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[Heibges]

I believe the F-15 was also built to fight a plane that the Soviet's never built?

[fatty]

Originally Posted by Heibges

I believe the F-15 was also built to fight a plane that the Soviet's never built?

You could say that 75% of the equipment in the U.S. military was meant to fight a war that never happened :p

[PeriscopeDepth]

Originally Posted by fatty

You could say that 75% of the equipment in the U.S. military was meant to fight a war that never happened :p

They still build to Cold War specs. JSF anyone?

PD

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by PeriscopeDepth

They still build to Cold War specs. JSF anyone?

PD

They have to. It is not an option. History has always shown what happens to rich countries that fail to protect themselves, and with the US being the richest country the world has ever known throughout all history, actually richer than all past empires put together, it doesn't take rocket science to figure out what would be its fate without its techie weapon systems. AMerica builds those weapons not to fight, but as a deterrant - something it definitely needed in the cold war.

F-35 is now needed as a cheap alternative to F-22. We also need F-22 as well. This is due to Russia building more sophisticated aircraft than anything fielded by the Americans - THe thrust vectoring SU-30 is an example - a much better plane than anything in the US inventory. China now flies SU-30, as well as India.

Our pilots borrowed India's SU-30 and went up against our pilots in our own F-15's and F-16's. The guys in the SU-30's kicked the butt of our pilots in F-15's and F-16's each and every engagement. So to say we don't need F-35 and F-22 is not reality.

One more thing Russia is doing is making SAM systems that are not only cheap, but extremely effective and near impossible to evade by our current generations of fighters. These systems are also being sold to Rogue states and the US will eventually have to deal with them sooner or later. This is why Stealth capability is no longer not an option for the future of fighter aircraft. All aircraft must have Stealth capability - period. You need to give the plane in the sky a fighting chance to survive, and that window is quickly closing on AMericas antiquated aircraft.

Does anyone realize we are flying the 'oldest' airforce in the entire history of the United States Airforce? Most of our aircraft or fast becoming antiquated junk heeps barely able to do the job they are being asked to do in the face of ever increasing enemy technology. Their only saving grace is the excellent training of US pilots who make up in tactics for the failings of their aircraft. On top of this, the US has only had to go up against typically older generations of ex Soviet fighters. THis will not be the case forever. Two examples where the US will face newer generation of aircraft are Taiwan and Korea - both loom as a flash points.

F-35 and F-22 is a must to survive these future fights. We can do it with the F-15's and F-16's as well, but expect horror and shock from the public as you get very close to a 1 to 1 kill ratio between US pilots and their enemy.

Basically the public won't stomach that since they can't even stomach the 3000 dead in Iraq let alone high combat loses in the air in some future conflict! Remember Vietnam? THey had over 50,000 US dead dead in half the time that we have been in Iraq. The American public has grown soft, so we cannot tolerate high loss ratios in the air, and besides, an unfair fight with these new aircraft is exactly what we want - deterrance.

-S

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Heibges

I believe the F-15 was also built to fight a plane that the Soviet's never built?

Well now, that depends. The F-15 was built to shoot down the mythical super MiG-25. The problem was, the MiG-25 wasn't so 'Super' as originally thought! So no, the Soviets actually built the plane the F-15 was designed for, but the F-15 was sort of over-built to take on a better plane than the one it ended up having to deal with.

I guess thats a double edged sword on the F-15's part - The fact that is was so good back then means that it is still a viable aircraft today!

-S

[Lagger123987]

I love F-14s too bad they're goin to be in airshows only now.

[Tchocky]

Mig-25 may be fast, but it doesn't accelerate very quickly. If I remember correctly, a Soviet air manual ranked the MiG-23 as both faster and quicker than F-15 and F-16 at low level.

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

Mig-25 may be fast, but it doesn't accelerate very quickly. If I remember correctly, a Soviet air manual ranked the MiG-23 as both faster and quicker than F-15 and F-16 at low level.

MiG-23 accelerates fast, but I don't think that fast. Sure you aren't confusing it with MiG-31?

[PeriscopeDepth]

Temptin' me to start a JSF thread Subman...

PD

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by PeriscopeDepth

Temptin' me to start a JSF thread Subman...

PD

Maybe you should! I'd rather have more F22's and less F35's, but I'll take F-35's if thats all we can afford right now! F-35's are a much better plane than pretty much anything short of an F-22, so if the choice is no extra F-22's and a bunch of cheaper F-35's - I'll take em!

-S