Don't ya' love Joe America?

Originally Posted by Letum

How odd. I don't find it does. I spend a lot of time reading papers on epistemology, it's a pet hobby of mine, and you don't get much closer to the truth than that! Rather than finding it hurts, I enjoy it immensely, even if some truths are unpleasant.

If you do find that it does hurt, then that might explain why you selectively avoid it so much. :hmm: What aspect of truth do you find hurtful?

You just keep thinkin' Butch. That's what you're good at.

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Kapitan_Phillips

Ohhh-ho! *cough*ENIGMA*cough* :rotfl:

Yes we were the first to invent the computer which helped to speed up the cracking of the enigma codes but we forgot to get it registered and that went to the American's

[Tchocky]

Originally Posted by STEED

Yes we were the first to invent the computer which helped to speed up the cracking of the enigma codes but we forgot to get it registered and that went to the American's

Surely it was the Poles, and then the English? You're talking about the bombe, yes?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombe

Aside: why are all of my recent posts questions.....

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

Surely it was the Poles, and then the English? You're talking about the bombe, yes?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombe

Aside: why are all of my recent posts questions.....

From that point of view I agree the Brits and Poles recreated the enigma machine blind.

Here's what we Brits built
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colossus_computer

[Letum]

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

Your won too talk....

.

Touche!

http://www.fanfic.net/~jeffwong/rant54-youre-and-your.html

[Dan D]

A take on English-French ,French-English dislikes

English Historian Timothy Gordon Ash has written that European history of the last thousand years is essentially influenced by the antagonism between England and France.
I too, have made the observation that there is such a thing between England and France:the list of Anglo-French wars is loooong http://www.historyguy.com/anglo_french.html. There is an ongoing cultural war: Condoms in England are sometimes called “French Letters”, the French call them “Chapeau anglais”(engl. English hat), just to give an example.

Gordon Ash also thinks that the English aversion to the French has expanded and now includes continental Europe as a whole and that the French aversion to the English has carried over to English-speaking America.

I tend to agree and it seems also that the English not only have exported the English language, Queen Victorian Puritanism (body fluids, anyone?) and the English-Welsh law school to America, but also a dislike for the French.
So today, there is an antagonism between the Anglosphere and France and also between USA and continental Europe which is seen as too “French”: weak, morally degraded, doomed, on the the brink of collapse.

What is the stance here of the guy in class that no one can stand, Germany, apart from Schadenfreude?

Historically, the German tribes were closer to the English than to the French. The Germans are the Teutonic cousins of the English, so to speak: The Royal house of Windsor has some “German” origin and cousinhood. During world war 1, Georg V. changed the German name “Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha” (royal dynasty Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha) which the royal family carried since 1840 into “Windsor” as it is known today. Queen Elisabeth II decided in 1960 that the familiy name from then on would be “Mountbatten-Windsor”.
Mountbatten is an Anglicisation of the German family name “Battenberg”.
Battenberg - Mountbatten, you get it? The Brits have a black sheep in the family.

Now over to the French: In the past, the Germans were a bit obsessed about the French. This had to do with the occupation of the German territories under Napoleon. A famous German French-hater back then was Prince Blücher, nicknamed “Marschall Attack”.
After he was beaten again by Napoleon at Ligny in 1815, he did not retreat back home, but instead marched to the north and arrived just in time to help the Brits and other allies who were a bit unhinged, to win the battle of Waterloo. The Brits made him an honorary citizen of London and awarded him a Dr. h.c. in Oxford for his late but not too late appearance on the Waterloo battlefield.
Prince Blücher had an obsessive idea: He always wanted to blow up the bridge "Pont d'lena” over the river Seine in Paris to revenge the dishonour of the Prussian defeat of 1806 against Napoleon. When the allies entered the Paris of Napoleon for the second time, he railed: “How many more times do we have to occupy this -censored- place?”

The German tribes, like e.g. Prussians and Bavarians, could not stand each other but were united in dislike for the French, at least. So in order to unite the German tribes into one German nation state, Bismarck started the German-French war 1870/1871 which was won because the joint German tribes simply outnumbered the French. The balance of power had shifted onto the German side.
The founding of the German nation state was then declared in the hall of mirrors at Versailles, on French soil. The “humiliation of Versailles” happened again in 1918 when Germany had to surrender and signed the peace treaty of Versailles and another time when France had to surrender to Hitler at Versailles. After 2 world wars France and Germany are now looking for things they have in common.

Already in the past, Germany has proven that it has the ability to bring together French and Brits and Americans, and even Americans and Commies, WW 1 and WW 2, and as such it is probably qualified to act as a middleman between France and England and France and USA. ROFL

[August]

Originally Posted by Dan D

Bismarck started the German-French war 1870/1871 which was won because the joint German tribes simply outnumbered the French.

Actually the French started that war, and they lost, not because of being outnumbered, but rather because the Germans were better trained and led.

[Tchocky]

Originally Posted by August

Actually the French started that war, and they lost, not because of being outnumbered, but rather because the Germans were better trained and led.

They started the war after Bismarck doctored telegrams and released them, with the intention:

"The Ems Telegram should have the desired effect of waving a red cape in front of the face of the Gallic Bull".

France started it, technically.

[August]

Originally Posted by Tchocky

They started the war after Bismarck doctored telegrams and released them, with the intention:

"The Ems Telegram should have the desired effect of waving a red cape in front of the face of the Gallic Bull".

France started it, technically.

It contributed to it definitely, but i'd say the war was made inevitable with the French ultimatum to William:


From Wiki:
The Franco-Prussian War (July 19, 1870 – May 10, 1871) was declared by France on Prussia, which was backed by the North German Confederation and the south German states of Baden, Württemberg and Bavaria. The conflict marked the culmination of tension between the two powers following Prussia's rise to dominance in Germany, which before 1866 was still a loose federation of quasi-independent territories.
The war began over the ascension of a candidate from the Sigmaringen branch of the Hohenzollern royal family to the vacant Spanish throne as Isabella II had abdicated in 1868. This was strongly opposed by France who issued an ultimatum to King William I of Prussia to have the candidacy withdrawn, which was done. Aiming to humiliate Prussia, Emperor Napoleon III of France then required William to apologize and renounce any possible further Hohenzollern candidature to the Spanish throne. King William, surprised at his holiday resort by the French ambassador, denied the French request. Prussia's prime minister Otto von Bismarck edited the King's account of his meeting with the French ambassador to make the encounter more heated than it really was. Known as the Ems Dispatch, it was released to the press. It was designed to give the French the impression that King Wilhelm I had insulted the French Count Benedetti, and to give the German people the impression that the Count had insulted the King. It succeeded in both of its aims.
The French people and their parliament reacted with outrage; Napoleon III mobilized and declared war on Prussia only, but effectively also on the states of southern Germany. The German armies quickly mobilized and within a few weeks controlled large amounts of land in eastern France. Their success was due in part to rapid mobilization by train, to Prussian General Staff leadership and to innovative Krupp artillery. Napoleon III was captured with his whole army at the Battle of Sedan, yet this did not end the war, as a republic was declared in Paris on September 4, 1870, marking the creation of the Third Republic of France under the Government of National Defense and later the "Versaillais government" of Adolphe Thiers. The immediate result was an extension to the war as the Republic proclaimed a continuation of the fight.
Over a five-month campaign, the German armies defeated the newly recruited French armies in a series of battles fought across northern France. Following a prolonged siege, the French capital Paris fell on January 28, 1871. Ten days earlier, the German states had proclaimed their union under the Prussian King, uniting Germany as a nation-state, the German Empire. The final peace Treaty of Frankfurt was signed May 10, 1871, during the time of the bloody Paris Commune of 1871.

[U-533]

Originally Posted by waste gate

Perhaps we can perpetuate a few more streotypes.

All Germans are NAZIs;
all Spanish speaking people are lazy;
all Brits have bad teeth;
all Ausis are criminals;
all French are surrender monkeys;
all Italians are mafiosos;
all Jews are cheap, money grabbers;

I could think of a few more but I think you get my point. None of these images are true or helpful. Let's not turn this forum into a 'hate forum'.

My two cents.

I think that the Media makes a country's views one way or another.(This coin has 2 sides)

When I visited most of Europe, early 1980's , it seemed to me that America was viewed as a bunch of "Rough Ridin' Cowboys" and everyone has a pick up and a horse trough in the front yard.

odd...

I think at that time the TV show "Dallas" and a few spin offs were makin' the 'Prime Time' across most of Europe.

my my how times have changed

I agree with waste gate "PLEASE DO NOT TURN THIS FORUM INTO A "HATE FORUM"

There is enough to work with already and we need nomore.

[Mush Martin]

Originally Posted by Dan D

A take on English-French ,French-English dislikes

English Historian Timothy Gordon Ash has written that European history of the last thousand years is essentially influenced by the antagonism between England and France.
I too, have made the observation that there is such a thing between England and France:the list of Anglo-French wars is loooong http://www.historyguy.com/anglo_french.html. There is an ongoing cultural war: Condoms in England are sometimes called “French Letters”, the French call them “Chapeau anglais”(engl. English hat), just to give an example.

Gordon Ash also thinks that the English aversion to the French has expanded and now includes continental Europe as a whole and that the French aversion to the English has carried over to English-speaking America.

I tend to agree and it seems also that the English not only have exported the English language, Queen Victorian Puritanism (body fluids, anyone?) and the English-Welsh law school to America, but also a dislike for the French.
So today, there is an antagonism between the Anglosphere and France and also between USA and continental Europe which is seen as too “French”: weak, morally degraded, doomed, on the the brink of collapse.

What is the stance here of the guy in class that no one can stand, Germany, apart from Schadenfreude?

Historically, the German tribes were closer to the English than to the French. The Germans are the Teutonic cousins of the English, so to speak: The Royal house of Windsor has some “German” origin and cousinhood. During world war 1, Georg V. changed the German name “Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha” (royal dynasty Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha) which the royal family carried since 1840 into “Windsor” as it is known today. Queen Elisabeth II decided in 1960 that the familiy name from then on would be “Mountbatten-Windsor”.
Mountbatten is an Anglicisation of the German family name “Battenberg”.
Battenberg - Mountbatten, you get it? The Brits have a black sheep in the family.

Now over to the French: In the past, the Germans were a bit obsessed about the French. This had to do with the occupation of the German territories under Napoleon. A famous German French-hater back then was Prince Blücher, nicknamed “Marschall Attack”.
After he was beaten again by Napoleon at Ligny in 1815, he did not retreat back home, but instead marched to the north and arrived just in time to help the Brits and other allies who were a bit unhinged, to win the battle of Waterloo. The Brits made him an honorary citizen of London and awarded him a Dr. h.c. in Oxford for his late but not too late appearance on the Waterloo battlefield.
Prince Blücher had an obsessive idea: He always wanted to blow up the bridge "Pont d'lena” over the river Seine in Paris to revenge the dishonour of the Prussian defeat of 1806 against Napoleon. When the allies entered the Paris of Napoleon for the second time, he railed: “How many more times do we have to occupy this -censored- place?”

The German tribes, like e.g. Prussians and Bavarians, could not stand each other but were united in dislike for the French, at least. So in order to unite the German tribes into one German nation state, Bismarck started the German-French war 1870/1871 which was won because the joint German tribes simply outnumbered the French. The balance of power had shifted onto the German side.
The founding of the German nation state was then declared in the hall of mirrors at Versailles, on French soil. The “humiliation of Versailles” happened again in 1918 when Germany had to surrender and signed the peace treaty of Versailles and another time when France had to surrender to Hitler at Versailles. After 2 world wars France and Germany are now looking for things they have in common.

Already in the past, Germany has proven that it has the ability to bring together French and Brits and Americans, and even Americans and Commies, WW 1 and WW 2, and as such it is probably qualified to act as a middleman between France and England and France and USA. ROFL

Dan the English and the french are like brother and sister they need each other for the English can not cook and the French can not fight.

did somebody say we were supposed to be perpetuating stereotypes earlier?

Really though Dont let France WW2 fool you, they are capable thats why
so much military terminology is french

Ie nom de guerre , coup de main , etc.

and they have a lot of shall we say "sang froid"

"my left has collapsed my centre is crumbling my left is overrun...........
conditions are perfect , I attack!"

no how can you not love that about them.
MM