead Nuke

Hey there Top Torp, Long time no see.

As you have probably been reading, I have been trying to give some insights without breaking the rules.

I tend to keep it simple . . .stupid (KISS.)

Keep up the good work. Maybe the sim guys will strike a better trade-off between a game that sells and a sim that educates.

I monitor the threads and add perspective when I think it appropriate. Unfortunately modelling tactical considerations is much more difficult than modelling engineering factors. However, I must add that Bill comes up with some really good scenarios. Very good.

To be honest I have trouble organizing knowledge that was/is unclassified separate from the other knowledge (the Top Secret stuff) that could potentially endanger lives or worse become self-incriminating.

You know I think I read somewhere that either DW or Sub Command has been used to train Naval Academy students as some kind of introduction to submarine operations and general warfare. If any of you guys can confirm, I'd like to know.

Top Torp

[Dr.Sid]

Thanks for another info. I'm currently fightinh terrain rendering again, just so you know. I already implement final design (at least of distribution of heightmaps).

[Bubblehead Nuke]

Originally Posted by TopTorp '92

I tend to keep it simple . . .stupid (KISS.)

Keep up the good work. Maybe the sim guys will strike a better trade-off between a game that sells and a sim that educates.

I try to keep is simple, but you know as well as I do that some people do not have an 'I believe' button and it takes a little more to make it understandable.

As for the classified vs unclassified stuff?? I just try and be broad in scope and paint large pictures that give a general idea of the scene. You know, keep the topic out of focus somewhat.

[Zachstar]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead Nuke

I try to keep is simple, but you know as well as I do that some people do not have an 'I believe' button and it takes a little more to make it understandable.

As for the classified vs unclassified stuff?? I just try and be broad in scope and paint large pictures that give a general idea of the scene. You know, keep the topic out of focus somewhat.

To be honest that may not be the best idea either.

It may gain a bit of realism but also may be getting dangerously close to the line here. It is a subsim and not worth getting a phone call from the Navy about.