Class action suit against UBI - Page 2

UnSalted · 05-18-07, 08:24 AM

"Your honor, my clinets have been caused needless suffering and emotional distress by Ubisoft's failure to satisfy their needs for perfection in gaming. We demand our just recourse."

"What kinds of problems exist with the product, Counselor?"

"Your Honor, we feel that the games realism is a sham, the training provided by Ubisoft is lacking, and the game itself causes frustration."

"So let me get this straight.....people that sit at a PC for hours at a time pretending to be WWII submarine skippers are upset because of a lack of realism?"

"Exactly your Honor".

"OK....and they are upset because the radar doesn't work properly 24/7? And the torpedo tracking doesn't work on the little maps?"

"Yes your Honor, it's a terribly frustrating situation to be in."

"I see....people involved in a role playing game are frustrated. Have you filed a similar suit against Mother Nature by any chance?"

Egan · 05-18-07, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psycluded

Best idea ever.

That is, if you want to never have another Silent Hunter again. Ever.

100% agreed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MaxT.dk

Exactly what I've said regarding the 1.3 patch... UBI targeted SH4 at the main public for a reason... And this lawsuit will be just for the good of this little group of 100%-realism-and-historically-correct SH4 skippers and noone else

Just how I see it

I'm sorry, but this is total nonsense. In what possible way would a lawsuit against one of the 2 companies still manufacturing submarine simulations benefit someone like me who has been playing subsims for years and IS interested in historical realism and history? It seems to me far more likly to 'benefit' those that have more of a passing interest in the genre and wouldn't even notice if Ubi dumped their simulation projects.

ryanwigginton · 05-18-07, 08:36 AM

stop fretting... there'll be another patch.

Bane · 05-18-07, 08:50 AM

Something like this may be inevitable. Consumers will only take the 'release now, patch later' business practice for so long before they decide to do something about it. I would hope so anyway.

I know I personally like to have the products I buy work correctly out of the box. If, for example, your new video card didn't work 100% out of the box you'd take it back without question. Just because we're now talking about a piece of software doesn't make any difference imho. It should still work 100% at the time of purchase and we shouldn't have to wait X months after purchase before it does.

DiveMonkey · 05-18-07, 08:50 AM

Don't kid yourself you think a lawyer couldn't make a case!
If some women could sue MC D's over being dumb enough to dump hot coffee on herself...well, we all know how that turned out!

The question is "should UBI be sued"
I guess if you want another SH bad enough than no they shouldn't, but if you think the next SH will be half baked, features missing or don't work, than yea! they should be sued. That assumes there are any plans for another SH in the first place.

One thing all can agree on, SHIV should never have been released in the condition it was in! Some of it was so obviously bugged...one wonders if it wasn't intentional!

akdavis · 05-18-07, 09:10 AM

I've heard this so many times before...

ryanwigginton · 05-18-07, 09:14 AM

Come on guys! This is a game we're talking about. It cost £35 max. That's the price of a meal for two at a restaurant. So lets say the food's not what I expected. Do you think I'd sue the restaurant?! No, I'd just choose not to eat there again. Simple. And I heard someone say that they spoke to someone at Ubi and that NO-ONE at Ubi reads these forums... really? Well, lets just say I'd be extremely surprised if that were true.

I think Ubi will realise the error of there ways if they release a SH5 or any similar game/simulation. Sales will be very low on initial release, unless... they allocate more time to there projects and allow the developers to complete.

harrymanback · 05-18-07, 09:16 AM

Divemonkey and Bane - well said. I can't figure out why people think that games are somehow different to every other consumer product and its perfectly fine that they shouldn't work out of the box. I'm pretty sure on the back of the packet it doesn't say

*CAUTION- Will require some poor Modders to spend weeks of their own unpaid time to make work. Will also require everyone else to spend several hours reading forums/tracking down mods/installing unofficial 3rd party software.*

Yep. I just checked. Its doesn't say that anywhere.

Obviously none of us will bother lauching a lawsuit. I'll just not buy a Ubisoft game again. Then Ubisoft will say "we have to release it in an unfinished state in because we don't sell enough copies of it". Stupid. You've got a great game - just finish it, put a shiny tutorial on the front end, and WHAMMY, you've got a profitable hit. Of course it will remain niche in its current release state.

kverdon · 05-18-07, 09:17 AM

As others have said, a class action lawsuit would most likely ensure that Ubisoft Never did a subsim again. It would also be a lose-lose for us any further patches would be tied up while the suit was being argued. IF the class won the suit, and this could take a year or so...the most likely settlement would be a refund of your money of which 80% would go to the legal fees. So....... if you want to expend a lot of effor to ensure that SHIV is never patched and Ubi never does another subsim, so that you can get your $10 check from Ubi, go for it.

This is not to say that other action against Ubi should be contemplated. If the 1.3 patch does not happen and you are rather disastified with the delivered product, I would first contact Ubisoft and demand a refund. If they refuse I would contact the Better Buisness Bureau in Ubisot USA's hometown of San Francisco and file a complaint there.

Kevin

AVGWarhawk · 05-18-07, 09:26 AM

I'll tell you who will win in the end here.....the lawyers.

Patch will come, we are at the point were some fixes affect other areas of the game and now these need to be looked at also. It will take some time but in the end I believe we will have a fixed game.

SteamWake · 05-18-07, 09:29 AM

Your petty threats will gain no leverage.

Im sorry it is so petty. If you really want your money back go back to the store you bought it from ! Most retailers can be convinced to take the product back with a good enough reason. If you feel your reasons are valid enough in order to sue on behalf of thousands of people they should be valid enough for a retailer to re-imburse you. If your retailer is one of those "oh gee you opened the box we cant take this back" sorts. Dont do buisness with them.

Whats that ? Oh youve been "using" it for months. Well then I guess your stuck with it.

DiveMonkey · 05-18-07, 09:35 AM

I'm not arguing for or against, But if UBI don't release another patch...why would anyone want SHV?

I think 1.3 is coming. I also think it should never have been necessary! least not to the extent it's needed just to fix features that should have worked out of the box.

It would also be nice to hear from UBI about 1.3!
Just a "it's coming along and will have it too you soon" would go a long way.

TDK1044 · 05-18-07, 09:37 AM

Not only would a class action lawsuit pretty much guarantee that Ubisoft never produces a sub sim again, it would also be a shot accross the bow of any other company considering it.

We know that the profit margin on a PC sub sim game is low, and if the only company producing those games just stopped producing them because of possible litigation, does anyone really believe that another company will then seek to develop a brand new sub sim from scratch, requiring a significant investment and a 24 month development schedule?

Please end this nonsense.

Silence · 05-18-07, 09:51 AM

IMHO lawsuits are always a bad idea. Just wait like the rest of us and we will have new patches soon. Does anyone have any patience? Seems a sub skipper should be able to wait at least a little while.
james

pythos · 05-18-07, 09:54 AM

I work in the aviation field and have seen the effects of lawers and their damnable lawsuits. Little tiny plastic knobs for a non-flight related cabinet costing 100 dollars!!! Why because some lawers long ago sued Cessna aircraft company for some ridiculous amount of money because a similar part failed to work, and did not latch the cabinet.

This is also a result of the overregulation of aviation parts. Now mind you I am not for the free for all, stick on any part you want, that is prevelant on automobiles. But I do think for Non- flight related items in an aircraft there should be no need for regulation, or certification, and any lawer that comes in asking for huge sums of money, should be booted out of the court room.

Right....that being said.

If there were to be a class action lawsuit against ubi, we would never get an improvement to what we have, and possibly the comunity could lose all support for the SH series, possibly even including the closing of this site due to violations of intelectual property copyrights. Remember we are modding what the folks at ubi wrote.

This lawer is just one example of what is ruining our world more than helping it. He is the reason health insurance is unbelievable, and why insurance costs are as crazy as they are. I'm all for suing those that have greiviously harmed someone, or there is a clear case of incompetance, but to sue because a game does not work like you wished, I think is pushing it.

05-18-07, 09:10 AM	#21
akdavis Samurai Navy Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Fort Worth, Texas Posts: 597 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I've heard this so many times before... __________________ -AKD

05-18-07, 09:26 AM	#25
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,303 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	I'll tell you who will win in the end here.....the lawyers. Patch will come, we are at the point were some fixes affect other areas of the game and now these need to be looked at also. It will take some time but in the end I believe we will have a fixed game. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

05-18-07, 09:51 AM	#29
Silence Watch Join Date: May 2007 Location: Nebraska, U.S. Posts: 17 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	IMHO lawsuits are always a bad idea. Just wait like the rest of us and we will have new patches soon. Does anyone have any patience? Seems a sub skipper should be able to wait at least a little while. james __________________ "No matter where you travel, when you meet a guy who's been... There's an instant kind of friendship 'cause we're brothers of the 'phin." - Robert Reed, G.W. Carver (SSBN-656)

05-18-07, 09:54 AM	#30
pythos Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2005 Location: Somewhere over there Posts: 834 Downloads: 46 Uploads: 0	Good God NO!!!! I work in the aviation field and have seen the effects of lawers and their damnable lawsuits. Little tiny plastic knobs for a non-flight related cabinet costing 100 dollars!!! Why because some lawers long ago sued Cessna aircraft company for some ridiculous amount of money because a similar part failed to work, and did not latch the cabinet. This is also a result of the overregulation of aviation parts. Now mind you I am not for the free for all, stick on any part you want, that is prevelant on automobiles. But I do think for Non- flight related items in an aircraft there should be no need for regulation, or certification, and any lawer that comes in asking for huge sums of money, should be booted out of the court room. Right....that being said. If there were to be a class action lawsuit against ubi, we would never get an improvement to what we have, and possibly the comunity could lose all support for the SH series, possibly even including the closing of this site due to violations of intelectual property copyrights. Remember we are modding what the folks at ubi wrote. This lawer is just one example of what is ruining our world more than helping it. He is the reason health insurance is unbelievable, and why insurance costs are as crazy as they are. I'm all for suing those that have greiviously harmed someone, or there is a clear case of incompetance, but to sue because a game does not work like you wished, I think is pushing it.

05-18-07, 08:24 AM	#16
UnSalted Machinist's Mate Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 130 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	"Your honor, my clinets have been caused needless suffering and emotional distress by Ubisoft's failure to satisfy their needs for perfection in gaming. We demand our just recourse." "What kinds of problems exist with the product, Counselor?" "Your Honor, we feel that the games realism is a sham, the training provided by Ubisoft is lacking, and the game itself causes frustration." "So let me get this straight.....people that sit at a PC for hours at a time pretending to be WWII submarine skippers are upset because of a lack of realism?" "Exactly your Honor". "OK....and they are upset because the radar doesn't work properly 24/7? And the torpedo tracking doesn't work on the little maps?" "Yes your Honor, it's a terribly frustrating situation to be in." "I see....people involved in a role playing game are frustrated. Have you filed a similar suit against Mother Nature by any chance?"

05-18-07, 08:36 AM	#18
ryanwigginton Weps Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 368 Downloads: 68 Uploads: 0	stop fretting... there'll be another patch.

05-18-07, 08:50 AM	#19
Bane Torpedoman Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Michigan, USA Posts: 119 Downloads: 33 Uploads: 0	Something like this may be inevitable. Consumers will only take the 'release now, patch later' business practice for so long before they decide to do something about it. I would hope so anyway. I know I personally like to have the products I buy work correctly out of the box. If, for example, your new video card didn't work 100% out of the box you'd take it back without question. Just because we're now talking about a piece of software doesn't make any difference imho. It should still work 100% at the time of purchase and we shouldn't have to wait X months after purchase before it does.

05-18-07, 08:50 AM	#20
DiveMonkey Torpedoman Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 111 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Don't kid yourself you think a lawyer couldn't make a case! If some women could sue MC D's over being dumb enough to dump hot coffee on herself...well, we all know how that turned out! The question is "should UBI be sued" I guess if you want another SH bad enough than no they shouldn't, but if you think the next SH will be half baked, features missing or don't work, than yea! they should be sued. That assumes there are any plans for another SH in the first place. One thing all can agree on, SHIV should never have been released in the condition it was in! Some of it was so obviously bugged...one wonders if it wasn't intentional!

05-18-07, 09:14 AM	#22
ryanwigginton Weps Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 368 Downloads: 68 Uploads: 0	Come on guys! This is a game we're talking about. It cost £35 max. That's the price of a meal for two at a restaurant. So lets say the food's not what I expected. Do you think I'd sue the restaurant?! No, I'd just choose not to eat there again. Simple. And I heard someone say that they spoke to someone at Ubi and that NO-ONE at Ubi reads these forums... really? Well, lets just say I'd be extremely surprised if that were true. I think Ubi will realise the error of there ways if they release a SH5 or any similar game/simulation. Sales will be very low on initial release, unless... they allocate more time to there projects and allow the developers to complete.

05-18-07, 09:16 AM	#23
harrymanback Watch Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 26 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Divemonkey and Bane - well said. I can't figure out why people think that games are somehow different to every other consumer product and its perfectly fine that they shouldn't work out of the box. I'm pretty sure on the back of the packet it doesn't say CAUTION- Will require some poor Modders to spend weeks of their own unpaid time to make work. Will also require everyone else to spend several hours reading forums/tracking down mods/installing unofficial 3rd party software. Yep. I just checked. Its doesn't say that anywhere. Obviously none of us will bother lauching a lawsuit. I'll just not buy a Ubisoft game again. Then Ubisoft will say "we have to release it in an unfinished state in because we don't sell enough copies of it". Stupid. You've got a great game - just finish it, put a shiny tutorial on the front end, and WHAMMY, you've got a profitable hit. Of course it will remain niche in its current release state.

05-18-07, 09:17 AM	#24
kverdon Seaman Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 36 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	As others have said, a class action lawsuit would most likely ensure that Ubisoft Never did a subsim again. It would also be a lose-lose for us any further patches would be tied up while the suit was being argued. IF the class won the suit, and this could take a year or so...the most likely settlement would be a refund of your money of which 80% would go to the legal fees. So....... if you want to expend a lot of effor to ensure that SHIV is never patched and Ubi never does another subsim, so that you can get your $10 check from Ubi, go for it. This is not to say that other action against Ubi should be contemplated. If the 1.3 patch does not happen and you are rather disastified with the delivered product, I would first contact Ubisoft and demand a refund. If they refuse I would contact the Better Buisness Bureau in Ubisot USA's hometown of San Francisco and file a complaint there. Kevin

05-18-07, 09:29 AM	#26
SteamWake Rear Admiral Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,224 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Your petty threats will gain no leverage. Im sorry it is so petty. If you really want your money back go back to the store you bought it from ! Most retailers can be convinced to take the product back with a good enough reason. If you feel your reasons are valid enough in order to sue on behalf of thousands of people they should be valid enough for a retailer to re-imburse you. If your retailer is one of those "oh gee you opened the box we cant take this back" sorts. Dont do buisness with them. Whats that ? Oh youve been "using" it for months. Well then I guess your stuck with it.

05-18-07, 09:35 AM	#27
DiveMonkey Torpedoman Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 111 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I'm not arguing for or against, But if UBI don't release another patch...why would anyone want SHV? I think 1.3 is coming. I also think it should never have been necessary! least not to the extent it's needed just to fix features that should have worked out of the box. It would also be nice to hear from UBI about 1.3! Just a "it's coming along and will have it too you soon" would go a long way.

05-18-07, 09:37 AM	#28
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	Not only would a class action lawsuit pretty much guarantee that Ubisoft never produces a sub sim again, it would also be a shot accross the bow of any other company considering it. We know that the profit margin on a PC sub sim game is low, and if the only company producing those games just stopped producing them because of possible litigation, does anyone really believe that another company will then seek to develop a brand new sub sim from scratch, requiring a significant investment and a 24 month development schedule? Please end this nonsense.