UFOs: finally we can accept them as myth and hoax? - Page 6

mapuc · 05-19-21, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Good question. In my universe Im busy typing away interacting with my cellphone.

Is there a religion where the cellphone and/or the smartphone is worshiped ?
The way people is interacting with their phones, it looks like it does

Markus

Gerald · 05-19-21, 10:05 AM

Many people are far too busy and engrossed in keeping track of things all the time (certainly nothing negative about it) and "explicitly go all in" on doing phone business, but of course it's up to everyone. Personally, when nature experiences and a little more other things, then I happily turn off the phone.

Rockstar · 05-19-21, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mapuc

Is there a religion where the cellphone and/or the smartphone is worshiped ?
The way people is interacting with their phones, it looks like it does

Markus

Its silly to think I worship my phone or internet.

All Im saying is I cannot prove you exsist.

Gerald · 05-19-21, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Its silly to think I worship my phone or internet.

All Im saying is I cannot prove you exsist.

A philosophical expression for the day..

mapuc · 05-23-21, 10:41 AM

Interesting video

Markus

Skybird · 05-23-21, 11:13 AM

This video does not change my mind one bit. Videos can be artifically created (Hollywood does it all the time), and people can be paid or blackmailed to or intimidated to pretend to somebody in the knowledge. They even can truly believe that what they say is true, and the can describe something they cannot explain as best as they can.

None of this is evidence for or against anything.

Methodologically, all this doe snot een rate as a theory, because a theory must meet certain criteria to eb acutally qualfied as beign labelled a "theory". For exmaple, you must be able to test it. If a test is not possible, it is no theory but a hypothesis - or speculation.

I stick to it: that the phenomneneon of an existing and fed ubnterest in these thignsd exist, annot be denied, it is real. But what the phenomenon in our inerpretations si showing us - that is something totally different.

A Fata Morgana is real, it is a oyhsical ohenomenbeon of lightbeams beign reflected on distant heat layers of air. It is a real phenomenon. But what the phenomenon is apparently showing us, is not real, but unreal, is not what it looks like. Its not a real well. Its not a real city. Its not a real forest in the desert.

Its an insult to our intellect but - we do not know anything. On this.

So my advice: 1. be maximum open and 2. be maximum sceptical. You see something soembody shows you, you hear words somebody says, you read texts somebody has written. For the time being, I leave it to just these three facts. More I do not know about it.

Von Due · 05-23-21, 12:27 PM

UFOs exist. I saw a white light on the night sky, I couldn't identify it. It was an object and it flew. A few minutes later I could identify it. It was an airliner.

I don't see any evidence of ETs ever having visited this planet. However, statistically, the chance of us being alone in our Galaxy, let alone the Universe, is really, really small. In all likelihood, there are lifeforms elsewhere. The probability that these possible beings have detected our radio signals is next to zero. The radio bubble is really small compared to the size of our Galaxy. Then, there is also a reasonable chance that physics won't allow interstellar travel. Sci-fi doesn't work off camera. Then again, our best theories are the best of bad ideas.

In short: No evidence of flying saucers, too little chance of anyone visiting, I'm not spending any lengthy time pondering this.

mapuc · 05-23-21, 12:43 PM

There's two steps questions here.

1. Does UFO exist ? If the government/military is correct, then they do exist.

This lead to the second question

2. What are they and where are they coming from.

Even if I should believe in ufo(which I really don't) is not the same as believing in aliens.

Yes there's a connection between ufo and aliens-I just say it doesn't have to.

Markus

Platapus · 05-23-21, 02:00 PM

Skybird · 05-23-21, 02:05 PM

Mapuc,

you cannot even be certain that there was acutally any object flying. Th videos from the MFDs in fighterplanes showed a blip on a radar screen. Whether these blips actually represented somethign we could call an object, or were just blips, we will not know.

And the (claimed) pilots?

Are humans. Maybe getting orders. Maybe being bought and paid. Maybe being forced. Maybe are pilots. Maybe are stage actors. We do not know. Maybe they lied, maybe they said the truth. Maybe they said something wrong which they beleived was the truth.

Some time back in the late 80s I think there was a famous Harvard psychiatrist, John Mack. For some time I believed him when he wrote a book - in honest intention, I got the impression, I give him that - about people contacting him and telling him of their traumata due to their abductions by aliens. It ruined his reputation that he took it serious, but he stuck to it. Later I think some of these "witnesses" stepped forward, admitting that they were lying and mocking him, wanting to see how far they could get with their stories. Mack died already years ago. - Well, this one taught me a lesson. It really did. The lesson is: I do not know wether these "witnesses" lied to professor Mack - or lied later on when saying that they lied to him. At one of these opportunities they obviously lied at least once. Maybe they lied even at both occasions. But they did not say the truth on both occasions, right?

In the nineties there also was a video making the rounds, showing a claimed surgical autopsy of an alien, a so-called "Grey". Some years ago the makers admitted that it was a hoax, not too badly done, but they showed the puppet, the place, and they confirmed that the sceptics were right when criticising the video as a fake for the telephone cable shown in that film - and that was not used at the time the film was claimed to be shot in. The business man, Santilli was the name I think.

Always be open minded. But also: always be sceptical. Thats the spirit of science: both of it combined. Proof can only be supplied by evidence.

There is no evidence on UFOs. At least none the public is allowed to know of. Science cannot know everything. But its leads the way a scientist must follow. He shall not allow to stray off, or to get distracted. And he must accept the lacks in his knowledge, the limits of empiry. We do not know everything, since we cannot examine everything, and our technologies base on evolving knowledge that is always temporary, never will be complete, it cannot be. Religions claim they know it all, and they also claim they must not provide evidence. But science must, else it is no science. Beyond evidence, its unknown territory. Lets accept it as that: unknown territory. We can take motivation from it, motivation to explore it. But nevertheless, its unknown territory until its explored. And no belief and no believing changes that. To me its a sign of mature adulthood to acept it as "unknown" - instead of filling the void with fairy tales from childhood and taking them as comfortable and cozy facts. Facts must be proven, not just claimed.

Mr Quatro · 05-23-21, 04:23 PM

^ Same with the people that have said to have visited heaven and or hell. Some have later recanted and said they lied in order to get attention, but that doesn't mean that heaven and hell is not real.

We have been visited by something that doesn't want us to know who they are and sooner or later they will make a big mistake.

What ever happen to those stories that a UFO crashed and then it was covered up. Now that the GOV is being open and honest would be a good time to confess.

But what the heck could we do anyway ... Zap them and prove how mean and angry humans really are?

mapuc · 05-23-21, 04:58 PM

I can see I made some mistake in my former comment

1. Does UFO exist ? If the government/military is correct, then they do exist.

This could be read as I believe in ufos which I really don't -I'm very, very sceptical.

Yes there's a connection between ufo and aliens-I just say it doesn't have to.

Could be read as I believe aliens is controlling these ufos

What I meant was

If ufo exist-Are alien involved ?

The day a ufo land on my lawn and the pilot ask if it can borrow my toilet-That day I'll believe in ufos

Markus

vienna · 05-23-21, 06:22 PM

Jeez, I kept telling the guys to keep on the low side when moving around and now, this; man, there's gonna to be a hell of a lot of paperwork when I get back to the mothership...

<O>

Sean C · 05-23-21, 06:48 PM

I look up at the sky quite a lot. It's my hobby. I've seen some really strange things that I cannot explain. Things like small, bright lights - moving at three or four times the speed of an airliner and then making a 90° turn instantly before disappearing.

I also believe there is a very real possibility that intelligent life exists somewhere other than on Earth. Or not.

But I don't necessarily believe those two things are connected. I've seen Earth's atmosphere do some really amazing and unexpected things to recognizable objects - both in the sky and on the water/land.

There is no shortage of mysteries in life. That's what makes it fun.

Rockstar · 05-23-21, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vienna

Jeez, I kept telling the guys to keep on the low side when moving around and now, this; man, there's gonna to be a hell of a lot of paperwork when I get back to the mothership...

<O>

Well, alright, Starchild. Put a glide in your stride and a dip in your hip. And come on up to the Mothership!

05-19-21, 10:05 AM	#77
Gerald SUBSIM Newsman Join Date: May 2008 Location: Close to sea Posts: 24,254 Downloads: 553 Uploads: 0	Many people are far too busy and engrossed in keeping track of things all the time (certainly nothing negative about it) and "explicitly go all in" on doing phone business, but of course it's up to everyone. Personally, when nature experiences and a little more other things, then I happily turn off the phone. __________________ Nothing in life is to be feard,it is only to be understood. Marie Curie

05-23-21, 10:41 AM	#80
mapuc CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Denmark Posts: 20,540 Downloads: 37 Uploads: 0	Interesting video Markus __________________ My little lovely female cat

05-23-21, 11:13 AM	#81
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,644 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	This video does not change my mind one bit. Videos can be artifically created (Hollywood does it all the time), and people can be paid or blackmailed to or intimidated to pretend to somebody in the knowledge. They even can truly believe that what they say is true, and the can describe something they cannot explain as best as they can. None of this is *evidence* for or against anything. Methodologically, all this doe snot een rate as a theory, because a theory must meet certain criteria to eb acutally qualfied as beign labelled a "theory". For exmaple, you must be able to test it. If a test is not possible, it is no theory but a hypothesis - or speculation. I stick to it: that the phenomneneon of an existing and fed ubnterest in these thignsd exist, annot be denied, it is real. But what the phenomenon in our inerpretations si showing us - that is something totally different. A Fata Morgana is real, it is a oyhsical ohenomenbeon of lightbeams beign reflected on distant heat layers of air. It is a real phenomenon. But what the phenomenon is apparently showing us, is not real, but unreal, is not what it looks like. Its not a real well. Its not a real city. Its not a real forest in the desert. Its an insult to our intellect but - we do not know anything. On this. So my advice: 1. be maximum open and 2. be maximum sceptical. You see something soembody shows you, you hear words somebody says, you read texts somebody has written. For the time being, I leave it to just these three facts. More I do not *know* about it. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

05-23-21, 12:43 PM	#83
mapuc CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Denmark Posts: 20,540 Downloads: 37 Uploads: 0	There's two steps questions here. 1. Does UFO exist ? If the government/military is correct, then they do exist. This lead to the second question 2. What are they and where are they coming from. Even if I should believe in ufo(which I really don't) is not the same as believing in aliens. Yes there's a connection between ufo and aliens-I just say it doesn't have to. Markus __________________ My little lovely female cat

05-23-21, 02:00 PM	#84
Platapus Fleet Admiral Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 19,375 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 0	__________________ abusus non tollit usum - A right should NOT be withheld from people on the basis that some tend to abuse that right.

05-23-21, 12:27 PM	#82
Von Due Sea Lord Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 1,690 Downloads: 30 Uploads: 0	UFOs exist. I saw a white light on the night sky, I couldn't identify it. It was an object and it flew. A few minutes later I could identify it. It was an airliner. I don't see any evidence of ETs ever having visited this planet. However, statistically, the chance of us being alone in our Galaxy, let alone the Universe, is really, really small. In all likelihood, there are lifeforms elsewhere. The probability that these possible beings have detected our radio signals is next to zero. The radio bubble is really small compared to the size of our Galaxy. Then, there is also a reasonable chance that physics won't allow interstellar travel. Sci-fi doesn't work off camera. Then again, our best theories are the best of bad ideas. In short: No evidence of flying saucers, too little chance of anyone visiting, I'm not spending any lengthy time pondering this.

05-23-21, 02:05 PM	#85
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,644 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Mapuc, you cannot even be certain that there was acutally any object flying. Th videos from the MFDs in fighterplanes showed a blip on a radar screen. Whether these blips actually represented somethign we could call an object, or were just blips, we will not know. And the (claimed) pilots? Are humans. Maybe getting orders. Maybe being bought and paid. Maybe being forced. Maybe are pilots. Maybe are stage actors. We do not know. Maybe they lied, maybe they said the truth. Maybe they said something wrong which they beleived was the truth. Some time back in the late 80s I think there was a famous Harvard psychiatrist, John Mack. For some time I believed him when he wrote a book - in honest intention, I got the impression, I give him that - about people contacting him and telling him of their traumata due to their abductions by aliens. It ruined his reputation that he took it serious, but he stuck to it. Later I think some of these "witnesses" stepped forward, admitting that they were lying and mocking him, wanting to see how far they could get with their stories. Mack died already years ago. - Well, this one taught me a lesson. It really did. The lesson is: I do not know wether these "witnesses" lied to professor Mack - or lied later on when saying that they lied to him. At one of these opportunities they obviously lied at least once. Maybe they lied even at both occasions. But they did not say the truth on both occasions, right? In the nineties there also was a video making the rounds, showing a claimed surgical autopsy of an alien, a so-called "Grey". Some years ago the makers admitted that it was a hoax, not too badly done, but they showed the puppet, the place, and they confirmed that the sceptics were right when criticising the video as a fake for the telephone cable shown in that film - and that was not used at the time the film was claimed to be shot in. The business man, Santilli was the name I think. Always be open minded. But also: always be sceptical. Thats the spirit of science: both of it combined. Proof can only be supplied by evidence. There is no evidence on UFOs. At least none the public is allowed to know of. Science cannot know everything. But its leads the way a scientist must follow. He shall not allow to stray off, or to get distracted. And he must accept the lacks in his knowledge, the limits of empiry. We do not know everything, since we cannot examine everything, and our technologies base on evolving knowledge that is always temporary, never will be complete, it cannot be. Religions claim they know it all, and they also claim they must not provide evidence. But science must, else it is no science. Beyond evidence, its unknown territory. Lets accept it as that: unknown territory. We can take motivation from it, motivation to explore it. But nevertheless, its unknown territory until its explored. And no belief and no believing changes that. To me its a sign of mature adulthood to acept it as "unknown" - instead of filling the void with fairy tales from childhood and taking them as comfortable and cozy facts. Facts must be proven, not just claimed. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 05-23-21 at 02:26 PM.

05-23-21, 04:23 PM	#86
Mr Quatro Navy Seal Join Date: May 2013 Posts: 6,772 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	^ Same with the people that have said to have visited heaven and or hell. Some have later recanted and said they lied in order to get attention, but that doesn't mean that heaven and hell is not real. We have been visited by something that doesn't want us to know who they are and sooner or later they will make a big mistake. What ever happen to those stories that a UFO crashed and then it was covered up. Now that the GOV is being open and honest would be a good time to confess. But what the heck could we do anyway ... Zap them and prove how mean and angry humans really are? __________________ pla•teau noun a relatively stable level, period, or condition a level of attainment or achievement Lord help me get to the next plateau ..

05-23-21, 04:58 PM	#87
mapuc CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Denmark Posts: 20,540 Downloads: 37 Uploads: 0	I can see I made some mistake in my former comment 1. Does UFO exist ? If the government/military is correct, then they do exist. This could be read as I believe in ufos which I really don't -I'm very, very sceptical. Yes there's a connection between ufo and aliens-I just say it doesn't have to. Could be read as I believe aliens is controlling these ufos What I meant was If ufo exist-Are alien involved ? The day a ufo land on my lawn and the pilot ask if it can borrow my toilet-That day I'll believe in ufos Markus __________________ My little lovely female cat

05-23-21, 06:22 PM	#88
vienna Navy Seal Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Anywhere but the here & now... Posts: 7,714 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	Jeez, I kept telling the guys to keep on the low side when moving around and now, this; man, there's gonna to be a hell of a lot of paperwork when I get back to the mothership... <O> __________________ __________________________________________________ __

05-23-21, 06:48 PM	#89
Sean C Grey Wolf Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 984 Downloads: 16 Uploads: 2	I look up at the sky quite a lot. It's my hobby. I've seen some really strange things that I cannot explain. Things like small, bright lights - moving at three or four times the speed of an airliner and then making a 90° turn instantly before disappearing. I also believe there is a very real possibility that intelligent life exists somewhere other than on Earth. Or not. But I don't necessarily believe those two things are connected. I've seen Earth's atmosphere do some really amazing and unexpected things to recognizable objects - both in the sky and on the water/land. There is no shortage of mysteries in life. That's what makes it fun. __________________ If you have a question about celestial navigation ... ask me! Celestial Navigation Spreadsheet