President Zelensky

Catfish · 03-04-22, 02:45 AM

This has not much to do with Zelensky, but all with Trump.
Zelensky did not fall for Trump's offered bribe to accuse and smear other US politicians, which is why Ukraine did not get more of the stuff it now needs.

And scared? Who would not be scared of Putin's invasion which will probably not stop with Ukraine, and may involve dropping some nuclear bombs? I am not really afraid but you must be bat sh!t crazy to call Putin and his invasion "genious".
"This is genious. I'd say that's pretty smart. He's taking over a country -- really a vast, vast location, a great piece of land with a lot of people, and just walking right in." (Trump)

"Walking right in" like Trump for a dinner?

Cyborg322 · 03-04-22, 03:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

Zelensky did not fall for Trump's offer (or bribe) to accuse US politicians, which is why Ukraine did not get more stuff it now needs.

It looks that way. I think the current situation with the talks between Zelensky and Putin is ill advised its akin to the boxing match between UK Boxer Ricky Hatton and US Floyd Mayweather. A lot of heart self belief but ultimately outmatched in may ways. Putin will almost certainly use this to his advantage if indeed he agrees at all.

I'm starting to wonder who is advising who or has Zelensky given up taking advise from the US and Europe in sheer desperation as the death toll rises

troopie · 03-04-22, 06:57 AM

You guys are obviously seeing some wildly different stuff to me. I'm just seeing a guy who is desperate to defend his country. Where's the conspiracy theory background info and references?

Reece · 03-04-22, 07:04 AM

My thoughts exactly, we Aussies are in the dark here a bit.

Catfish · 03-04-22, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by troopie

You guys are obviously seeing some wildly different stuff to me. I'm just seeing a guy who is desperate to defend his country. Where's the conspiracy theory background info and references?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reece

My thoughts exactly, we Aussies are in the dark here a bit.

Zelensky was pressed by Trump to publicly say that Biden's son Hunter Biden had some shady business in Ukraine, to denigrate Biden and so help Trump's election. Further above in this thread Gorpet again citing Trump's accusations that Biden's son had shady "deals" with ukrainian economy or such, all debunked, still echoed (like Hillary, eMails, wrecked election, only democrats doing shady stuff, deal with potentates, raped children, pizzagate, and so on)
At least i guess this is what he drones about, not sure.

When Zelenky did not follow Trump's "suggestions" in this infamous telephone call, as an answer he did not get as much economoc and military support as he had hoped.

Skybird · 03-04-22, 08:23 AM

Possible that Trump would have aligned with Putin in this war. He admires Putin, wants to be like him, wants to have his totalitarian powers, wants to be seen as a tough and mighty buddy kicking doors in and slamming fists on tables while telling sexist jokes . What a big mucho macho ma-ma-ma-manly superman, hohoho!

The sad carricature of a human being. Sadder a sight only those are who even now still believe him.

Skybird · 03-04-22, 09:23 AM

Tagesspiegel on the assassination plans against Zelensky:

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Selenskyj has survived at least three assassination attempts in recent days, the Times reports. Two different groups are said to have received orders to kill Selenskyj: mercenaries from the Kremlin-backed Wagner Group and Chechen special forces.

Both were thwarted, according to the report, by wartime opponents within Russia's Federal Security Service (FSB). According to several media reports, Ukraine's Minister of National Security and Defense confirmed the assassination attempts.

On Saturday, the first attempt was made, according to the report: Ukrainian security officials said Chechen assassins were "eliminated" on the outskirts of Ukraine's capital, Kiev, before they could reach the president. According to Oleksiy Danilov, secretary of Ukraine's National Security and Defense Council, Russian spies from the FSB, Russia's successor to the KGB, reportedly informed them of the plans - to condemn the invasion.

"I can say that we have received information from the FSB, which does not want to participate in this bloody war," Danilov said on Ukrainian television. The group is said to be the Kadyrov Elite Group, which reports to Chechen President Ramzan Kadyrov.

Separate from the Chechen attempts to kill the Ukrainian president, Wagner mercenaries reportedly made their own attempts to overthrow the government. A roughly 400-man group is believed to have been stationed in Kiev since late January for the purpose, tracking the activities of 24 high-level Ukrainian targets, according to the Times. The force is considered Russia's notorious "shadow army."

The Wagner mercenaries were supposed to wait for the "Spetsnaz," a Russian special forces unit, to create a safe corridor for them out of Kiev so they could escape after the attacks were carried out. They would have carried out the attacks in the course of storming Kiev, which would have provided them with enough distraction. However, the Russian military convoy outside the city had difficulty making headway and slowed the attack significantly.

A plan apparently failed because the mercenaries reached the top ranks of the Ukrainian government on Saturday morning, after which Kiev imposed a 36-hour "hard" curfew and sent everyone indoors so soldiers could search the streets for Russian saboteurs, according to the Daily Mail.

In their previous attempts, the mercenaries were said to have already suffered casualties and were worried about how accurately the Ukrainians had anticipated their moves. According to the Times, a source close to the group said it was "uncanny" how well informed Selenskyj's security team appeared to be.

The mercenaries were tasked with a "very high-profile mission": the beheading of a head of state, a diplomatic source told the Times. "In terms of the impact on Russian politics, this would be perhaps the biggest mission they have carried out so far. It would have a huge impact on the war," the source continued. "It only takes one of them to get lucky and they all go home with a bonus," the Times was told.

A specialist on the Russian mercenary group Wagner said that the elite "Spetsnaz" troops would probably be more capable of taking out the president because they would have access to more equipment. According to the source, however, it would make more sense for Russia to rely on the Wagner force to take out the president. Unlike Russian soldiers, the Kremlin could deny any connection here.

The Wagner Group has already been in Ukraine since 2014, when Russian fighters in civilian clothes were sent to the Donbass to foment conflict. Most recently, they have also been active in Syria and the West African country of Mali.

Russia denies its links to the Wagner group. According to the Times, the Wagner Group is said to be led by Yevgeny Prigozhin. He is considered "Putin's chef," and owns several bot factories and an online army. In the wake of the West's sanctions against Putin's invasion of Ukraine, Prigozhin is also on the list as a close friend of the Kremlin chief.

The group is said to be under intense pressure from Moscow to get its job done. It apparently wanted to eliminate the 24 targets on its list within a few days. Among them, according to a report in the Daily Mail, were the Ukrainian prime minister, the entire cabinet, the mayor of Kiev, Vitali Klitschko, and his brother Vladimir.

The mercenaries are believed to have drawn up plans for another attempt before the weekend. One theory, as reported by the Times, is that the group was trying to determine Selenskyj's whereabouts in order to mark him with a laser. After that, the Russian air force could fly in and drop a bomb.

For the Ukrainian president, the attempted attacks are not news: He has heard warnings about them from U.S. officials for weeks, the Washington Post reports. In a video message on the night of Feb. 26, he contradicted rumors that he had already left the country. "I will stay in the capital, stay with my people," he said, adding, "According to our information, the enemy has declared me target No. 1, my family target No. 2." He also warned against Russian "sabotage groups."

According to the Washington Post, the U.S. government offered to help Selenskyj leave Kiev to prevent him from being captured or killed by advancing Russian forces. Selenskyj declined the offer, saying instead, "I need ammunition, not a ride."

The Ukrainian president, according to the Daily Mail, has surrounded himself with a trusted team and is constantly on the move with ever-varying communication methods to evade the henchmen. Several times a day, he checks in with his people via video message or social media to continue fighting the Russian invasion.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

Onkel Neal · 03-04-22, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

Zelensky was pressed by Trump to publicly say that Biden's son Hunter Biden had some shady business in Ukraine, to denigrate Biden and so help Trump's election. Further above in this thread Gorpet again citing Trump's accusations that Biden's son had shady "deals" with ukrainian economy or such, all debunked, still echoed (like Hillary, eMails, wrecked election, only democrats doing shady stuff, deal with potentates, raped children, pizzagate, and so on)
At least i guess this is what he drones about, not sure.

When Zelenky did not follow Trump's "suggestions" in this infamous telephone call, as an answer he did not get as much economoc and military support as he had hoped.

I love it when people insist anything they disagree with is "debunked". It's laughable, especially when a MSM article brings up anything they don't want to be called out on, it's always "debunked" or "false claims".

Hillary: certainly did many of the things she has been accused of, most significantly, using the DNC to undermine her opponent's (Sanders) nomination run. Have you read any of Podesta's emails from Wikileaks? Do you recall the CNN talking head Brazile who leaked the debate questions to Hillary's campaign (which they used without reporting them, if I'm not mistaken)? Clinton and the DNC are as crooked as a snake, it's been evident for years. Wikileaks exposed this clearly.

Emails: Hillary directed the use of an unsecure private server for her Sec of State emails, then she tried to cover it up, directed her staff to remove evidence from the servers, lied about and tried to play dumb. Sure, you can gloss over that if you like, but it is a big deal.

I totally agree with you about Trump's stupid pressuring Zelensky about Hunter Biden's corruption, that was definitely bad, even impeachable. What Trump should have done is directed the Dept of Justice or FBI to investigate that. His stupid move does not diminish the corruption from the Bidens, no sir.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

Possible that Trump would have aligned with Putin in this war. He admires Putin, wants to be like him, wants to have his totalitarian powers, wants to be seen as a tough and mighty buddy kicking doors in and slamming fists on tables while telling sexist jokes . What a big mucho macho ma-ma-ma-manly superman, hohoho!

The sad carricature of a human being. Sadder a sight only those are who even now still believe him.

I know that Trump does like to posture as the tough, no-nonsense, action-driven macho guy, but despite that, despite his bluster and rhetoric, I don't think he's as reckless as he puts on, or as he is painted. His 4 years in office probably had the fewest military adventures and actions than any president in a long time.

Threadfin · 03-04-22, 10:24 AM

Trump will soon replace Kevin Bacon as the center of the universe, and for centuries everything bad that happens will be connected back to him.

Skybird · 03-04-22, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

I know that Trump does like to posture as the tough, no-nonsense, action-driven macho guy, but despite that, despite his bluster and rhetoric, I don't think he's as reckless as he puts on, or as he is painted. His 4 years in office probably had the fewest military adventures and actions than any president in a long time.

And scruple sor reason have nothikng to do with that, Neal. He is a coward. Thats simple.

He has nos cruples to do underhanded deals, though, and a cionsistent opportunist. And that is why it is a blessing that he is not the one in the voal officve right now. Like Putin, he has a strongly psychopathic, antisocial personality structure. But he lacks the ice-cold calculating brains that Putin once had.Both men are extrneely brutal, but the means by which they project that brutality and aggressiveness are quite different. Both men show strongn signs of paranoia, since as long a sI can remember them, and obviously also extremely strong egocentrism, but team Trump scores heavily in additional narcissism.

I am no fan of Biden, and yes, obviously his age is clearly to be seen, and yet: you underestimate the value of having him in thsi crisis, not Trump. Biden is a brainc hild of the cold war, he knwos that gam,e, how it wa splayed, he knwos the rules of it, he was part of it. He is modest. And nevertehless he also is "America first", something that many in Europoe overlook and maybe even Americans. Not evertyhing he says and done is sleepy or slow, but simply: subtle and clever.

I non-hot-head is needed on our side. Because one thing I am 100% certain of now: Putin will not shy away from using nuclear weapons in the Ukraine if he thinks that is what is needed to rescue himself. I hate to sa yit, but nuclear wepaons use in the Ukraine to me is now a realistic scenario. We must not want to have Trump accidentally pushing him over that red line, or even encouraging him with subtle "signals".

We can only hope that the Russian intel or military will put bullets in Putin's head if he gives that order. Apparently the FSB, Putin's very own domain, is no longer strictly loyal to him. We should assist these powers - and never let Russia or the world know about it, not during the action, and not after it.

Gorpet · 03-13-22, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

Zelensky was pressed by Trump to publicly say that Biden's son Hunter Biden had some shady business in Ukraine, to denigrate Biden and so help Trump's election. Further above in this thread Gorpet again citing Trump's accusations that Biden's son had shady "deals" with ukrainian economy or such, all debunked, still echoed (like Hillary, eMails, wrecked election, only democrats doing shady stuff, deal with potentates, raped children, pizzagate, and so on)
At least i guess this is what he drones about, not sure.

When Zelenky did not follow Trump's "suggestions" in this infamous telephone call, as an answer he did not get as much economoc and military support as he had hoped.

And what was that you said about me ?. Somebody has to eat a Crow and you can start at it's beak feet and work your way up.

03-04-22, 02:45 AM	#1
Catfish Dipped Squirrel Operative Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: ..where the ocean meets the sky Posts: 17,805 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	This has not much to do with Zelensky, but all with Trump. Zelensky did not fall for Trump's offered bribe to accuse and smear other US politicians, which is why Ukraine did not get more of the stuff it now needs. And scared? Who would not be scared of Putin's invasion which will probably not stop with Ukraine, and may involve dropping some nuclear bombs? I am not really afraid but you must be bat sh!t crazy to call Putin and his invasion "genious". "This is genious. I'd say that's pretty smart. He's taking over a country -- really a vast, vast location, a great piece of land with a lot of people, and just walking right in." (Trump) "Walking right in" like Trump for a dinner? __________________ >^..^<)))>{ All generalizations are wrong. Last edited by Catfish; 03-04-22 at 03:44 AM.*

03-04-22, 06:57 AM	#3
troopie Captain Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Oz Posts: 507 Downloads: 33 Uploads: 0	You guys are obviously seeing some wildly different stuff to me. I'm just seeing a guy who is desperate to defend his country. Where's the conspiracy theory background info and references? __________________ Serial pest

03-04-22, 07:04 AM	#4
Reece CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Down Under Posts: 34,826 Downloads: 171 Uploads: 0	My thoughts exactly, we Aussies are in the dark here a bit. __________________ *Sub captains go down with their ship!*

03-04-22, 08:23 AM	#6
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,727 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Possible that Trump would have aligned with Putin in this war. He admires Putin, wants to be like him, *wants to have his totalitarian powers,* wants to be seen as a tough and mighty buddy kicking doors in and slamming fists on tables while telling sexist jokes . What a big mucho macho ma-ma-ma-manly superman, hohoho! The sad carricature of a human being. Sadder a sight only those are who even now still believe him. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

03-04-22, 09:23 AM	#7
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,727 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Tagesspiegel on the assassination plans against Zelensky: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Selenskyj has survived at least three assassination attempts in recent days, the Times reports. Two different groups are said to have received orders to kill Selenskyj: mercenaries from the Kremlin-backed Wagner Group and Chechen special forces. Both were thwarted, according to the report, by wartime opponents within Russia's Federal Security Service (FSB). According to several media reports, Ukraine's Minister of National Security and Defense confirmed the assassination attempts. On Saturday, the first attempt was made, according to the report: Ukrainian security officials said Chechen assassins were "eliminated" on the outskirts of Ukraine's capital, Kiev, before they could reach the president. According to Oleksiy Danilov, secretary of Ukraine's National Security and Defense Council, Russian spies from the FSB, Russia's successor to the KGB, reportedly informed them of the plans - to condemn the invasion. "I can say that we have received information from the FSB, which does not want to participate in this bloody war," Danilov said on Ukrainian television. The group is said to be the Kadyrov Elite Group, which reports to Chechen President Ramzan Kadyrov. Separate from the Chechen attempts to kill the Ukrainian president, Wagner mercenaries reportedly made their own attempts to overthrow the government. A roughly 400-man group is believed to have been stationed in Kiev since late January for the purpose, tracking the activities of 24 high-level Ukrainian targets, according to the Times. The force is considered Russia's notorious "shadow army." The Wagner mercenaries were supposed to wait for the "Spetsnaz," a Russian special forces unit, to create a safe corridor for them out of Kiev so they could escape after the attacks were carried out. They would have carried out the attacks in the course of storming Kiev, which would have provided them with enough distraction. However, the Russian military convoy outside the city had difficulty making headway and slowed the attack significantly. A plan apparently failed because the mercenaries reached the top ranks of the Ukrainian government on Saturday morning, after which Kiev imposed a 36-hour "hard" curfew and sent everyone indoors so soldiers could search the streets for Russian saboteurs, according to the Daily Mail. In their previous attempts, the mercenaries were said to have already suffered casualties and were worried about how accurately the Ukrainians had anticipated their moves. According to the Times, a source close to the group said it was "uncanny" how well informed Selenskyj's security team appeared to be. The mercenaries were tasked with a "very high-profile mission": the beheading of a head of state, a diplomatic source told the Times. "In terms of the impact on Russian politics, this would be perhaps the biggest mission they have carried out so far. It would have a huge impact on the war," the source continued. "It only takes one of them to get lucky and they all go home with a bonus," the Times was told. A specialist on the Russian mercenary group Wagner said that the elite "Spetsnaz" troops would probably be more capable of taking out the president because they would have access to more equipment. According to the source, however, it would make more sense for Russia to rely on the Wagner force to take out the president. Unlike Russian soldiers, the Kremlin could deny any connection here. The Wagner Group has already been in Ukraine since 2014, when Russian fighters in civilian clothes were sent to the Donbass to foment conflict. Most recently, they have also been active in Syria and the West African country of Mali. Russia denies its links to the Wagner group. According to the Times, the Wagner Group is said to be led by Yevgeny Prigozhin. He is considered "Putin's chef," and owns several bot factories and an online army. In the wake of the West's sanctions against Putin's invasion of Ukraine, Prigozhin is also on the list as a close friend of the Kremlin chief. The group is said to be under intense pressure from Moscow to get its job done. It apparently wanted to eliminate the 24 targets on its list within a few days. Among them, according to a report in the Daily Mail, were the Ukrainian prime minister, the entire cabinet, the mayor of Kiev, Vitali Klitschko, and his brother Vladimir. The mercenaries are believed to have drawn up plans for another attempt before the weekend. One theory, as reported by the Times, is that the group was trying to determine Selenskyj's whereabouts in order to mark him with a laser. After that, the Russian air force could fly in and drop a bomb. For the Ukrainian president, the attempted attacks are not news: He has heard warnings about them from U.S. officials for weeks, the Washington Post reports. In a video message on the night of Feb. 26, he contradicted rumors that he had already left the country. "I will stay in the capital, stay with my people," he said, adding, "According to our information, the enemy has declared me target No. 1, my family target No. 2." He also warned against Russian "sabotage groups." According to the Washington Post, the U.S. government offered to help Selenskyj leave Kiev to prevent him from being captured or killed by advancing Russian forces. Selenskyj declined the offer, saying instead, "I need ammunition, not a ride." The Ukrainian president, according to the Daily Mail, has surrounded himself with a trusted team and is constantly on the move with ever-varying communication methods to evade the henchmen. Several times a day, he checks in with his people via video message or social media to continue fighting the Russian invasion. Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version) __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

03-04-22, 10:24 AM	#9
Threadfin Ace of the Deep Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 1,165 Downloads: 38 Uploads: 0	Trump will soon replace Kevin Bacon as the center of the universe, and for centuries everything bad that happens will be connected back to him. __________________ What? Behind the rabbit?