The Lost USS Wahoo / SS-238

[Mush Martin]

all pilots think they hit just behind the conning tower dead center

My moneys on the shore battery

[TheSatyr]

A shore battery would have to be lucky as hell to hit a submarine. There isn't much to shoot at let alone hit when a sub is cruising along on the surface...unless they are at short range. As for shore batteries having radar controlled gunfire in 1943...I kinda doubt that. That kind of thing didn't come into use till 44'...at least in the Navy...and the Army was always a bit behind technology wise....except when it came to aircraft. (On the other hand the Army WAS working on chemical warfare projects and had almost completed the bombs and the aircraft to carry them all the way to the west coast when the war ended. Least that's the claim on the "Secret Weapons of WW2 History Channel series).

Unless somebody builds a time machine and goes back and watches the entire chain of events unfold,we will never truly know what happened out there. All we do know for sure is that the Japanese attacked her...and she sunk.

But,I will say this. O'Kane's theory of the Wahoo being damaged by a circular running torpedo doesn't hold any water with me. I have NEVER heard of a sub surviving a hit from a circular run. O'Kane should have known better than anyone what a hit from a circular running torpedo could do to a sub. The only way that theory would work is if the Wahoo had been hit by a circular running dud torpedo...which might have still penetrated the hull anyway...and once again leave us with a sub with a big honking hole in it. A 21" circular hole in a sub would be enough to ruin anyone's day.

[woofiedog]

USS Herring...



Japanese information indicates that HERRING was sunk on June 1, 1944, two kilometers south of Point Tagan on Matsuwa Island in the Kurlies. The report sates that two merchant ships, HIBURI MARU and IWAKI MARU, were sunk by American torpedoes while at anchor at Matsuwa. In a counterattack, a shore battery scored two direct hits on the conning tower, and “bubbles covered an area about 5 meters wide, and heavy oil covered an area of approximately 15 miles.” The position of this attack was around 150 miles from the position where HERRING met BARB: the attack occurred on the day after the BARB picked up her prisoner. BARB and HERRING were the only U.S. submarines in the area at the time and BARB did not make attacks reported by BARB and by the Japanese, HERRING has been credited with four ships and 13,202 tons sunk for her last patrol.

Also a story of the USS Boyd DD554 fight against Japanese shore batteries on 12-8-43...

Link: http://pages.cthome.net/Boyd544/Diary03.htm


Japanese 150mm Coastal Gun

[TheSatyr]

Ok...you got me there. But 2-3 km is what I would consider real short range for a shore battery and any sub captain who gets that close to one on the surface is playing with fire.

[nattydread]

Didnt say it was impossible for a shore battery to hit a sub Just damn hard and I'd think unlikly.

There can be injuries to the sub or its systems that would require an exit from the area ASAP. The batteries, the uncontrolled lose of fuel/oil, flooding, etc. One may figure it better to get out sooner than later...or it just could have been a gutsy gamble that failed. I tend to think it was damage or injury requiring they get out in the Pacific before radioing for help or something and getting a pick up.

[TheSatyr]

Maybe it's just me...but if my boat was damaged I'd be even more cautious than normal. Now if Morton wasn't in command of the boat at that time,(Nervous breakdown...injury...death),than I could see the officers of the boat making a bonehead move like that.

Incidentally,does anyone know if there has ever been a rogue wave recorded in the Inland Sea?

[Mylander]

Originally Posted by dean_acheson

Exactly when and where did you start your career, I've started and restarted about 25 time now, late 42 early 43 at Pearl and haven't got the Wahoo yet.....

I started at Pearl in '43

Good Luck,
Mylander

[Mush Martin]

Thanks boys for the info anyway rebooted my career at the
appropriate place and time and came away with wahoo
under dudleys name for my career on attempt#2

thanks lads 238 is a fine ship too I might add.
MM

[mrbassbone]

Originally Posted by Mush Martin

Many years familiar and Yeah I would absolutely loose my coffee
and my monitor if I got awarded wahoo.

I have seen photos (Japanes) of the hunt for wahoo
I Think they may have gotten posted up on SH3
research links I cant remember the site though
Ill have a look.
MM

You will find them on www.warfish.com and included with WAHOO's 7th war patrol report.

[mrbassbone]

IF you go to the following site http://www.usswahoo.org/ which is run by Bryan MacKinnan, who is the Grand Nephew of Mush Morton you will find out a lot more information. He has interviewed participants in WAHOO's last battle.

In a "nutshell"...the Japanese were on the lookout for a submarine to exit La Perouse because of the "trail of sinkings" leading to it. When USS SAWFISH departed on the 9thand was VISIBLY challenged by the lighthouse on Cape Soya, WAHOO was sinking its last ship <Hankow Maru> south of the Straits. They KNEW there were two subs and were preparing for it.

The morning of the 11th of OCtober...the water was super clear and the water temps were in the mid 20's < one reason why no one escaped using Mompson Lungs...too cold>. The Japanese had the following assets in the area Minesweepr #18 and Subchasers # 15 &#43. In the air were two Seiran Attack Float Planes.

At 0930 Suguru Ichida <radioman in float plane #32> heard an alarm from another float plane <#319>. They had spotted a small lubricating oil slick approx 10 meters by 5 meters. This would have been caused by an amount no larger than the volume of a small water glass. The lubrication oil came from the propeller shafts of submarines and recognised as such.

Float Plane #319 saw the shadow of a conning tower and attacked. She dropped one bomb which may have gone off below WAHOO forcing her closer to the surface
causing her to momentarilly broach so the Japanese could see "the body and wake of a propeller". Another bomb was dropped possibly causing the fatal damage <more on that in a bit>.

When seen...WAHOO had passed out of the Straits but once she was damaged she turned to the west on a course of 315 possibly hoping to head back into the Sea of Japan and perhaps to Russian territory to scuttle or hopefully intern themselves. <this last bit is speculation>.

Float Plane 32 then took its turn dropping more bombs and the oil slick was getting larger. The two planes then kept shuttling back and forth between the attack area and their base at Wakkanai while the ships monitored the area. The slick became much larger and air bubbles were seen as well as larger volumes of oil. Occasionally...they sighted the sub below the surface. WAHOO slowed down and eventually alighted upright on the bottom. Hours later...a huge volume of oil burst to the suface. Since this was after the attacks had ceased...it is speculated that the surviving crew tried to lighten the ship by blowing all ballast and remaining oil to lighten the ship to allow it to surface so the remaining crew could escape. This failed and the remaining personnel most likely ended up dying slowly until the air exhausted itself.

Now for the damage to the sub. Video taken by the Russian divers shows the WAHOO INTACT and upright on the bottom heading westward. Originally it was thought that some of the first bombs had damaged her propeller blades but photgraphs show both props intact although covered with marine growth. The only VISIBLE MAJOR DAMAGE was a bomb hit that penetrated the sub on the cigarette deck aft of the bridge superstructure. The bomb hit was angled downward from port to starboard and blew out portions of the superstructure and hull in the vacinity of the Crews Mess aft of the control room watertight door. This damage was fatal killing all in the area flooding the crews mess and sleeping quarters. Not sure IF the bomb blew out the w/t door leading to the control room. Photopgraphic evidence does not show IF the initial bomb blast damaged the Conning Tower. This is important as the WAHOO's scopes were found to be RAISED leading to the theory that Morton had brought the boat too close to the surface for a "fatal look-see".

The WAHOO remained in some form of control as it fought for its life changing depth and speed to try to evade the asw attacks. How many and where they were is impossible to tell. No one is planning on entering the boat to check nor are there plans to raise her. She is an official war grave.

As for the speculation of her being shelled by a shore artty bettery...even Japanese participants in her sinking are not accepting the Army's report that they saw her. She was on the Russian side of the 12 mile wide strait and out of range of the shore batteries.

Adm O'Kane <whom I had met and corresponded with regularly until his death> wrote of his ideas of what happened to her. He speculated <and wrote in his book WAHOO> that she was damaged by a circular run <while submerged> and was struck in her forward torpedo room. While his own ship was sunk by its last torpedo <he was one of 9 survivors>...his idea was that WAHOO was only damaged forcing her to leave early. I and others disputed that notion and it was not until the Russian video came out that dispelled his theory. Unfortunately it came 13 years after his death so he never saw the pictures of WAHOO.

Hope this helps clear up some of the controversy over her sinking...

Shell
USN RET

Originally Posted by TheSatyr

There are two different versions of the Wahoo's last fight. One is the article in the link. The other one is that a Japanese patrol plane sighted a sub running on the surface,attacked out of the sun,dropped a bomb which the pilot believed hit behind the conning tower. The sub then dived and the pilot radioed the incident in after which the IJN sent some pcs and more planes to prosecute the contact.

The only difference between the two is that in one version the shore batteries spotted the Wahoo first,in the other version an aircraft spotted her first and struck her with a bomb. (Which might explain the oil slick if the bomb had hit a fuel tank.).

What I find myself wondering about is why no one used a momsen lung to try to make it to the surface. The water was certainly shallow enough to do it. They could have gone out either the forward or aft torpedo room hatches. Unless both torpedo rooms were flooded in which case they could have used the conning tower hatch as a last resort. The failure of anyone to get out does lead me to believe that there was sudden and catastrophic flooding on the boat before she touched bottom.

As for the possibility that the Wahoo was damaged before entering La Perouse,seems to me that that would have been even more of a reason to try going through at night instead of during the day,unless Morton panicked...and Morton wasn't the type to panic under any circumstances. What if...Morton was already dead and whoever took command panicked and decided to make the run during the day just to get the hell out of there. Which is a thought I've never considered before. If Wahoo had been damaged,lost the radio antenna and the radar antenna...with Morton dead or incapacitated and with inexperienced officers left to run the boat then I can definitely see panic quickly setting in,and poor decisions being made because of it. Course this is all speculation...but it fits the facts known (Which are very few) as well as anything else.

It does look like the passage of the Sawfish put the Japanese on high alert in La Perouse. Wahoo might not have been able to make it out even if the ship and crew were fine and even if they had tried going through at night.

[Stuart Galbraith]

I wonder if they would ever consider recovering her after all the surviving relatives are dead? I accept that its a war grave, but the Hunley and the Monitor were war graves too, but their historic importance ensured their eventual recovery. If nothing else, Wahoo is perhaps the most historic US submarine out there, perhaps barring Tang.

surprising how good her external condition is though. Looks like shes almost read to blow ballast and crank up the engines again.

[mrbassbone]

Originally Posted by Stuart Galbraith

I wonder if they would ever consider recovering her after all the surviving relatives are dead? I accept that its a war grave, but the Hunley and the Monitor were war graves too, but their historic importance ensured their eventual recovery. If nothing else, Wahoo is perhaps the most historic US submarine out there, perhaps barring Tang.

surprising how good her external condition is though. Looks like shes almost read to blow ballast and crank up the engines again.

There is presidence for the raising and interrnemt of the HUNLEY. The first TWO times she sank...she was raised and her crew <including her builder and namesake Horace Hunley> were buried in Magnolia Cemetery in Charleston, SC.

With respects to WAHOO and TANG...although WAHOO's site IS known it is in Russian waters...and her condition probably could not handle being raised. TANG's exact position is not known...but it is guessed to be off of the Chinese mainland in 180 feet of water < a known fact from her survivors> between Oksu Island and Turnabout Island...perhaps 4 to 6 miles off the coast.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by TheSatyr

Morton was worn out,had combat fatigue and had lost at least 25% of his veteran crew...including the ones he counted on the most. It's not really THAT big a surprise that she finally got caught on that patrol.

Why he tried to get through La Perouse in daylight is something we will never know...I'm guessing it was just a bad judgement call by a very tired and worn out man. One thing I do know,had O'Kane still have been on that boat at the time he wouldn't have let Morton do it.

As an aside,according to Forrest Sterling ("Wake of the Wahoo") O'Kane wasn't very well liked when he was XO of the Wahoo...the crew considered him to be a bit of a martinet. He seemed to change ALOT between the time he left the Wahoo and the time he took command of the Tang. (Of course,it couldn't have been easy being an exec to a free spirit like Morton was. He spent as much time with the enlisted men as he did with the officers...including wrestling matches in the forward torpedo room...which Morton almost always won. I think he may have been the wrestling champion when he was at Annapolis...I could be wrong though.).

It was a crime to send Morton back out there when so many people knew he wasn't quite right...including Lockwood who did have second thoughts about it...which proved to be correct.

At least one good thing came out of it. After losing Morton,Lockwood made the decision to limit the number of patrols of his sub skippers so what happened to Morton wouldn't happen to any one else.

Well thought out answer and perspective. Morton did demand to return to the Sea of Japan because his first trip proved nothing but dud torps. Lockwood was hesitant but let Morton go. Morton as adamant on going. Morton was also attempting to prove a point on using 1 torp for the kill instead of 3 torps thus bringing down more merchants. Morton was definitly an aggressive commander possibly taking more chances then his lucky stars would allow on his second patrol in the Sea of Japan. Perhaps to prove his point on dud torpedoes. Whatever the case and the reason he was surfaced will never be know with any certainty, but we can say it was men like Morton who inspired others to win the war and be aggressive.

[JackChen]

I guess dud torpedoes really sucks when you went for weeks on a sub.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by JackChen

I guess dud torpedoes really sucks when you went for weeks on a sub.

No, it sucked when you and 69 other men are depending on them to survive and nothing but duds. Might as well throw tin cans at them. He was slighty PO'd because he was putting a lot of lives on the line for no good reason at that point.