Some one educate me please

Kapitan · 10-09-06, 03:50 PM

On american sonars in game i realy dont have a clue what im doing this is totaly radical to me its like coming from the stone age into the modern age here! lol

So can some one please help me out to the basics or if theres a manual for it please kindly direct me to it, mainly for both SSN21 and 688i thanks

Dr.Sid · 10-09-06, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kapitan

On american sonars in game i realy dont have a clue what im doing this is totaly radical to me its like coming from the stone age into the modern age here! lol

So can some one please help me out to the basics or if theres a manual for it please kindly direct me to it, mainly for both SSN21 and 688i thanks

Game manual should be enough .. it was for me. The windows area just not round, and you see only one array at a time (not all as in russian subs).
Also note that to mark on NB, you have to mark line on the spectrum analysis, not the 'peak' on the top window.

Start with 688, it has simpler interface.

Also there are these manuals at www.subguru.com .. SubGuru has everything about DW which was written.

Kapitan · 10-09-06, 04:44 PM

DONG DONG i need a big slap for missing that one, ive just done some work on my own and i forgot crimaty.

Also i dont have the manual.

ASWnut101 · 10-09-06, 04:44 PM

I cant belive it! Im going to help out the "king" of subs Kapitan!

Well, here it goes!: (note: this is for the Broadband display only)

The americain subs use something called the "waterfall" display to show contacts instead of the easy "circle with squiggly lines" display. The waterfall display (ill refer to it as the WFD from now on) obviously consists of two screens, arrayed one on top of the other. the top one is set by default to a representation of 30 of tracking, while the bottom one is set to display tracks over a 30 minute time period. Tracks are displayed as virtical lines that "fall" with the display. The 30 second display (3SD) is not so good at showing contacts as the 30 minute display (3MD), and why, i dont really know. Anyway, you will notice a tick mark perpendicular to the line where the waterfall originates (at the top). this is your tool to place a tracker/detect a contact. the towed array is not a very good detection tool for american subs as it floods the waterfalls with mirror tracks that make positive bearing finding much harder, so use the bow array!(especially for the seawolf). To track a contact, place the tick mark over the and press "assign tracker"

-----tada!

Dr.Sid · 10-09-06, 04:47 PM

Longer time averaging removes noise, that's why contacts are more visible then.

Kapitan · 10-09-06, 04:50 PM

Lol king of russian subs not king of american subs definatly not!

I mainly on russian side and well when i come to use the american subs sometimes i just cry cause i just cant use the systems.

Hence why i run back to the akula.

Dr.Sid · 10-09-06, 05:04 PM

Uh .. I just don't understand it .. I play all platforms. I see no point in playing just one. I don't find system so different. After all this time with DW, I even found all the game damn simple and not satisfying me in at all

:rotfl:

Kapitan, just play it .. play it a lot .. soon you'll be Captain too.

Kazuaki Shimazaki II · 10-09-06, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kapitan

On american sonars in game i realy dont have a clue what im doing this is totaly radical to me its like coming from the stone age into the modern age here! lol

So can some one please help me out to the basics or if theres a manual for it please kindly direct me to it, mainly for both SSN21 and 688i thanks

What's so hard about it? All that is different is the sonar:
1) The active sonar actually works in American subs IIRC. It is a B-scope display rather than circular display, but it works in much the same way - fire the sonar and click on the dim excuses for blips that you can actually see.
2) The BB passive sonar is a waterfall (time-bearing display). You'd love waterfalls. They "compress" noise so continuous noise is easier to see, and you'd catch all the transients. If you really want your instantaneous display back then cover up most of the waterfall with a piece of paper...
3) The narrowband sonar is an A-scope. Click and drag the bearing cursor until you see lines on that black display at the top with the frequencies listed.

Once you get used to it, you'd curse Russian ergonomics. You'd never understand why the Russians stayed with SSAZ after they went digital - it is understandable for an analog display because those don't have memories to hold a waterfall, but they went digital....

Dr.Sid · 10-10-06, 04:07 AM

On the other hand, I like that you see all arrays at once on BB. On narrowband you see all bearings at once.

It would be best to have it all

sonar732 · 10-10-06, 06:59 AM

Kaptain,

As for the tactical deployment of American waterfall displays, it very simple. The first thing that I do, is deploy the particular towed array to match my tactic, to the 'S' on the "Scope" indicator. Why might you ask? It's far enough behind the boat to allow me to see contacts, and close enough that it doesn't drag the bottom in litoral ops. I constantly compair my sphere array and towed array for contacts. This helps with resolving a bearing of contact without having to manuever. If the later isn't an option, patience is key. Manuever the boat on a LAG course to get in their baffles. Watch your towed array contacts as the black area moves. If the contact stays on the same bearing, that is your contact, if it moves, that is the mirrored contact.

As for NB, I have my frequency marker on 300 hz so that I can see the 50 and 60 hz tonals better. It also gives me another tonal for classification. If there are too many possibiliities, I move the frequency to the next one to give me 3 tonals. I never assign sierra numbers in NB as it will mess up DEMON. In the waterfall towed array BB, I cycle thru the tracker review button and immediately go to NB so I won't have any confusion of if it's the mirror or true contact.

Let's not forget the deployment of UUV's to help your TMA! You have to keep in mind that the OPFOR could get a Torpedo in the Water warning though.

Dr.Sid · 10-10-06, 09:32 AM

Sonar, can you tell something more about 'messing up the DEMON' ?

sonar732 · 10-10-06, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Sid

Sonar, can you tell something more about 'messing up the DEMON' ?

If you assign a tracker in NB, you won't be able to get a DEMON classification. DEMON stands for DEMOdulated Noise and you can only get that from assigning trackers in BB. Utilize NB for classification only of frequencies, BB for situational awareness, and DEMON for Turn Counts.

Kapitan · 10-10-06, 02:44 PM

Thanks guys and i guess thats why your names SONAR

Dr.Sid · 10-10-06, 02:46 PM

I see ! It's just the same as on Kilo .. it shows only BB tags. On Kilo you only have 2 tags, so its normal you ALWAYS have to jumo to BB, assign track, then go to DEMON.
Now it gives sense .. I for sure will help my range estimate

Oberon · 10-10-06, 04:15 PM

Gods Kap...TBH with you, I don't know how you manage to use that strange circular thing called Russian sonar. It's waterfall or nothing here...but then again I've been 688ing since Fast Attack and even find the Seawolf confusing at times. Everytime I load up the LA, it's like putting on a well used glove, I load up the Akula or Kilo and usually wind up shooting at plankton...

10-09-06, 03:50 PM	#1
Kapitan Sub Test Pilot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK + Canada Posts: 7,130 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 7	Some one educate me please On american sonars in game i realy dont have a clue what im doing this is totaly radical to me its like coming from the stone age into the modern age here! lol So can some one please help me out to the basics or if theres a manual for it please kindly direct me to it, mainly for both SSN21 and 688i thanks __________________ DONT FORGET if you like a post to nominate it by using the blue diamond Find out about Museum Ships here: https://www.museumships.us/ Flickr for all my pictures: https://www.flickr.com/photos/131313936@N03/ Navy general board articles: https://www.navygeneralboard.com/author/aegis/

10-09-06, 04:44 PM	#3
Kapitan Sub Test Pilot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK + Canada Posts: 7,130 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 7	DONG DONG i need a big slap for missing that one, ive just done some work on my own and i forgot crimaty. Also i dont have the manual. __________________ DONT FORGET if you like a post to nominate it by using the blue diamond Find out about Museum Ships here: https://www.museumships.us/ Flickr for all my pictures: https://www.flickr.com/photos/131313936@N03/ Navy general board articles: https://www.navygeneralboard.com/author/aegis/

10-09-06, 04:44 PM	#4
ASWnut101 Admiral Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: USA Posts: 2,021 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	I cant belive it! Im going to help out the "king" of subs Kapitan! Well, here it goes!: (note: this is for the Broadband display only) The americain subs use something called the "waterfall" display to show contacts instead of the easy "circle with squiggly lines" display. The waterfall display (ill refer to it as the WFD from now on) obviously consists of two screens, arrayed one on top of the other. the top one is set by default to a representation of 30 of tracking, while the bottom one is set to display tracks over a 30 minute time period. Tracks are displayed as virtical lines that "fall" with the display. The 30 second display (3SD) is not so good at showing contacts as the 30 minute display (3MD), and why, i dont really know. Anyway, you will notice a tick mark perpendicular to the line where the waterfall originates (at the top). this is your tool to place a tracker/detect a contact. the towed array is not a very good detection tool for american subs as it floods the waterfalls with mirror tracks that make positive bearing finding much harder, so use the bow array!(especially for the seawolf). To track a contact, place the tick mark over the and press "assign tracker" -----tada! __________________

10-09-06, 04:50 PM	#6
Kapitan Sub Test Pilot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK + Canada Posts: 7,130 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 7	Lol king of russian subs not king of american subs definatly not! I mainly on russian side and well when i come to use the american subs sometimes i just cry cause i just cant use the systems. Hence why i run back to the akula. __________________ DONT FORGET if you like a post to nominate it by using the blue diamond Find out about Museum Ships here: https://www.museumships.us/ Flickr for all my pictures: https://www.flickr.com/photos/131313936@N03/ Navy general board articles: https://www.navygeneralboard.com/author/aegis/

10-10-06, 02:44 PM	#13
Kapitan Sub Test Pilot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK + Canada Posts: 7,130 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 7	Thanks guys and i guess thats why your names SONAR __________________ DONT FORGET if you like a post to nominate it by using the blue diamond Find out about Museum Ships here: https://www.museumships.us/ Flickr for all my pictures: https://www.flickr.com/photos/131313936@N03/ Navy general board articles: https://www.navygeneralboard.com/author/aegis/

10-09-06, 04:47 PM	#5
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Longer time averaging removes noise, that's why contacts are more visible then.

10-09-06, 05:04 PM	#7
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Uh .. I just don't understand it .. I play all platforms. I see no point in playing just one. I don't find system so different. After all this time with DW, I even found all the game damn simple and not satisfying me in at all :rotfl: Kapitan, just play it .. play it a lot .. soon you'll be Captain too.

10-10-06, 04:07 AM	#9
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	On the other hand, I like that you see all arrays at once on BB. On narrowband you see all bearings at once. It would be best to have it all

10-10-06, 06:59 AM	#10
sonar732 The Old Man Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Central MO Posts: 1,562 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Kaptain, As for the tactical deployment of American waterfall displays, it very simple. The first thing that I do, is deploy the particular towed array to match my tactic, to the 'S' on the "Scope" indicator. Why might you ask? It's far enough behind the boat to allow me to see contacts, and close enough that it doesn't drag the bottom in litoral ops. I constantly compair my sphere array and towed array for contacts. This helps with resolving a bearing of contact without having to manuever. If the later isn't an option, patience is key. Manuever the boat on a LAG course to get in their baffles. Watch your towed array contacts as the black area moves. If the contact stays on the same bearing, that is your contact, if it moves, that is the mirrored contact. As for NB, I have my frequency marker on 300 hz so that I can see the 50 and 60 hz tonals better. It also gives me another tonal for classification. If there are too many possibiliities, I move the frequency to the next one to give me 3 tonals. I never assign sierra numbers in NB as it will mess up DEMON. In the waterfall towed array BB, I cycle thru the tracker review button and immediately go to NB so I won't have any confusion of if it's the mirror or true contact. Let's not forget the deployment of UUV's to help your TMA! You have to keep in mind that the OPFOR could get a Torpedo in the Water warning though.

10-10-06, 09:32 AM	#11
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Sonar, can you tell something more about 'messing up the DEMON' ?

10-10-06, 02:46 PM	#14
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	I see ! It's just the same as on Kilo .. it shows only BB tags. On Kilo you only have 2 tags, so its normal you ALWAYS have to jumo to BB, assign track, then go to DEMON. Now it gives sense .. I for sure will help my range estimate

10-10-06, 04:15 PM	#15
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Gods Kap...TBH with you, I don't know how you manage to use that strange circular thing called Russian sonar. It's waterfall or nothing here...but then again I've been 688ing since Fast Attack and even find the Seawolf confusing at times. Everytime I load up the LA, it's like putting on a well used glove, I load up the Akula or Kilo and usually wind up shooting at plankton...