[WIP] Soviet Campaign (North Atlantic 1984)

[ForumsTerrorist]

Originally Posted by jonass

Only Russian sub that I can play with some confidence is the Sierra (noiselvl 125). The rest are a pain and are very easily detected by nmy escorts and subs.

Only way (imho) to be competetive at a reasonable lvl is to alter the "SelfNoise=" setting inte appropriate vessel .txt file in the D:\Your game installation path\MODS\ColdWatersSovietCampaignRev1.01\ColdWate rs_Data\StreamingAssets\override\vessels

For example. Victor III is at SelfNoise=137, Los Angeles is at 115 and Narwhal at 105. Huge difference.

I play the Victor III and set SelfNoise to 125 which makes it (according to my skill lvl) competetive enough. Sure, somewhat harder than a fairly modern US sub (since hydrophones etc are worse as well) but that is how I want it.

Cheers

Maybe, in the same way it's possible to play the Narwhal, we could add the lone Victor II, K-467, that was a testbed (my guess) for the later tandem screw used on the Victor IIIs?

http://imgur.com/a/t6UjU

Admittedly I'm unsure when it had it, but given that supposedly the Soviets rarely changed the screws on existing hulls it's possible it had it during 1984. If the game ever adds proper diesel-electric mechanics then we could just add the various holes in the water the Soviets made. :v Also, if or when it's possible to add 3D models, other novelties that could be added would be the Papa class (ancestor to the Alfa, and still the fastest submarine ever built) in the 1968 campaign, and the Mike class (a combat capable technology testbed; kind of a proto-Akula?) in 1984.

[The Bandit]

Originally Posted by ForumsTerrorist

Maybe, in the same way it's possible to play the Narwhal, we could add the lone Victor II, K-467, that was a testbed (my guess) for the later tandem screw used on the Victor IIIs?

http://imgur.com/a/t6UjU

Admittedly I'm unsure when it had it, but given that supposedly the Soviets rarely changed the screws on existing hulls it's possible it had it during 1984. If the game ever adds proper diesel-electric mechanics then we could just add the various holes in the water the Soviets made. :v Also, if or when it's possible to add 3D models, other novelties that could be added would be the Papa class (ancestor to the Alfa, and still the fastest submarine ever built) in the 1968 campaign, and the Mike class (a combat capable technology testbed; kind of a proto-Akula?) in 1984.

great link, had an interesting time reading it and I didn't know that the tandem screws weren't contra-rotating.

I agree with you that Victor II is probably the Soviet equivalent to the USS Jack, which trialed contra-roatating screws for the USN (somewhat unsuccessfully due to the weight of her direct drive sapping most of the efficiency, but she did keep the setup for her whole service life).

Papa would have JUST been launched in December of 68 and had a hell of a test process to go through (didn't commission until December 69). The Papa and the Alfa after it were way more anti-carrier platforms than anything else but I don't think there was a torpedo in existence that could catch the Papa in that time period.

Mike, being titanium is sort of a different ball of wax than the Akula and sort of like an Alfa successor in terms of automation and design concepts. Out of all the titanium boats the Mike was the first one that was really stressed for deep diving, and while I don't think she had any problems there, its my understanding the conclusion that was reached was that there wasn't as much value as you would think to diving that deep. I mean it likely could escape some / most / all-non nuclear weapons of the day but it wasn't any more stealthy (hit 3000ft. and then disappear) so basically not worth the trouble vs. how hard it was to construct a boat that could dive that deep.

[ForumsTerrorist]

Originally Posted by The Bandit

great link, had an interesting time reading it and I didn't know that the tandem screws weren't contra-rotating.

I agree with you that Victor II is probably the Soviet equivalent to the USS Jack, which trialed contra-roatating screws for the USN (somewhat unsuccessfully due to the weight of her direct drive sapping most of the efficiency, but she did keep the setup for her whole service life).

Papa would have JUST been launched in December of 68 and had a hell of a test process to go through (didn't commission until December 69). The Papa and the Alfa after it were way more anti-carrier platforms than anything else but I don't think there was a torpedo in existence that could catch the Papa in that time period.

Mike, being titanium is sort of a different ball of wax than the Akula and sort of like an Alfa successor in terms of automation and design concepts. Out of all the titanium boats the Mike was the first one that was really stressed for deep diving, and while I don't think she had any problems there, its my understanding the conclusion that was reached was that there wasn't as much value as you would think to diving that deep. I mean it likely could escape some / most / all-non nuclear weapons of the day but it wasn't any more stealthy (hit 3000ft. and then disappear) so basically not worth the trouble vs. how hard it was to construct a boat that could dive that deep.

The Mike's basically where you see the transition between the Sierra and the Akula, it's worth including for the novelty alone I think. Fair point on the Papa though, I didn't catch that it just misses the bus on 1968. Maybe 1984, a la RSR? :v

Somewhat related: while looking for what sonar the Mike had (Shark Gill, same as the other attack boats of that era), I found this: https://translate.google.com/transla...oruzhenie.html Supposedly, it's the Russian perspective on the effectiveness of their sonars and the acoustic performance of American submarines. Given the Russian interest in selling submarines, take it with a grain of salt, but still interesting.

[denis_469]

Originally Posted by ForumsTerrorist

...and the Mike class (a combat capable technology testbed; kind of a proto-Akula?) in 1984.

Mike was not testbed for Akula class. It is first very deep diving submarine. After would be start more submarines, but USSR collapse and more submarines not building. It is submarine project 685. Main feature is very very big deep diving. Operational depth is 1027 meters or 3369 feet, safe depth is 1250 meters or 4101 feet and crush depth 1400 meters or 4593 feet. Mike was titanian submarine with very large depth for torpedo firing is 800 meters or 2624 feet. But in it depth can use USET-80 torpedoes. Depth USET-80 torpedoes was projected for launch from very depth submarine like "K-278" project 685. Project operational depth for submarine was 1000 meters and USET-80 have depth 1000 meters like.
During building "K-278" was testing in depth 1600 meters. Every compatment testing in this depth and after it submarine building.
In depth 800 meters and more submarine can not finding anti-submarine sensors so was below few thermal layers. In this depth was not cavitation or other hydrodynamic sounds. Submarine can have full speed without rise sound level.
Have superstels speed so have 2 electric motors and can speed 5 knots in electric motors in very large depth.
During 1980 years in world was not anti-submarine weapons what can hit "K-278" in open ocean. Soviet torpedo "USET-80" was deep diving in world and have 1000 meters.
It was ideal submarine in this time...

[Kapitan]

Originally Posted by denis_469

Mike was not testbed for Akula class. It is first very deep diving submarine. After would be start more submarines, but USSR collapse and more submarines not building. It is submarine project 685. Main feature is very very big deep diving. Operational depth is 1027 meters or 3369 feet, safe depth is 1250 meters or 4101 feet and crush depth 1400 meters or 4593 feet. Mike was titanian submarine with very large depth for torpedo firing is 800 meters or 2624 feet. But in it depth can use USET-80 torpedoes. Depth USET-80 torpedoes was projected for launch from very depth submarine like "K-278" project 685. Project operational depth for submarine was 1000 meters and USET-80 have depth 1000 meters like.
During building "K-278" was testing in depth 1600 meters. Every compatment testing in this depth and after it submarine building.
In depth 800 meters and more submarine can not finding anti-submarine sensors so was below few thermal layers. In this depth was not cavitation or other hydrodynamic sounds. Submarine can have full speed without rise sound level.
Have superstels speed so have 2 electric motors and can speed 5 knots in electric motors in very large depth.
During 1980 years in world was not anti-submarine weapons what can hit "K-278" in open ocean. Soviet torpedo "USET-80" was deep diving in world and have 1000 meters.
It was ideal submarine in this time...

Seconded the Mike is no prototype it is a completely stand alone class of vessel like the Project 661 Anchar or Papa class (which is pretty much a titanium hulled Charlie class in looks)

Project 685 Plavnik Mike class still holds the world record for deepest diving military submarine

as for linar succession the Project 671 RTK or Victor III were Succeeded by the Akula Project 971

As for the deeper you go sound still travels like the jet stream there is a thermal layer called the deep sound channel which was discovered by Dr Robert Ballard from Woodshole Oceanographic reasearch Laboratory.

[denis_469]

Originally Posted by Kapitan

Seconded the Mike is no prototype it is a completely stand alone class of vessel like the Project 661 Anchar or Papa class (which is pretty much a titanium hulled Charlie class in looks)

Project 685 Plavnik Mike class still holds the world record for deepest diving military submarine

as for linar succession the Project 671 RTK or Victor III were Succeeded by the Akula Project 971

As for the deeper you go sound still travels like the jet stream there is a thermal layer called the deep sound channel which was discovered by Dr Robert Ballard from Woodshole Oceanographic reasearch Laboratory.

Mike submarine (or project 685) was first very deep diving submarine with more then 1000 meters. After it must be go project 954 with diving depth 1400 meters (operational), but USSR collapse and no one submarine project 954 was not building.

In large depth have few thermal layers and few sound channels. But USA not know about so have not submarine with large depth diving.

[Kapitan]

The deep sound channel was a test conducted of the west coast of Australia where a series of charges were let off in a certain sequence they rounded the Cape horn and were detected 6 hours later in the Bermuda listening station by SOSUS.

SOSUS led to the finding of USS Scorpion it also led the USN and CIA to K129 in the pacific with Project Jennifer and Azorian, SOSUS also tracked the 4 foxtrot submarines heading to Cuba in 1962 plus the two other November class submarines sent from the Med, and this is all from sea floor microphones.

However in Operation Atrina in the 80's the Americans did have serious issues finding the 5 victor III sent out from the Northern Flota 4 were found after 8 days while they were on thier way home after completing thier tasks.

The 5th under the command of captain 1st rank Victor Alikov (dubbed by the west as the prince of darkness) was never discovered

[aaken]

Mod updated to ver 1.03

- Reduced height of ownship icon on Condition display. Now bottom of ownship indicates depth of your boat
- Fixed problem with Charlie 1 and Charlie 2 damage control panels not showing
- Added missions to locate and sink Carrier group in both 1984 and 1968 campaigns

link at first page of thread

[ForumsTerrorist]

So after getting ripped apart by ASROC delivered Mark 46s for the 5th or so time, I took a peep in the weapons.txt since it felt like my usual torpedo dodging tactics weren't working. There's only one, and it has a seeker range of 2000 yards. This seems a little generous for 1984 (http://www.navysite.de/weapons/mk-46.htm has the Mod 5 at 1600 yards seeker range) but it's crazy for the 68 campaign (the Mod 1 that would have seen duty in 68 has a seeker range of 460 meters, or ~503 yards according to http://weaponsystems.net/weaponsyste...20Mk%2046.html).

Take those sources with the usual grain of salt, but 500 yards feels much more in line with general torpedo seeker capabilities in the 1960s.