New Cold Waters Screenshots - Page 2

ETR3(SS) · 05-24-17, 01:15 PM

The best option for making it vanilla in my opinion would be to bring it out if/when they make a soviet campaign. Also, I agree with your comment about platform references next to the names. I had a hard time remembering what platform a given name was even when I was in the Navy.

ikalugin · 05-24-17, 02:00 PM

Quote:

I had a hard time remembering what platform a given name was even when I was in the Navy.

You mean class names or names of specific platforms?

Julhelm · 05-25-17, 08:50 AM

Actually the unit reference does use the soviet terminology, since it is much easier to understand the roles of the ships.

05-25-17, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julhelm

Actually the unit reference does use the soviet terminology, since it is much easier to understand the roles of the ships.

No word on adding designations next to the class?

Julhelm · 05-25-17, 11:28 AM

The unit reference/museum has the sovit designations. Large anti-submarine ship, patrol ship, military transport etc.

05-25-17, 11:37 AM

I was talking about this...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

One suggestion.
Can you guys add the class designations at the end of each class?

For example Los Angeles SSN, Grisha III FF and so on.
Personally, I would have to research what a Leninskiy Komsomol is.

Julhelm · 05-25-17, 12:00 PM

I don't understand. All you have to do in the game is visit this page, where you can view every object in the game and it tells you exactly what it is, like so:

I even wrote detailed descriptions for each entry, which is more than you get in contemporary sims like SH3-5:

05-25-17, 12:09 PM

That's awesome. But having to look in some library, interrupting gameplay, doesn't strike me as a good idea. That info should be available at once.

Here's my reasoning.
As a skipper it is ultimately more important to know "Ok, this is a frigate, over there is a merchant, and this contact is some ssn" rather than "oh, this is the (insert Russian name)... I guess it's a cargo vessel? I wouldn't know..."

Situational awareness is key, I assume in your game as well?

Julhelm · 05-25-17, 12:18 PM

You can't get there in mid gameplay, so instead you can go there after doing a couple of tutorials, look through all of the units, familiarize yourself with them and so on. The thing with western designations for soviet ships is that they don't really work, because the soviet roles are completely different. What you really want to know is who has SS-N-14? Who has VDS? Who has the more capable sonar set? Class designations won't tell you that.

Btw, all of you guys have spent lots of time learning the ins and outs of the various platforms in DW. Surely you can learn a few ships by name.

05-25-17, 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julhelm

You can't get there in mid gameplay

Which makes it even worse, and underlines the usefulness of the suggested feature even more.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julhelm

The thing with western designations for soviet ships is that they don't really work, because the soviet roles are completely different. What you really want to know is who has SS-N-14? Who has VDS? Who has the more capable sonar set? Class designations won't tell you that.

Btw, all of you guys have spent lots of time learning the ins and outs of the various platforms in DW. Surely you can learn a few ships by name.

Arguable.
While the Russians have different approaches, that doesn't render it into "not working" for NATO designations - otherwise why does the NATO still use them? Bureaucracy?
Russians designate their Typhoon-class submarines as "TK", which means heavy cruiser if I am not mistaken.
NATO stamps SSBN on it, because, well, it is an SSBN, a nuclear submarine with ballistic missiles, and that's what matters initially.

Priority:
1. What type am I facing? (SSN, FFG, CG, ...)
2. What class am I facing? (Specific systems)

Of course, that is only my opinion, but as you see other veteran players agree that the NATO designations are a good idea... actually I don't see how they cannot be in a game where you control NATO vessels.
Makes no sense to me.
Additionally, not having these designations instantly make it appear somewhat... arcadeish.

However: Your game, your call, I'm out.

PS: Quite easy to lure some new screenshots out of you!

Julhelm · 05-25-17, 01:17 PM

I guess Fast Attack was arcadish too since its plot didn't have type designations either?

05-25-17, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julhelm

I guess Fast Attack was arcadish too since its plot didn't have type designations either?

No - but that proves that FA wasn't perfect in every way.

Listen, I made a suggestion as an avid naval gamer. Others seem to like it.
Do it, ignore it. Your call.
I'm looking forward to your game either way and I'm sure it will be great.
No need for a debate.

FPSchazly · 05-25-17, 01:44 PM

I personally like the idea. I thought SSN or DW did this, but it seems like they didn't. Maybe for the warships, it's easier to remember what they are. But seeing classes like Boris Chilikin or Ivan Rogov, it's hard to remember exactly what they are.

05-25-17, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPSchazly

I personally like the idea. I thought SSN or DW did this, but it seems like they didn't. Maybe for the warships, it's easier to remember what they are. But seeing classes like Boris Chilikin or Ivan Rogov, it's hard to remember exactly what they are.

SSN is an arcade game anyways, but DW sure does man.
(upper left?)

Julhelm · 05-25-17, 02:05 PM

SSN isn't as arcade as it looks. When you go up against the more capable enemies like Akulas and Kilos it can be very challenging. Its main shortcomings were the poorly done surface forces and helicopters which always felt like they didn't have time to complete those features.

In fact, I liked SSN so much and it did so much right that it is one of the major influences on Cold Waters; the others being Red Storm Rising and Fast Attack.

Also, the reason the designations are not there is because none of the sub games that influenced us had them, and so it never occured to us. We've also had to shorten the unit names anyway to fit our minimalist GUI, and I have about 10gb worth of UI concepts to not want to redesign it again.

05-24-17, 01:15 PM	#16
ETR3(SS) Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Between test depth and periscope depth Posts: 3,021 Downloads: 175 Uploads: 16	The best option for making it vanilla in my opinion would be to bring it out if/when they make a soviet campaign. Also, I agree with your comment about platform references next to the names. I had a hard time remembering what platform a given name was even when I was in the Navy. __________________ USS Kentucky SSBN 737 (G) Comms Div 2003-2006 Qualified 19 November 03 Yes I was really on a submarine.

05-25-17, 01:44 PM	#28
FPSchazly Good Hunting! Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Beantown Posts: 776 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 1	I personally like the idea. I thought SSN or DW did this, but it seems like they didn't. Maybe for the warships, it's easier to remember what they are. But seeing classes like Boris Chilikin or Ivan Rogov, it's hard to remember exactly what they are. __________________ Your friendly neighborhood modern submarine YouTuber. My videos: Exclusive Look at Modern Naval Warfare! Dangerous Waters Liu Doctrine (LwAmi Learn to play Dangerous Waters

05-25-17, 08:50 AM	#18
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 693 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	Actually the unit reference does use the soviet terminology, since it is much easier to understand the roles of the ships.

05-25-17, 11:28 AM	#20
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 693 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	The unit reference/museum has the sovit designations. Large anti-submarine ship, patrol ship, military transport etc.

05-25-17, 12:00 PM	#22
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 693 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	I don't understand. All you have to do in the game is visit this page, where you can view every object in the game and it tells you exactly what it is, like so: I even wrote detailed descriptions for each entry, which is more than you get in contemporary sims like SH3-5:

05-25-17, 12:09 PM	#23
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	That's awesome. But having to look in some library, interrupting gameplay, doesn't strike me as a good idea. That info should be available at once. Here's my reasoning. As a skipper it is ultimately more important to know "Ok, this is a frigate, over there is a merchant, and this contact is some ssn" rather than "oh, this is the (insert Russian name)... I guess it's a cargo vessel? I wouldn't know..." Situational awareness is key, I assume in your game as well?

05-25-17, 12:18 PM	#24
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 693 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	You can't get there in mid gameplay, so instead you can go there after doing a couple of tutorials, look through all of the units, familiarize yourself with them and so on. The thing with western designations for soviet ships is that they don't really work, because the soviet roles are completely different. What you really want to know is who has SS-N-14? Who has VDS? Who has the more capable sonar set? Class designations won't tell you that. Btw, all of you guys have spent lots of time learning the ins and outs of the various platforms in DW. Surely you can learn a few ships by name.

05-25-17, 01:17 PM	#26
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 693 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	I guess Fast Attack was arcadish too since its plot didn't have type designations either?

05-25-17, 02:05 PM	#30
Julhelm Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The Icy North Posts: 693 Downloads: 189 Uploads: 0	SSN isn't as arcade as it looks. When you go up against the more capable enemies like Akulas and Kilos it can be very challenging. Its main shortcomings were the poorly done surface forces and helicopters which always felt like they didn't have time to complete those features. In fact, I liked SSN so much and it did so much right that it is one of the major influences on Cold Waters; the others being Red Storm Rising and Fast Attack. Also, the reason the designations are not there is because none of the sub games that influenced us had them, and so it never occured to us. We've also had to shorten the unit names anyway to fit our minimalist GUI, and I have about 10gb worth of UI concepts to not want to redesign it again.