SH3's flawed sub physics?[A request]

[VipertheSniper]

Hmm I've never noticed behaviour like this, with GWX not at all because of the positive bouyancy mod, and not in stock SH3 either, although I would've liked to see it like it was in AOD, atleast under silent running, where the boat slowly began to sink after some time in silent running.

[Castout]

Ju_88 you said it has been corrected in mods before, could you point me to at least one? I hate it when my sub starts to sink everytime I try to simulate a silent running.

Yes I'm aware that in RL the boat would try to compansate for loss weight after launching its eel(s) I do not expect a game physics to be that accurate but this incapability to simulate silent running is really fundamental imo especially when DDs are going to detect(hear) our boat much harder if we order a very slow speed. It's just that our boat refuses to float unless it's moving at a certain minimum speed which is totally unrealistic imo. Makes me feel like i'm flying not sailing an underwater craft

@Kpt Lehmann is it true? it doesn't occur in stock SH3? Okay let me play test this further.

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by Castout

@Kpt Lehmann is it true? it doesn't occur in stock SH3? Okay let me play test this further.

Yes it is true. In un-moddified stock SH3 version 1.4b, with an undamage U-boat you can come to "All-Stop" and maintain whatever depth you choose.

What is truely needed to represent historical accuracy is the ability of the player to set variable bouyancy, and for compressed air to be used gradually in the effort to maintain a given depth.
This is not possible in SH3. ("not possible" is usually not in my vocabulary)

[Castout]

Yes you're right Kpt Lehmann in stock SH3 you can at least with type IX and type VIIB to maintain depth with very low speeds or at all stop at any depths.


Maybe my first post was specific to type VIIC/41 or I was interrupting a crash dive order.

Yea too bad SH3 doesn't take into account the compressed air used during depth changing. That would be so very cool. Anyone tried to mod this?

I have another question more like an idea on modding 'rig for silent running' command, a simple one really but I think I prfer to start a whole new thread for it.

[JU_88]

When I said corrected - I meant negative/positive boyency was added - in stock Sh3 the uboat can hover like a humming bird, just as the Kpt already pointed out.

[Castout]

Yea Ju_88 sorry for my false alarm everybody

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by Castout

It's just that our boat refuses to float unless it's moving at a certain minimum speed which is totally unrealistic imo. Makes me feel like i'm flying not sailing an underwater craft

Why would that be unrealistic? At the beginning of the patrol, and every chance they got during it they did re-trim the boat, but any time you're in a position to need to run silent you have likely
1) Fired torpedoes, and

2) Been consuming food, water and fuel without time for a new trim dive.

Both of which will leave the boat likely to either rise or sink. This can be easily countered with the pumps, but when 'Silent Running' the pumps have to be off. In World War Two it was nearly impossible to get a boat to hover without moving, especially in a combat situation. One of the beauties of good old Aces Of the Deep was that after silent running for awhile the Chief would tell you "Captain, it is impossible to maintain depth without running the pumps".

I think the sinking is one of the most realistic mods.

@Kpt Lehmann is it true? it doesn't occur in stock SH3? Okay let me play test this further.

Yes, it's true. In stock SH3 you can hover the boat forever.

[Castout]

Really? Thanks for the history lesson. On my second thoughts I'm actually happy with it sinking...no pumps eh?

Now if the modders can make the interior lights stay turned off for awhile after a close depth charging........"We are at 220m Sir!!!!!!!"
Any way to make the lights off much longer? GUI doesn't need to be messed with. They did already have flashlights. Hey this may be the topic of another thread. I'll make one for this.

Anybody worked on the compressed air mod stuff?

I do recall reading years ago that subs in WWII had to keep a slight forward movement going in order to maintain a stable depth level. Part of holding to a depth was done by the use of the diving planes which required at a minimum a slight forward motion. I'd have to go back through all the U-boat books I ever read to find the quote. But I recall the words of it everytime I am setting motionless at periscope depth. I am always thinking: this would be impossible in real life.

[linerkiller]

In RL this behavior was caused by small leaks produced by various causes, damages etc. in the lower part of the hull ( italian "sentina") Also in Das Boot, Buccheim wrote that even during the dive, the U boot had to expell water in excess from the boat

[Castout]

so even WWII sub was not a real submersible craft in the sense that they need to have a forward motion in order to maintain depth?

When I see Das boot or U-571 I think I saw them at 0 knots at periscope depth in those movies.

Ouch linerkiller got me first...

So the pump must work in order to maintain depth? So in theory in silent running wheere the pumps are being turned off the boat would keep on sinking with no forward motion.

[PhantomLord]

Originally Posted by Castout

so even WWII sub was not a real submersible craft in the sense that they need to have a forward motion in order to maintain depth?

When I see Das boot or U-571 I think I saw them at 0 knots at periscope depth in those movies.

Ouch linerkiller got me first...

So the pump must work in order to maintain depth? So in theory in silent running wheere the pumps are being turned off the boat would keep on sinking with no forward motion.

Movies will be movies, will be movies...

In RL subs need some forward motion.

"Das Boot" the book describes some techniques to "hang up the boat on the periscope". This is possible without engines running only at absolutly calm sea. You can have some hover effect with endless fine trimming. All has to do with the relation of water pressure outside and water displacement of the boat. You really need the pumps for that. So it´s no option in silent running...

You´ll need an extra physic´s engine for SH3 to simulate all that tiny stuff that really happens in a such complex vehicle like an u-boat. An definitly more men to handle this. Hey that would be a nice idea for MP? Everyone has his station in only ONE boat....

In one of my books (i think it was "Wolfgang Hirschfeld - Feindfahrten / Diary of an u-boat-radio-operator") he talk about another boat that sinks slowly down while submerged at low speed. The crew forgot to open a valve for the depth meter in the command room. So everyone thought they still were at 80 meters. In real the boat was near 220 meters at this time. One man noticed that at his sister instrument in the engine room... i think he got an extra bottle of beer later