USS Jimmy Carter

[Sea Demon]

Originally Posted by August

Hey you guys lay off JC. Jimmy Carter was a good decent man who, as president, was overwhelmed by the events of the times.

Nope. Sorry, no can do. I call em' like I see em'. It's no wonder why the country rejected him by such a large margin after his only four years in office. Carter? decent? Nah. Today, Jimmy Carter undermines U.S. foreign policy and the nation at large on an every day basis. This guy continually trivializes the mission of US service men and women and directly helps insurgent enemies by repeating fallacious propaganda as fact, from sources such as Al-Jazeera. Jimmy Carter helped the North Korean dictator Kim Jong-Il acquire light-water nuclear reactors if they promised not to make nuclear weapons. This fool claimed he was "friendship-building". Please don't tell me you think he's smart. Jimmy basically got hoodwinked. And Jimmy's ignorance brought even more instability to that region and may have directly jeapardized our entire national security. Definitely the Japanese and their national security. Jimmy Carter makes friends with the likes of Hugo Chavez, Fidel Castro, the late Yasser Arafat, etc. And have you heard some of the stuff he says when he's in their presence?!?!?!

Jimmy Carter gave away the Panama Canal with absolutely no benefit to the USA. This waterway was a key national security asset. And because of Carter...our ability to shift key equipment and naval assets rapidly from one ocean to the other has been greatly diminished. That hurts our national security priorities.

And if you only care about domestic issues, and not about national security, don't you just miss the 21% inflation, high unemployment, gas lines, and incredibly low growth rates? Misery Index anyone? For those who may remember?

Because of these things, Mr. Carter does not deserve a submarine named after him. Actually if you want to name a sub after him you should call it the USS Appeaser for the way he likes to deal with terrorists and human rights abusing dictators.

[XabbaRus]

Interesting.

Hang on didn't GWB dodge the draft?

Seems Carter wanted peace not war and went about it in a different way. Teh stuff I have read about him seems to me he is a decent man.

[Umfuld]

I call em' like I see em'.

That way of thinking works better with your eyes actually open. But whatever you gotta tell yourself.

[Sea Demon]

Originally Posted by Umfuld

That way of thinking works better with your eyes actually open. But whatever you gotta tell yourself.

Well, the only problem is he actually does and did the things listed. And his domestic record is actually what I listed.

And wanting peace is one thing. But as we've seen throughout history, appeasement only emboldens tyrants, dictators, and terrorists. Jimmy never opened his eyes to that reality.

[Umfuld]

You guys remind me of those idiots who wanted to arrest the cast of Archie Bunker for helping the Viet Cong.

Hi. Welcome to America. Most of us here aren't sexually aroused by the thought of war.

Believe it or not.

[CB..]

and if Carter's attempt to free the hostages hadn't ended up in disaster
what then --

[Sea Demon]

Originally Posted by Umfuld

You guys remind me of those idiots who wanted to arrest the cast of Archie Bunker for helping the Viet Cong.

Hi. Welcome to America. Most of us here aren't sexually aroused by the thought of war.

Believe it or not.

Who mentioned that they were aroused by the thought of war?!?!?:hmm: I've re-read this topic and haven't seen anyone glorifying war in any way. I've only mentioned how Jimmy Carter has totally undermined us and continues to do so, and you talk of sexual arousal?!?!

Maybe you need to get out more......or get a girlfriend or something. J/K

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

Interesting.

Hang on didn't GWB dodge the draft?

No GWB joined the Air National Guard.

[LoBlo]

Originally Posted by Sea Demon

Jimmy Carter gave away the Panama Canal with absolutely no benefit to the USA. This waterway was a key national security asset. And because of Carter...our ability to shift key equipment and naval assets rapidly from one ocean to the other has been greatly diminished. That hurts our national security priorities.

Not really, the size of current US Navy ships outgrew the Canal decades ago. It was useful during early stages of the navy when ships had smaller displacements but whenever sizes and dimensions started to grow toward their current sizes the waterway quickly became insufficient iirc Its one of the reasons why the US now sustains sperate Atlantic and Pacific fleets, iirc

I'll never slam on someone that's won a Nobel Peace Prize. You won't accomplish 1/10th of what he's accomplished in your lifetime.

[Bort]

Hey you guys lay off JC. Jimmy Carter was a good decent man who, as president, was overwhelmed by the events of the times. Whatever you may say about his abilities as president, his honor, courage and patriotism are beyond question. Besides, one only has to look at the candidates in the 76 election to see that, for all his faults, Carter was indeed the best choice at the time.

Bravo! Couldn't have said it better myself, August. While I personally find the current practice of naming ships after living people abhorrent, if that is what we're gonna do, than Mr. Carter deserves the honor just as much as anyone else. I hate it when people demonize Carter like he was the liberal equivalent of Hitler or something, he was well meaning, actually had some pretty good ideas, and was as honest and moral as can be. Do I disagree with some of the decisions he made, of course, but that should not lead to ragging on someone who is by all means a great American. Plus, he was a bubblehead, give him some credit!

[August]

Originally Posted by CB..

and if Carter's attempt to free the hostages hadn't ended up in disaster
what then --

Exactly. He'd have been a shoe in for a two term president and remembered as the guy who pulled the country out of the malaise of the late 70s into the economic boom of the 80s.

[August]

Originally Posted by *[FOX]* Bort

Bravo! Couldn't have said it better myself, August. While I personally find the current practice of naming ships after living people abhorrent, if that is what we're gonna do, than Mr. Carter deserves the honor just as much as anyone else. I hate it when people demonize Carter like he was the liberal equivalent of Hitler or something, he was well meaning, actually had some pretty good ideas, and was as honest and moral as can be. Do I disagree with some of the decisions he made, of course, but that should not lead to ragging on someone who is by all means a great American. Plus, he was a bubblehead, give him some credit!

What i think many people, especially Europeans, don't realize is the power of the US Presidency is far less encompassing than they think. The real power is, and has always been, the Congress. They're the ones who really set the national policy. They're the ones who pass laws, they're the ones who hold the national purse strings. The President is more a lightening rod and a goad for their actions.

[DeepSix]

Originally Posted by August

What i think many people, especially Europeans, don't realize is the power of the US Presidency is far less encompassing than they think. The real power is, and has always been, the Congress. They're the ones who really set the national policy. They're the ones who pass laws, they're the ones who hold the national purse strings. The President is more a lightening rod and a goad for their actions.

Right on. There is real power in the presidency, but most of American life and law is characterized by the actions of Congress - and over multiple decades, not a single administration (or even two).

[XabbaRus]

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

No GWB joined the Air National Guard.

But wasn't that so he could dodge being sent to Nam....same with Dick Cheney didn't he avoid going somehow.

About draft dodging I find American's attitudes to it interesting. On the one hand I can understand it cos many did draft and get killed but on the other hand Vietnam was a horrific war and trying to dodge the draft the sanest thing out. Just like in Russia, many dodge the draft cos they don't want to end up dead in Checnya or beaten to a pulp by their superiors...they aren't villified.

Maybe I have missed something though. What would your opinion be of someone who honestly said "I dodged the draft cos I did't want to go to Nam." ?

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by XabbaRus

But wasn't that so he could dodge being sent to Nam....

He could have been sent to Vietnam. Although he was assigned to fly interceptors (F-102 Delta Daggers) and aircraft of that type were sent to Vietnam as a guardsman he was less likely to be sent to war since back then the National Guard was a rearguard type unit, do you think its wise to send less trained guardsmen pilots in to combat guarding B-52s and defending agaist Il-28 raids? My dad joined the US Navy durring the Vietnam War and was assigned to a non-combat role stateside, does that mean he dodged the draft/Vietnam Service? :hmm: