Here we go again-Ukraine once again

[les green01]

AMMO Inc is donating 1 million rounds of ammunition to the Armed Forced of Ukraine

[Jimbuna]

[Red Devil]

Putin was allowed to get away with invading Georgia and Crimea, he thought it would work again. Next he would probably have tried Hungary again or Slovakia. We have to stand together, and starve Russia economically now. I did see on one channel that the EU were sending jets to Ukraine, I believe minus pilots ? The owrst it gets for Russia, the sooner Putin will be toppled. We hope.

[mapuc]

Did or didn't NATO promise Jeltsin that NATO wouldn't expand one inch ?

There's some discussion on FB among my Danish friends.

Some say it's Putin who has been altering with history while others say he hasn't we only have to read our history books.

I seem to recall it slightly something with promises to Soviet/Russia.

Markus

[Armistead]

Could this have been avoided? Was NATO and the US too weak and reactive since March? Did Putin through talks feel NATO would divide or respond weakly because of energy? Does this compare to the first Iraq War, where Saddam due to words and policies of the US and NATO felt he could take Kuwait without too many serious issues, but then came an overwhelming response that put him in a lose lose situation. It appears Putin is now in that lose lose situation due to an overwhelming response he probably didn't expect. It seems in weak reactive policy for 2 decades not to poke the bear we let the bear out of its cage. Right now Putin has chosen to escalate. I don't see how this doesn't eventually end in WW3.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Did or didn't NATO promise Jeltsin that NATO wouldn't expand one inch ?

There's some discussion on FB among my Danish friends.

Some say it's Putin who has been altering with history while others say he hasn't we only have to read our history books.

I seem to recall it slightly something with promises to Soviet/Russia.

Markus

Nothing of that matters anymore. Nothing of that can be allowed to matter anymore.


Russian troops in Belarus. Russian nukes to be brought back into Belarus, they threaten. Russian troops and nukes in Kalinigrad. Add that together, and you have Russian nukes flying west beyond Berlin , and the threat of a pince attack against the Baltic states. All that is already reality, except nukes in Belarus, but Russia is mulling to move them in there.

Baltic states and Poland, Slovenia, Romania, Hungary, are front states now. We must arm them up to the last tooth, like it was done with West Germany when the cold war 1.0 was still there and Germany divided.

(And Germany must get its railtrack grid in order, and attached bridges. Its of utmost logistical relevance. Traffic networks and logistics are the real primary reason why the US forces still maintain presence in Germany. )

Just this time the Europeans have to shoulder much, much more of the military burdens. America cannot afford to focus on Europe anymore as it once has done. The priorities have shifted, from 1. Europoe, 2. Gulf, 3. China, to 1. China, 2. Gulf, 3. Europe.

Germany is crash-learning bitter lessons these days, and has started to no longer reject these lessons. Now Europe must do the same.



Ironic, foreign diplomatically Putin has achieved the exact opposite of what he planned for.



We should out his minions and oligarchs and top generals under the biggest pressure we can project against them. So that they form an egoist interest to get rid of Putin.

[mapuc]

Where's the war !?

Have the last few days been watching many hours* live stream from some of the biggest cities in Ukraine and nothing.

* Not all in once, but 5-10 minutes here and there.

I use this page



As one wrote
​it is more peaceful than Gaza Israel wow what a war we are being lied to by media as usual

No I do NOT disbelieve, but there should be something on this stream.
Markus

[LUKNER]

Originally Posted by Catfish

You will be surprised.

At all. Such souls - immediately in Hell!!!

[Red Devil]

I wonder when russian troops will start to defect??

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

You know Putin is schizo, right? All this to keep Ukraine out of NATO. Putin thinks the West is out to conquer Russia. No European or NA country wants to invade and crush Russia. Man, that's crazy, no one cares.

Its an old Russian mind disease. They are like this since CENTURIES. They feel small and encircled. Can happen in a crowded little space like theirs. Cabin fever, so to speak.

[Catfish]

https://www-n--tv-de.translate.goog/..._x_tr_pto=wapp

Putin seems to be a bit afraid.. just what does he think happens if this man is being killed by hired mercenaries?
A martyr will be nothing against this and then everyone in Ukraine will stand up and fight. This will be a forever civil war even if Putin conquers and kills as many as possible.

[mapuc]

In the headlines in a Danish newspaper.

We are only in the beginning of the beginning of the war...

Markus

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Did or didn't NATO promise Jeltsin that NATO wouldn't expand one inch ?

There's some discussion on FB among my Danish friends.

Some say it's Putin who has been altering with history while others say he hasn't we only have to read our history books.

I seem to recall it slightly something with promises to Soviet/Russia.

Markus

No promises, no,treaties,

… And if the East Europeans sought to leave the Warsaw Pact, didn’t that suggest to the Soviet leadership that they might eventually want to join NATO? Gorbachev later said that this simply was not an issue at the time. “The topic of ‘NATO expansion,’” he told an interviewer in 2014, “was not discussed at all, and it wasn’t brought up in those years. I say this with full responsibility. Not a single Eastern European country raised the issue, not even after the Warsaw Pact ceased to exist in 1991.”40 But it was not true that “not a single Eastern European country raised the issue” of joining NATO during that period. The idea was in fact broached by East European leaders in meetings with Deputy Secretary of State Lawrence Eagleburger in late February 1990, just days after the Baker assurances had been given; one of them, Hungary’s foreign minister Gyula Horn, actually made public comments in this vein at the time.41 The East Europeans, to be sure, did not press this issue too vociferously. They, like everyone else, were worried that moving ahead too quickly might undermine Gorbachev’s position within the Soviet leadership, and that if he fell everything might be lost. But it was clear enough what they had in mind. As Kohl told President Bush in May, the Soviet leader had “big problems. His East European allies say they want to be in NATO.”42 And indeed Gorbachev himself told French president François Mitterrand that same month that he had told Baker “we are aware of your favorable attitude towards the intention expressed by a number of representatives of Eastern European countries to withdraw from the Warsaw Pact and subsequently join NATO.” It was in that context, he said, that he had made his famous suggestion about the USSR joining NATO as well.43

A lot of history with notes and sources in the below study.

https://www.sscnet.ucla.edu/polisci/...rg/cv/1990.pdf

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Catfish

So true, and b.t.w. no one in the west wanted to have Ukraine in NATO, or the EU


This may change now. If Putin has "success" with anything it will be Ukraine in the NATO, with Finnland probably following suit. Driving more nations into NATO while making Russia an international pariah and creating economical hardship for her people. And all western nations stepping up their defenses in fear.


But fascists and NATO is only a pretext anyway, Putin wants to expand "his" Russia to cold war times, one country after the other: Chechenia, Georgia, the Krim, now Ukraine, and he already threatened the baltic states, and Finnland.


And that is the problem, if he does not succeed now he will probably use thermobaric bombs or even nuclear ones against Ukraine, and then he may probably want to leave this life with a bang. He gives a sh!t about Russia and the people.

Anyone remembering "Citizen Kane": Rosebud?


If there is any linearity in Putin's psychological biography, then it visibly starts from the collapse of the USSR on. That was his Rosebud moment, so to speak. And as a secret service man who was selected for that job, he was filtered out for havign certain character traits and mind skills: intelligeence, and probabaly some trait that could be summarised as in total pointing at something like a psychopathic, paranoid and/or anti-empathic personality structure (I have not yet watched the video Jim has linked, its very long...). You find psychopathic personality structures like this statistically valid accumulated in people in certain jobs, for example senior doctors at hospitals, company top managers, top ban kers, poltlicla leaders and poltlicla top offic eholders. You see, certain traits in people enable them, maybe better formulated: help them to reach these positions and occupy them. Its a two-split sword, itu can help tp push throuzgh good work or goals, and it can work for turning the job holder into a monstrosity.



Which we see in case of Putin.


That cannot be an excuse to not get rid of him, no matter in which way. I do not excuse with the above, I try to explain. That are two very different things.

[Andreas86]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Where's the war !?

Have the last few days been watching many hours* live stream from some of the biggest cities in Ukraine and nothing.

* Not all in once, but 5-10 minutes here and there.

I use this page



As one wrote
​it is more peaceful than Gaza Israel wow what a war we are being lied to by media as usual

No I do NOT disbelieve, but there should be something on this stream.
Markus

What fighting is going on in the cities is still on the outskirts. The air alarm went off several times in Kiev and Lviv yesterday, and there were explosions and rumbling of bombs throughout the day and evening. The cities are big you know, the war will not necessarily happen right in front of the webcam..

What idiot said it was calmer than Gaza? Take a look at the Grad shelling in Kharkiv earlier this day, I bet the citizens felt the same way.